Cutting a hole in the slug - the practical side

dylanwinter

dylanwinter

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 Mar 2005
Messages
12,954
Location
Buckingham
www.keepturningleft.co.uk
I have been on the look out for a small, safe, seaworthy, easily handled , short masted yacht with outboard in a well.

It occurred to me that I should consider removing the beast and cutting an outboard well in the stern of the slug - on the centre line of the boat

this is leaflet for the boat

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/galleries/mirror-offshore-sales-brochure/

you can see the hull here

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/galleries/super-slug/


Could I fit a short shaft engine in there - because it would be great if I could use the honda as a back up and then buy a 5 hp with a charging coil

if so - what should it be?

how much weight would I need to add after removing the beast?

where should it go?


how big does the hole need to be?

what shape should it be?

how much re-enforcing will it need?

It is going to take the full thrust of the 5hp engine - that has to be trasnsmitted to the hull in some way

It needs to have enough air

I already have a round hole with a lid for the upper surface but I do not want to go and weaken the whole of the back of the boat

Will I have to modify the rudder stock to bring the rudder up over the engine?

finally

how much can I flog the beast for?

its entire history has been well catalogued

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/video-logs/vlog-107-damn/

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/video-logs/ktl-vlog-110-grappling-with-the-beast/


and many more such films

too many of them for my liking


Dylan
 
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should! :D

Cutting the hole is the easy bit, making it watertight would be the next challenge. The other downside of the hole is that it will slow you down.

One the plus side, you'll have a fantasic self draining cockpit.

How long is the cockpit? - outboards in well's take up alot of room, also consider where you would put a fuel tank.

Personally I'd live with the disadvantage of having it on the transom, you could fit remotes to it, to make it easier to control.


(I have an outboard in a well on my Seal, its great, apart from the fact that the well is too small for modern 4 stroke engines).
 
I dare say the idea is feasible. About the only major snag I can forsee is that the tiller might not clear the engine cover but it won't be far off

I know you've lost all faith in the beast but I do wonder whether you'd be better served by getting the thing out of the boat and into the hands of a professional engine fitter for a complete refurb

If you decide to go the outboard well route, you're welcome to come and cast an eye over the arrangement on Brigantia - she's somewhat bigger than the Mirror Offshore but it'd give you a measure of how the job might shape up (and the well on Brigantia is as small as a well could be and still take a 5/6 hp 4 stroke outboard ... just!)
 
pessimists

I clearly need to think it through

I am confident I can make something that willl keep the water in the right place

it is getting air where it will be needed and transferring the thrust as a retro fit as opposed to being designed in


Dylan
 
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mogy said:
Read an article about an outboard on a Snapdragon.....didnt like being confined as it ran out of air.
Click to expand...

Any outboard well needs to have adequate ventilation or this can be a problem. It's a basic design fault that is easily overcome

Older 2 strokes that exhaust to air can be a problem also - the old engine on Brigantia was one such but we attached a short length of hose from the above water exhaust outlet on the leg to a skin fitting in the transom to carry the fumes outboard. This worked a treat. Pity the engine didn't! :D (the engine problems were nothing to do with it being in a well and everything to do with it being old and tired)
 
post some snaps

Brigantia said:
I dare say the idea is feasible. About the only major snag I can forsee is that the tiller might not clear the engine cover but it won't be far off

I know you've lost all faith in the beast but I do wonder whether you'd be better served by getting the thing out of the boat and into the hands of a professional engine fitter for a complete refurb

If you decide to go the outboard well route, you're welcome to come and cast an eye over the arrangement on Brigantia - she's somewhat bigger than the Mirror Offshore but it'd give you a measure of how the job might shape up (and the well on Brigantia is as small as a well could be and still take a 5/6 hp 4 stroke outboard ... just!)
Click to expand...

do you have any snaps of the well I could look at

save some miles

D
 
I had an outboard in a well in a Newbridge Navigator. It was really neat but the engine wouldn't run with the lid on-air. With the lid off the well behaved like a sound board or drum- dreadful.

I then had a Pageant with a 'beast' which I rashly had ripped out and dumped. Outboard on the back was quiet- bliss but tricky. I really should have had an engine refit.There was nothing wrong with the boat, just the engine.

I now have a Shrimper with an outboard which sort of sits in an open'ish well. This is a good compromise as there's lots of air, it's easy to access and doesn't reverberate too much.

Really I'd like oars and no engine at all!
 
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Another O/B choking in a well here; the Honda 4 my brother has on his Impala goes all tubercular if you shut the lid, which is a pain as it's really noisy with the lid off. It will probably get a bigger vent hole and a fan fitted to it this year.
 
