Dead engine sailing

[zoidberg]

I'm both troubled and amused at the regular recycling of 'How do I manage with a dead engine' type threads.
People seem indoctrinated into the belief that that's an Emergency, and that they need Urgent Assistance before it becomes a Tragedy.

Who here has sailed onto a mooring/into a berth/alongside a pontoon or quay? Who hasn't, and would get their twisters in a knick should the need arise? Shouldn't it be a mandatory part of the skillset, just as 'parallel parking' and reversing is with car driving?

 

[Neeves]

Many, most, all marinas will not allow you to sail to your pontoon berth - and certainly not flying a spinnaker as you enter the marina waters.

Spoil sports.

I did it once. This was in a new marina in HK, it was not full. The bar was at the entrance to the marina it was early evening and I was younger then (and showing off). I carefully thought through the sequence of actions I had to take, I was single handed. I arranged all the lines, sheets, guy, halyards etc carefully. I laid the mooring lines that I would need along the side decks.

It all worked flawlessly.

The berth was a blow off berth and there was nothing on the other side. I stepped onto the pontoon, wandered casually amidships and took the bow and stern lines tp gently restrain the yacht

to discover I had not attached them to the yacht - I had the 2 lines but the yacht was now too far away to grab

The thought was I'd have to swim.

Sanity crept in and I continued my saunter to the opposite berth as if this was all intentional.

By this time the audience in the bar had lost interest - as nothing untoward had happened.

Jonathan

 

[Poignard]

I don't think sailing within the confines of a marina is something the average sailor could be expected to do. Too many things could go wrong.

To develop that level of skill you would have to be doing it very often and it's unlikely the marina authorities would permit it.

If you can't use your engine then you would have to arrange a tow, or try and warp yourself in but that might also cause havoc in a busy marina if you are running lines across the channels.

I have moved my boat in a well-spaced out marina using my inflatable lashed alongside and someone in it operating the outboard but that was in a private club marina, on a quiet day, when the staff were not on duty to tow me with their dory.

But sailing on/off a mooring, or from an anchorage, or coming alongside an pontoon with easy access is a different thing, and being able to do so gives you a sense of reassurance.

 

[veshengro]

The elderly Watermota Sea panther engine in my Nic 32 gave up the ghost completely as I entered an anchorage at Carloforte in Isola Di Sanpietro, some years ago. As soon as the hook went down the Harbour Master, or some official bod, arrived in a launch and ordered me into the shiney new marina. It was then I found out anchoring was no longer permitted, although I had anchored there on a previous voyage.
If you know the cost of Italian marina fees in that part of Italy in the summer you will understand why I chose not to stay and effect engine repairs.
Spain seemed favourite, so I weighed and set off back through the strait between Espalmador and Ibizia, bound for Denia.
All went well, absolutely no problems, until I encountered the Balearic-Mainland ferry just before dusk. They obviously have a different version of Col Regs and I found myself helpless in light airs directly in his path. It was then that I sorely missed my engine...
A cheap mega bright hand held lantern/torch from Ebay saved my bacon when I lit up the Ferry's wheelhouse windows and he missed me by a good boat's length...
Sailing into Denia Marina was interesting, I didn't manage to sail into a berth but laid her alongside (gently) a big posh Motor Yacht which was fortunately festooned with fenders on her outboard side, and I have to say I was assisted by a very helpful and understanding German owner who took my mooring ropes for me.

I'm game for sail only between anchorages or even a mooring bouy, given plenty of room, but crowded marinas or places overflowing with water traffic frighten me these days.

 

[KeelsonGraham]

I dread to think how much damage would be done if people tried sailing into their berths in QA!. I, for one, wouldn’t dream of it. Anchor or moor off and then call for the marina boat is really the only sensible option.

 

[blush2]

A good few years ago we motored out of the entrance to the Hamble, raising the sails as we went, turned off the engine and off we went, only for a large cloud of smoke to come out of the cabin.

To cut a long story short, the cable to the engine had chafed through and shorted out. After making all safe we turned round and sailed back to Warsash SC where we were members and luckily the pontoon was empty so we sailed alongside with no damage done.

We waited for the tide to slacken and sailed up river to our pile mooring under jib, knowing that when we got there the joining line was on our dory so easy to pick up. However, we hadn't quite got there when the wind died.

Did you know that you can row a thirty footer quite easily with the oars from a dory tied to the toerails?

 

[Daydream believer]

A couple of weeks ago , on the way to Ostend, my engine blew up. I was motoring against the wind to get to the Longsand head at LW.
To make matters worse I became seasick when trying to see what the issue was, as the boat went broadside to a 750mm chop, thus rolling violently. I had to sail back 20 miles, mainly against the tide, to Bradwell . Being ill I sailed under jib only, as I was unfit to hoist the mainsail.
I rang a friend & asked him to meet me at my launch mooring, in St Lawrence Bay, to take me ashore, so I could later use my launch to tow the yacht into Bradwell. I though that being ill my best chance was to pick up my mooring buoy.

