CRINAN CANAL Assisted passage???

[A1Sailor]

Who are Hugh and his team? Scottish Canals staff, freelance agents, or both?

 

[Al Dickson]

Always understood to be freelance ?

 

[A1Sailor]

I too assume the Pilots to be freelance, although some of them may be Scottish Canals (previously British Waterways Board-Scotland) staff freelancing while on their day off. Some may be former/retired Scottish Canals staff. The ones doing "assisted passages" will be Scottish Canals staff, provided/employed by Scottish Canals. All a bit unclear... Particularly if someone says "I am the Crinan Pilot"!!!!
Skippers need to know from whom they are receiving their "orders". Is it a request from a freelance Pilot on behalf of "his Skipper", or an instruction from a member of Scottish Canals staff. I guess a Skipper might consider a request from a Pilot, but be expected to pay heed to the latter.
All a bit of a quandry. Perhaps Quandary can advise?

EDIT:
You can well understand why a Pilot employed by a Skipper would want to get through quickly, but hopefully not at the expense of bullying others.

 

[Quandary]

The pilots are freelance, there are now only two and because the work is so scarce they work together as a team charging the same and splitting the proceeds. So they have less than £30 each for a transit unless they can get two boats together, about £7 an hour including provision of their cars. When you consider the work and time involved it is not worth their while doing it but they will carry on as long as some people still want them. When I did it, it was for a number of reasons, I enjoyed it, it was a good work out in the open air and kept you fit, you met nice people and made friends. Unfortunately in 2011 Lock 6 claimed the cartilage in my left knee and with a new metal knee joint, I am no longer really supposed to push gates any more but very few days go by when I do not go down and help a boat or two, particularly if they are trying to make it through to sea close to closing time. A few years ago some canal staff used to do it on their day off, Hugh has always been generous in sharing his contacts but 'free assisted passage' will soon replace him. I suspect he is the last in a very long tradition. However if assisted passage is to be charged for it is unlikely to be so cheap or efficent so Hugh could make a come back.
The assisted passage is provided by summer casuals, mainly local students recruited each spring, dangerous to generalize but the girls tend to work a lot harder than some of the young males who I suspect think it is a bit naff to be seen working.

It is interesting that the local paper is reporting claims from Scottish Canals for Crinans contribution to the local economy that quote an average crew of four each spending £40 per. night for an average three night transit so you must all be dining in the Crinan Hotel every night while on passage.

 

[A1Sailor]

Summer Staff ain't as good as they used to be...

Times change. My initial comment relates to the fact that I was one of the first "summer casuals" to work on the canal in 1978. I worked on all the locks/bridges except 14&15 at Crinan, cut grass ad nauseum and wielded a mean paint brush! It was great fun, and despite some understandable opposition from the unions I and a colleague were welcomed by most of the permanent staff. I was asked back the following year; maybe they thought I was a girl!

EDIT:
In the 70's, only the bridges and locks with associated bridges (4, 5 & 11) were staffed. There wasn't an assisted passage service, but there were a number of pilots. When I was on the bridge at Dunardry (lock 11) I would generally assist boats on the entire flight from 9-13, prioritising the bridge.

 

[dunedin]

Having been through the canal on a number of occasions with Hugh and Jim, I second Quandry's view that they are the least likely people to have been rude to other boats in transit. They always seem the nicest and most relaxed folks around.
Certainly they have never queue jumped anybody that I have seen. Quite the opposite - often they were helping the boats ahead for free, on the basis if they are able to move ahead then we can too.
And on three occasions other boats came through at the same time as us, benefitting form their service. It was notable that none offered the guys even a courtesy tip / beer money (let alone offer to share the cost with us - though I would have refused and suggested they give the Pilots a bit more).

So again a big thumbs up for Hugh and Jim's assistance.

And worth noting the free Assisted Passage services makes clear that boats wanting to use the service may have to wait and let other fully crewed boats go ahead of them, if sufficient staff are not yet available. So should allow extra time for the passage.
But coming back to the original point - outrageous staff behaviour experienced by Quandry so he should report it.

 

[Quandary]

But coming back to the original point - outrageous staff behaviour experienced by Quandry so he should report it.

