CRINAN CANAL Assisted passage???

[uxb]

[*]I still have a gripe about the costs - I think the canal is overpriced,
[/LIST]

It's cheap at the price!

How much do you think it actually costs to run that canal? The Scottish canals cost around £19 million in total...

(http://www.scottishcanals.co.uk/media/2755138/scot canals annual report 2012_2013.pdf )

 

[AntarcticPilot]

It's cheap at the price!

How much do you think it actually costs to run that canal? The Scottish canals cost around £19 million in total...

(http://www.scottishcanals.co.uk/media/2755138/scot canals annual report 2012_2013.pdf )

I've no idea what it costs, and that isn't the point. The point is, what is the canal worth to me? If you charge more than I think it's worth, then I won't use it as there is a viable, free alternative that takes no more time from most points in the Clyde. And if too many people vote with their feet, then there isn't a viable business model for the Canal. Marketing it as a destination in its own right isn't really on - people use it to get to the spectacular crusing grounds round Mull and Skye.

For those who don't know the area, Ardrishaig (the entrance to the Crinan Canal on the Clyde side) is a day's sail from most locations in the Eastern or southern parts of the Clyde, where most people keep their yachts. Only Tarbert and Portavadie are close enough to avoid that. It is then a day's passage through the canal. It is just as easy to sail south to Campbeltown, Sanda or Gigha, then a day north to the vicinity of Crinan. The navigation is a bit more complex, requiring consideration of tide gates, but no more arduous than working the locks! The canal has the advantage in poor weather conditions such as strong westerlies (which is why it was built in the first place).

If you charged a smaller amount, it might get greater use. Reducing costs for those who are simply using it as a means of getting from Ardrishaig to Crinan without any planned overnight stop (of course, overnight stops imposed by the canal authorities would not count) would, to me, make economic sense and encourage greater use of the canal. As it is, the charges assume people will be staying at least two nights on the canal each way; at least the charges suggest that is the comparison. As you have a limited resource, surely the economic argument is to get people through as quickly as possible, and not encourage people to feel "We've paid all this money, we'll stay on the canal as long as we've paid for"? The provision of assisted passage certainly suggests that the current thinking is to move people through ASAP.

I have sometimes wondered why some enterprising company doesn't offer a portage service from Tarbert to West Loch Tarbert. It's less than two miles, and I'm sure a standard boat hoist, or even a tractor and flat-bed trailer and a hoist at each end could take many yachts a day across. Of course, it would need some investment - the construction of a suitable facility at West Loch Tarbert - and bouyage in West Loch Tarbert. But it ought to be possible to transport a yacht across the Mull of Kintyre at that point in less than an hour. After all, that's why Kintyre is part of the Kingdom of the Isles!

 

[JumbleDuck]

• Three people is ample to get through the canal; all of us (including my wife, who is tiny) could work the locks. Provided you're patient and make wait for the levels to be right, the locks all do work; the trick is not to rush to open the gates.

I think the skipper's guide (and staff) would do well to say that you really only need one person on board but can do with as many people as possible on shore. It's not uncommon to see five people on the boat, faffing around fruitlessly with fenders while one poor sod up above is expected to work paddles and gate on both sides and prepare the next lock.

 

[Trop Cher]

I have sometimes wondered why some enterprising company doesn't offer a portage service from Tarbert to West Loch Tarbert. It's less than two miles, and I'm sure a standard boat hoist, or even a tractor and flat-bed trailer and a hoist at each end could take many yachts a day across. Of course, it would need some investment - the construction of a suitable facility at West Loch Tarbert - and bouyage in West Loch Tarbert. But it ought to be possible to transport a yacht across the Mull of Kintyre at that point in less than an hour. After all, that's why Kintyre is part of the Kingdom of the Isles!

Are you being serious?

 

[uxb]

I have sometimes wondered why some enterprising company doesn't offer a portage service from Tarbert to West Loch Tarbert. It's less than two miles, and I'm sure a standard boat hoist, or even a tractor and flat-bed trailer and a hoist at each end could take many yachts a day across. Of course, it would need some investment - the construction of a suitable facility at West Loch Tarbert - and bouyage in West Loch Tarbert. But it ought to be possible to transport a yacht across the Mull of Kintyre at that point in less than an hour. After all, that's why Kintyre is part of the Kingdom of the Isles!