By the time I reached Bradwell, I had recovered enough & the wind was up the chuff so I decided to have a go at sailing into the berth under bare poles, or nearly furled jib. (it was blowing 15-18kts from astern). However, my mate had arranged with the marina to tow me in. They were watching for me to sail past the baffle. So I did not have to bother. But I was up for it.
I did sail into Bradwell some years ago, when I had run out of fuel, but my son was with me & we managed Ok. It was at first light & no one watching.

It is not that hard, so long as no one gets in the way. I had my horn ready to give them a blast & wake them up. I have had instances, when coming to my berth & some idiot has decided to back out right in front of me, requiring an emergency stop. A few rapid blasts usually wakes them up & the resulting panic can produce some amusing (not for them) results.

If one goes to Ostend, one will see the Dragons sail in & out of the marina with ease. Boats sail in & out of French ports all the time. I have watched them do it at Le Havre on a regular basis, as part of the cruiser training.

 

[capnsensible]

I'm both troubled and amused at the regular recycling of 'How do I manage with a dead engine' type threads.
People seem indoctrinated into the belief that that's an Emergency, and that they need Urgent Assistance before it becomes a Tragedy.

Who here has sailed onto a mooring/into a berth/alongside a pontoon or quay? Who hasn't, and would get their twisters in a knick should the need arise? Shouldn't it be a mandatory part of the skillset, just as 'parallel parking' and reversing is with car driving?

One of sailings great pleasure as a coach is demonstrating, then helping, sailing school students with 'use the sails to control the yacht in a confined space'.

There is always a few places an instructor will have up their sleeve where this is achievable. When there is breeze. And generally early evening when other water traffic is generally quieter.

Plus, of course, being the coach and doing this hundreds of times makes you good.

Quite handy when an intransigent engine has a sulk.

 

[Wansworth]

There lots that can be done like anchour ing in the proximity and rowing ashore a line,all takes time and a knowledge of what the tide is doing,the wind etc which I am sure members over a certain age …….know what they are

 

[newtothis]

Have sailed on and off pontoons, but not in a marina. Anchored, picked up buoys and sailed off anchor.
I know sailing into a marina berth can be done - I saw some footage of a race crew come in under full main and jib, dropping everything to perfection - but I can't afford that level of insurance.
But if under duress, there's usually a hammerhead at a marina that I could tie up to and then warp into a berth after that.

 

[Poignard]

There lots that can be done like anchour ing in the proximity and rowing ashore a line,all takes time and a knowledge of what the tide is doing,the wind etc which I am sure members over a certain age …….know what they are

Members even older might remember when there were watermen about who would take a line ashore for a small tip!

 

[Wansworth]

Members even older might remember when there were watermen about who would take a line ashore for a small tip!

Yes,shame it’s all gone.

 

[doug748]

I have started the engine three times this season, been off the mooring maybe 8/10? times. A suitable boat helps, plus a certain amount of panache and a mooring that is not too constricted.
Many local racing boats sail on and off. Always great to see the working boats in Falmouth thundering up to their moorings.

Never sailed in a marina but did once come alongside a long outside pontoon,, years ago.
.

 

[LittleSister]

I quite enjoy sailing on and off moorings and pontoons, and when laying or raising the anchor, and benefitted from some training in this when I did an RYACoastal Skipper course many years ago.

All came in handy when some years ago the engine failed on the way from the Blackwater to the Orwell in a Cornish Crabber I'd borrowed from a friend, with just me and an inexperienced girlfriend aboard. It was getting dark as we arrived and I anchored just upstream of Shotley for the night. The next day I was wary of calling a marina to seek a workboat to bring us in as I was very short of money, and I reckoned Woolverstone would be the easiest I knew to sail into. The wind was very light and it took most of the day to get up the river to there, but on arrival we were lucky to find one of the external hammerheads unoccupied and sailing onto it was no problem at all. As the engine problem turned out to be terminal (Volspec did very well out of that visit!) and it took a while to sort, the marina later moved the boat - at no charge beyond the mooring fees - to the back of the marina, where the tiddlers are parked, to keep the hammerhead free for big boats.