After some deliberation and my wife's reluctance to complain, I strolled over to the office late this afternoon. Apparently our story had already got back and the 'team' at Cairnbaan had already had a wee chat with their line manager. The point about priority was discussed and it was pointed out that assistance had to be based on a perception of need, I suppose I should be flattered that the dog and I are regarded as competent enough not to need much help. So an apology for the experience at Cairnbaan was offered and relayed back to my wife.
The management are committed to this service and intend to recruit more staff for it next year, just hope they have been monitoring and comparing the attitude of this years lot when they are appointing for next year, there are some at both Crinan and Ardrishaig which they would do well to try to bring back. Of course some of this is down to leadership and example, we first met the sea lock keeper here on our first visit to the canal in the mid seventies when he was a golden haired youngster, bit older now but still leading his team well.

The managers would do well to go right through just once with Hugh, though pride will never allow it, if one guy working alone can take a boat right through in under four hours opening and closing all the gates, a couple of fit young guys working nearly as hard should be able to man a flight of four or five locks. But then Hugh knows the vagaries of every gate and how to work it, those that stick and the two that open on their own without being touched, the Canal staff would do well to access that knowledge.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

This whole escapade reads like it would make a good Neil Munro plot.

 

[Loch Linnhe]

Got to say the one time I used the canal, we had a terrible time due to a Pilot, he appeared at the Crinan End and was quite upset when we refused his offer of help, he picked up a large motor cruiser behind us, he cycled between locks keeping ahead of the Motor Cruiser and keeping up with us, we were shocked to see him drinking beer and openly urinating while waiting for the Motor Cruiser, and as the day went on he kept drinking, he was aggressive and at one point he tried to squeeze the Motor Boat in the same lock as us despite our objections, the Motor Boat owner had to intervene when it was obvious they would not fit, he was obviously well known to the canal staff, having a blazing row with one of them at one lock, I can only hope he has moved on to other employment

 

[A1Sailor]

Good to hear that the canal now has Quandry's feedback.
When I go through I always have sufficient crew to put at least one crew member ashore. If I didn't, I would go "round the Mull" or organise a pilot. If another Skipper has purchased a pilot due to insufficient crew I wouldn't feel duty bound to pay part of his costs. Two boats, each with one ashore, can make rapid progress as long as one goes on to the next lock. Progress is slow if the next set of gates aren't open and the boats have to do the 360degree drift between locks! Two men (or women!) ashore is plenty, as long as they are organised.
When I used to work at Dunardry (35 years ago!!!) yachts approaching from Crinan or Bellanoch would generally find locks 13 & 12 empty and open, ready for them to enter. MoBos didn't always get the same service - Skippers in possession of a mast are more visible!

 

[Quandary]

Got to say the one time I used the canal, we had a terrible time due to a Pilot, he appeared at the Crinan End and was quite upset when we refused his offer of help, he picked up a large motor cruiser behind us, he cycled between locks keeping ahead of the Motor Cruiser and keeping up with us, we were shocked to see him drinking beer and openly urinating while waiting for the Motor Cruiser, and as the day went on he kept drinking, he was aggressive and at one point he tried to squeeze the Motor Boat in the same lock as us despite our objections, the Motor Boat owner had to intervene when it was obvious they would not fit, he was obviously well known to the canal staff, having a blazing row with one of them at one lock, I can only hope he has moved on to other employment

He has moved on, but not to other employment, you were witnessing someone in the last throes of a problem, he died a few years back. By then he had lost all his customers but could not understand why.

 

[Quandary]

This whole escapade reads like it would make a good Neil Munro plot.

Great idea, I will ask Hugh if I can be his biographer.

 

[JumbleDuck]

It seems to me, Quandary, that you are the best sort of canal user: helpful; considerate; patient; understanding.

In my experience, most are. It's a very few who are selfish and inconsiderate; unfortunately the actions of those few can affect a lot of people.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I do not believe this, I think you may be displaying a little prejudice. For a start the pilot assists a yacht or more often a motor cruiser, he has no control over it, it is controlled by the skipper and if you were inconvenienced it is the boats responsibility.

I can assure you that a pilot was on the motorboat and that it as the pilot who, when I asked him to move the boat forward to allow me to join him in the lock as instructed said "no" and closed the gate on me. Perhaps he was acting on the owner's instructions (a curmudgeonly fellow) but in that case I would have expected him to instruct the owner on the etiquette of canal passage.

The pilot is not anywhere near the boat at Millars bridge so how he can be blamed for what is said or done there beats me.

The one who harried us was travelling on the boat.