The roads are bad enough with tourist traffic, logging trucks and buses loaded with coffin dodgers dawdling along without clogging them up with boats on travel hoists! I won't mention over head cables..the only reason the canal is where it is, is down to the available water supply. I'm sure the Irish navvies who dug it would rather have dug out 2 miles instead of 9.

The canal is not my choice if heading to or from the Clyde, not on cost which I think is cheap for what you get, but for hassle and hard work to which I am clinically allergic to.

I wonder how many Clyde ' commuters' ( which I am no longer) prefer to sail round?

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Are you being serious?

Probably not

 

[Seatrout]

I do prefer to go round the MoK, not due to cost or time, but on sympathy for my yacht.

We had a bad experience a couple of years ago in the canal when a group of drunks on a Mobo who hadn't a clue how to control their lines on the lock flood, caused significant hull damage to my pride and joy with a sharp edged swim platform.

The claim was contested and it was only through contact with the SC office that I was able to trace the 'independent witness' on the 3rd boat going through with us, that my full hull paint job proceeded.

The assisted passage scheme attracted us back this year, and an easterly transit on return from 2 months cruising, saved my bacon as SWIMBO had a hair appointment to keep. The experience was superb, my only criticism was that some of the staff (at Cairnbaan) could not understand my desire to have the stern warp secured before the bow warp.

Despite opinion above, the passage saved a day for us, and we now plan to use the canal both ways next year. It is a most relaxing experience if you are prepared to avoid the knobs, who are on time constraints, by stopping for a cuppa and let them go ahead.

 

[A1Sailor]

I think the skipper's guide (and staff) would do well to say that you really only need one person on board

I disagree. I think it is essential to have two people on board - one on the foredeck and the other in the cockpit

 

[JumbleDuck]

I disagree. I think it is essential to have two people on board - one on the foredeck and the other in the cockpit

Lots of boats - including mine - go through without someone on the foredeck. If I need an adjustable bowline I run it back to one of the sheet winches; the stern line goes round the other.

 

[Sgeir]

I disagree. I think it is essential to have two people on board - one on the foredeck and the other in the cockpit

I disagree. I think it is essential to have one person on board - one in the cockpit, the other climbing the ladder (or just stepping ashore), looping the lines around the bollards, and seeing to the lock gates. It's not too heavy.

JumbleDuck is right. We are both in our 60s; Mme S is of slight build and does all the "hard" work, running about, attending to the sluices, opening the gates. Meanwhile, I control the bow (via a block) and aft lines from the cockpit. Easy peasy, and any normally fit couple can easily manage it without assistance.

Having said that, we had the misfortune to follow a boatload of bumblies, four of them (or was it five?), who simply could not get into their heads that it was perfectly possible for two people to manage. Although we were leaving the Ardrishaig pontoon when they arrived, they pushed through in front of us; no problem but I wondered about their manners at that point. There was plenty of room so we simply tied up behind them on the port side. But, as happens with mannerless and selfish people, they turned out to be pretty incompetent and were unable to control the boat, seemingly incapable of understanding the action of the water as the locks filled, trying to insist that we go astern over the cill instead of them controlling their boat with the warps. By that time I realised why they didn't want us behind them - they really need most of the lock to themselves.

After listening to their constant whining and moaning, I simply gave up and let them carry on when we reached Cairnbaarn. To cap it all, not only could they not manage their boat, but they didn't even pull their their weight when it came to the sluices and the locks. Contacting their club, the RHYC, was a possible option, but life's too short and after two or three locks, I decided not to bother - it looked as though the skipper was becoming embarrassed, although he should have spoken to chums, imho.

Anyway, it is well within the competence of two reasonably fit people to traverse the canal without assistance.

 

[A1Sailor]

Lots of boats - including mine - go through without someone on the foredeck. If I need an adjustable bowline I run it back to one of the sheet winches; the stern line goes round the other.