On another occasion, I had an engine determindly refuse to start after staying the night on a buoy at Lyme Regis, on the way back from Brittany to Lymington. I had to be back at work soon and so we pressed on and had a slow, tiring and somewhat exciting sail back to the Solent. Winds were very light and failed completely just off the tip of Portland Bill on the inside passage, we lost steering way and ended up departing the Bill backwards, and then spiralled through the Shambles Bank overfalls - fortunately it was only the tail end of the tide and calm weather but still very bouncy. We then spent much of the night just about stemming the tide somewhere off St Aldhelms Head, during which we came close to being run down by a tug with ship in tow, which had turned towards us and we had too little speed to get out of the way (lifejackets on and ready to bail out close!). Then calamity of calamities, we ran out of tea bags! Rested at anchor in Studland Bay, then plugged on to Lymington. On arrival there I decided not to attempt to get back on our tightly-packed fore-and-aft mooring (challenging even with an engine in our long-keeler), and so was going to sail into the marina. Foolishly, though, I helped put out fenders while I was steering, and thus distracted put us on the mud on a falling tide. Couldn't get us off with the kedge, so called for a tow into the marina, who told us there were no workboat staff available. Resigned to sitting it out we put the kettle on, but lo and behold a workboat arrived after all, and we were towed in. Such was my relief, being extremely tired by that point, I later bought the chap in the workboat, who'd delayed or forgone his break to come out, a bottle of Scotch.

Much as marinas don't want people sailing around in them unnecessarily, I'm sure most would understand people sailing in if they'd lost their engine power, no workboat was available, and they weren't attempting something likely to cause problems or damage, which in turn would depend on the crew's skills and the layout and available spaces in the marina.

 

[johnalison]

I can understand marinas instituting a no-sailing rule given the difficulty many people seem to have even with a working engine. On the other hand, it is something that any self-respecting sailor ought to be able to do with ease. I would recommend a week on the Broads in an engineless boat, the bigger the better. After many years racing Fireflies and doing the Broads it never crossed my mind that sailing on or off a berth, mooring, or another boat was anything other than normal sailing.

I have only twice sailed into a marina, the last occasion being onto the outer pontoon at Titchmarsh when something caught my prop in the Wallet when motor-sailing against a NE-er. The first occasion was more challenging, when I had to get my Sadler 29 into Tollesbury in a gale, but even this wasn't unduly hard and I tucked into a berth on B. The only thing to watch is avoiding positions that offer no way out of causing damage, keeping control at a low speed, and being prepared to cut it short if things look too hairy.

 

[ProDave]

We had a sail in company with a lunch stop at anchor. Of the 4 boats we were the only one that did not use the engine to drop the anchor or leave it. We just hove to, dropped the anchor, dropped the sails. To leave we set the genoa pulled up the anchor and sailed off. Everyone else started their engines.

 

[jamie N]

Cowes week, I think 1983, I watched this French yacht "Revolution" enter Groves & Gutteridge marina under sail. This is Cowes during an Admirals Cup week, which made it a feasible option for a French skipper only.
The ensuing chaos was fantastic, with no real harm done and plenty of thirsty emotion shown.
I was sailing a J24 and thought coming into G&G was brave with only a Seagull on the back!

 

[johnalison]

The hardest thing I ever did under sail was drop a crew member onto another boat under sail. We had picked up a friend’s teenage daughter from the shore and she needed to get onto her parents’ Sadler 32, from our 29. We set our boats up on a course to windward in a fairly gentle breeze, which was when the fun started. In retrospect, I think we would have managed it more elegantly downwind.

 

[Stemar]

On the other hand, it is something that any self-respecting sailor ought to be able to do with ease.

While I agree with you in theory, have you looked at the size of the berths and the channels to them in the average marina recently? Far too many of them seem to be like supermarket car parks, designed for a Ford Anglia, not a Porsche Cayenne.

I'll be the first to admit I couldn't do it in anything but perfect conditions of wind and tide. I did sail onto my mooring once, several years ago. It went perfectly until it was time to tidy everything up. Just as I stood up in the cockpit, a good gust came in from an odd direction and the boom gave me a good slap round the ear, knocking me flat in the cockpit. Moments later, Madame started to come up from below. She couldn't see me, but she could see my hat in the water, quietly drifting away...

I'm pleased to be able to say her panicked moment had nothing to do with my lack of life insurance, but I've never been allowed to do it again.

 

[johnalison]

While I agree with you in theory, have you looked at the size of the berths and the channels to them in the average marina recently? Far too many of them seem to be like supermarket car parks, designed for a Ford Anglia, not a Porsche Cayenne.

I'll be the first to admit I couldn't do it in anything but perfect conditions of wind and tide. I did sail onto my mooring once, several years ago. It went perfectly until it was time to tidy everything up. Just as I stood up in the cockpit, a good gust came in from an odd direction and the boom gave me a good slap round the ear, knocking me flat in the cockpit. Moments later, Madame started to come up from below. She couldn't see me, but she could see my hat in the water, quietly drifting away...

I'm pleased to be able to say her panicked moment had nothing to do with my lack of life insurance, but I've never been allowed to do it again.

Being struck by the boom is one of those 'never' things that shouldn't happen. I have avoided it myself but an experienced friend was all but KO'd in his then Sadler 25 off Ostend.

I agree that marinas can present insurmountable problems when approaching, even under power in some conditions, but I maintain that a sailor should be able to cope with coming alongside or picking up a mooring under sail in fair conditions and not be afraid to do so. Nothing so embarrassing has ever happened to me though. (Why is my nose getting longer?).