You wont get hardly anything for the beast mate with a knackered gearbox
interestingly though if you break it you will probably get more in the end
im breaking one at the moment and getting some interest in some of the bits
these engines are old and you cannot get spares any more for them...
 
The very sensible gents who built your boat in the first place probably had a long think about how to best engine her.

No matter how many replies you get on this forum there will be issues you have not considered that will arise during the process if you choose to reconfigure.

I would only consider a like replacement for the current engine or a different boat.

I am pretty sure you will regret a reconfiguration. Compared to your best estimates it will probably take longer, be harder to do, cost more, and not work as well as to think.

On top of all that it may well trash your resale value.

You have been warned.

I reserve the right to say "I told you so"

You can reserve the right to say I was not adventurous enough.

P.S . You can tell me, is this really a serious question ???
 
Don't do it!

Surely you can't scar the Slug Dylan! At the very least the work involved would be horrendous.

Is a re-engine a no go? A lighter engine like a Yanmar 1gm would surely be a better proposition and she might even sail better with less weight.

These challenges are there to be met......and my god do we get them with boats! :rolleyes:
 
solent boy and james

James W said:
Surely you can't scar the Slug Dylan! At the very least the work involved would be horrendous.

Is a re-engine a no go? A lighter engine like a Yanmar 1gm would surely be a better proposition and she might even sail better with less weight.

These challenges are there to be met......and my god do we get them with boats! :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

solent boy

it is a serious option

having cut a hole in the duck punt I am getting a taste for surgery

you are correct about the design - and that does worry me that I might make it even worse and lose a lot of time, invest a lot of effort and end up with a dogs dinner

however, as things stand the slug is almost worthless

maybe £1000 - maybe less

I think with current finances investing £5,000 in a re-engining would be a nonsense - assuming I could find an engine that would fit the Volvo shaped hole and find some-one willing to do the job

although maybe Volvo will offer to do the job to make me shut up about the most publicised unreliable old lump in the history of amatuer sailing

Dylan
 
Before you proceed with such a drastic plan i would get a price for an engine recon. The 'beast' is not such a heavy lump so could be removed fairly easily which you could do yourself (with a bit of help) and deliver to an engine mechanic. Once the engine is out, dismantling would be quite straightforward. The pluses of an inboard diesel far outweigh the minuses.
Good luck anyway.
 
It was probably a very good engine when new you cannot expect them to last forever!
and it may well have been abused by previous owners
i have one in bits it looks like good solid engineering to me.
Btw Volvo penta wont care about about that old thing!
Get a second hand 1gm10 for about £700
plenty of mates on here who could help you im sure
im just too far away
Good luck!
 
happy life

ghostlymoron said:
Before you proceed with such a drastic plan i would get a price for an engine recon. The 'beast' is not such a heavy lump so could be removed fairly easily which you could do yourself (with a bit of help) and deliver to an engine mechanic. Once the engine is out, dismantling would be quite straightforward. The pluses of an inboard diesel far outweigh the minuses.
Good luck anyway.
Click to expand...

it might say something about my charmed life to date

but the times when I have stared down at a non-functioning beast through that bloomin hatch or through the companionway steps have been some of the unhappiest moments of my 57 year long life.

I feel utterly powerless and betrayed by the latest evil the engine has visited upon me and my little ailing project

it is like a friend who has done the dirty on you over and over again - you keep on forgiving them - and they do it again.

how many of you chaps have older engines installations than me.... and would you take them around the UK?
 
Niander said:
Get a second hand 1gm10 for about £700
plenty of mates on here who could help you im sure
im just too far away
Good luck!
Click to expand...

It would make for another good story for the website at the very least!

I'm having engine hassles too, have done for the last 9 months, but am going to stick it out with my "beast" till October then re-engine over a proper winter out. Lots of guys on the forum have given me some great advice about engine fitting, i'm sure someone will be able to help.

Good luck Dylan, hopefully you can get it sorted and get back out on the water soon........and with less stress!
 
still in commission

James W said:
It would make for another good story for the website at the very least!

I'm having engine hassles too, have done for the last 9 months, but am going to stick it out with my "beast" till October then re-engine over a proper winter out. Lots of guys on the forum have given me some great advice about engine fitting, i'm sure someone will be able to help.

Good luck Dylan, hopefully you can get it sorted and get back out on the water soon........and with less stress!
Click to expand...

the boat is still in commission and running

the engine starts and runs - stuck in forward

but I can live with that

I am planning to keep on with it as it is this summer while I explore the Humber and the Tyne - if it packs up I have the Honda - but I do not fancy ending up in some Scottish harbour with a broken engine and no obvious way of getting the journey back under way

I think that running an inboard is beyond my resources

Dylan
 
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