Excellent. Does the bow line levitate by itself? Or do you chuck it from the cockpit, do the same with the stern line, steer with your teeth while operating the throttle/gear lever with your feet?

I probably meant to go through in a safe/controlled fashion needs two on board.

 

[awol]

Excellent. Does the bow line levitate by itself? Or do you chuck it from the cockpit, do the same with the stern line, steer with your teeth while operating the throttle/gear lever with your feet?

I probably meant to go through in a safe/controlled fashion needs two on board.

Bollocks! Bring the bow line back to the cockpit, throw the stern line as the boat stops under reverse thrust, then the bow line - nae problem. Going up, a wee bit of forward against the stern line and wind in the bow line; going down sit on the coachroof and ease them both out.

 

[A1Sailor]

Bollocks! Bring the bow line back to the cockpit, throw the stern line as the boat stops under reverse thrust, then the bow line - nae problem. Going up, a wee bit of forward against the stern line and wind in the bow line; going down sit on the coachroof and ease them both out.

How polite. Each to his own.

 

[dunedin]

Bollocks! Bring the bow line back to the cockpit, throw the stern line as the boat stops under reverse thrust, then the bow line - nae problem. Going up, a wee bit of forward against the stern line and wind in the bow line; going down sit on the coachroof and ease them both out.

Yep, we have also used this approach. The bow line led through a pulley block and back to the coachroof winch - and gently power forward on the stern rope with the wheel locked over to sheer the stern in.
The most tricky bit is getting the bow rope ready to go again between locks if going up-hill - as will need to be lengthened. But going slowly between locks is generally fine, providing not blowing a hoolie from the side !

 

[EuanMcKenzie]

I did half and half last time I took my own boat through. My daughter could throw a line but wasn't strong enough to pull in so both led to the cockpit via snatch blocks and tailed on the winches.

Rest of the crew ashore for the hard work and the exercise between locks.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Anyway, it is well within the competence of two reasonably fit people to traverse the canal without assistance.

I used to take my last boat through like a dose of salts with just me ashore and my father on the boat. It helped enormously that she was just narrow enough to get through a with a single lock gate open.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Excellent. Does the bow line levitate by itself? Or do you chuck it from the cockpit, do the same with the stern line, steer with your teeth while operating the throttle/gear lever with your feet?

I probably meant to go through in a safe/controlled fashion needs two on board.

I am finding it difficult to understand where you think the difficulty lies. I have never found any need for panic stricken urgency in throwing two lines up ten feet or so. Nor have I had any need to use either throttle or tiller while doing so. Perhaps your boat is particularly hard to handle in a safe and controlled way?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Bollocks! Bring the bow line back to the cockpit, throw the stern line as the boat stops under reverse thrust, then the bow line - nae problem. Going up, a wee bit of forward against the stern line and wind in the bow line; going down sit on the coachroof and ease them both out.

You do see a few people who haven't a clue about stopping the boat accurately in the lock, and who rely on muscle at each end of the boat to pull them out of whatever cockeyed position they managed to get into. I just smile politely and make sure I go in after them.

 

[A1Sailor]

I am finding it difficult to understand where you think the difficulty lies. I have never found any need for panic stricken urgency in throwing two lines up ten feet or so. Nor have I had any need to use either throttle or tiller while doing so. Perhaps your boat is particularly hard to handle in a safe and controlled way?

No panic; thanks. One person on the bow line, one in the cockpit and one ashore. Simples. Not sure why you can't understand stuff!
If others want to take chances with their boats then fine. Entirely up to them.

EDIT:
Maybe you should contact the canal with your recommended amendments to the Skippers' Guide?

 

[JumbleDuck]

No panic; thanks. One person on the bow line, one in the cockpit and one ashore.

You may find it's all a bit faster and easier if you have two people where there is quite a lot of work to be done and one person where there are two ropes to be adjusted from time to time. But if you've found out that doing it that way risks damage to your boat, and if your crew are happy with the division of labour, who am I to argue?