I have worked with Hugh and Jim and they are very far from 'ill mannered louts' Hugh has a military background with the attitude and deportment that that implies.

I have no idea who the pilots were, and from all I have heard of Hugh (I haven't heard anything of Jim) it sound most unlikely to have been him. Or you.

PM sent.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Brought the boat down from 4 to the basin this morning, did not bother with the yellow flag but the experience could not have been more different, sharing with a Sadler we were down in no time with willing and cheerful assistance at every lock, one of the temporary assistants was on her last day before being laid off but smiling and cheerful in the rain. I suspect the idlers at Cairnbaan will still be there next week.

Cairnbaan has always been a ... relaxed place. Perhaps it's the mountain air. Other staff were excellent this year, particularly the Ardrishaig folks.

 

[JumbleDuck]

The pilots are freelance, there are now only two and because the work is so scarce they work together as a team charging the same and splitting the proceeds.

I should make clear that my unfortunate experiences with pilots were when there were more on the go.

 

[EuanMcKenzie]

Came through on Saturday assisting a friend bring his boat back home from Ardfern. We were well crewed up with four aboard. Went through as three boats one of which was a couple on assisted passage and they had the sure deodorant flag flying. (the flags are a bit naf). The assisted couple got little assistance directly. What did happen however was the canal staff at Cairnbaan went and prepped the locks for us so they were waiting open ahead of us. We were at Ardrishaig basin by four and would have got out swiftly if it wasn't for an elderly gent falling in the water in the sea lock ahead of us.

Great sail down to Portavadie afterwards on flat seas. Was well impressed with his AWB.

 

[Bojangles]

I came back through the canal early August (2 crew & myself) and was joined by a 30ft single handed yacht, who was asking for assisted passage (entering at Crinan). We assisted him through all the locks and the canal staff did appear at a few initially but he certainly wasn't provided with an assisted passage. With the poor weather on the day it wasn't the most pleasant transit, least so for my pal who was cycling along, preparing the locks and running round taking warps from both sides. At the Ardrishaig end one of the lock keepers was asking where his yellow flag was, he said that there were none available at Crinan, I wasn't aware of this requirement but this was probably why he didnt receive much help. I have always found the BW staff to be pleasant and helpful, in the past I have used a pilot and found this useful when I had young children as crew. The singlehander was very grateful for our assistance but even more so for the bacon roll and the cup of tea we served up at Ardrishaig.

 

[JumbleDuck]

The singlehander was very grateful for our assistance but even more so for the bacon roll and the cup of tea we served up at Ardrishaig.

Years ago I brought my then boat, a 21 footer, back through the canal singlehanded late in the season. I joined up with a much bigger boat and at their suggestion we lashed mine alongside, and they did all the canal work. My job was to keep up a continuous supply of coffee, bacon rolls and biccies. It suited everyone very well.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

We did the passage through the Crinan Canal a few years ago (2010, I think). There were three of us aboard, and we did the passage from Ardrishaig to Crinan in about 5 hours, despite never having gone through before. One of us, a big, strong chap, walked ahead to operate the locks, my wife handled lines in the locks, and I managed the boat. The lock keepers at Ardrishaig saw us through the first two locks, giving us instruction on how to handle our lines, and making sure we knew how to work the locks. Of course, the bridge-keepers lent a hand at the road crossings, preparing the locks for us to enter. We spent a night at the summit reach on our return, but this was mainly because of delays at Crinan - we had to wait for the sea lock, and were then asked to wait while a puffer came through. Otherwise, we'd have done the return journey as quickly as the outward passage.

A few points:

• The canal staff were courteous and helpful without exception. I don't recall seeing any "summer student" types.
• Three people is ample to get through the canal; all of us (including my wife, who is tiny) could work the locks. Provided you're patient and make wait for the levels to be right, the locks all do work; the trick is not to rush to open the gates.
• If my wife and I did it on our own, I think we'd either need to take it very slowly or we'd need the assisted passage or a pilot.
• I still have a gripe about the costs - I think the canal is overpriced, and that there should be a rate for those who do not intend to spend any more time than necessary on the passage. Plenty of people here are witness to the fact that it is easily possible to do the passage in half a day; why do we have to pay rates as if we were in a fully serviced marina for several nights for a simple passage through the canal?
• The Crinan Canal is really only a short cut for people who intend to visit Loch Fyne anyway; from most places in the Clyde it is as quick to go round the Mull of Kintyre.