Crew Choice and Annoying posters....

ianat182 said:
Have you trie the alternative method whereby you do the crewing and she takes the helm; you may find that she becomes the one that wants to tell the crew to tweak. Its a fact that a fair bit of the enjoyment of sailing is sensinig the speed and attitude of the boat either through the helm or the seat of your pants; if you've sailed dinghies and raced you'll know what I mean. A little coaching won't go amiss with SWMBO but don't always take the helm away from her, let her try berthing the boat too, its all a matter of trust - both ways.
Try it out, you may be pleasantly surprised.

ianat182
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As far as I am concerned she can have the helm when ever she wants it!

I do not take the helm off her. She passes it to me when she decides she is not doing it right, even for all my assurance she is doing fine... So much so she will sit and criticise me when I get it wrong...

She berths the boat its only in tight berths she declines or I take over.

Part of the reason for wanting a crew is she feels useless stuck on the helm and wants to help and understand the ins and outs of the clutches and deckwork.

Once she can, crew will be able to become guests again...

I trust her completely, she would get by in most situations with the knowledge she has. She knows I do but just does not understand why...

Its just hard to teach some one how to put the head sail up a foil on the foredeck when you are in the cockpit!
 
onesea said:
As far as I am concerned she can have the helm when ever she wants it!

...........

Part of the reason for wanting a crew is she feels useless stuck on the helm and wants to help and understand the ins and outs of the clutches and deckwork.

..........

Its just hard to teach some one how to put the head sail up a foil on the foredeck when you are in the cockpit!
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[serious mode] So do an hour to 2 hours deckwork & sails up/down on the berth (you don't have to go through everything) and then go out and practice (head to wind or whatever) what you have gone through.

If it helps, and I think it might and I don't mean to be disrespectful, my SWMBO says to me: "You don't explain things as nicely to me as you do to others when they come out with us" so is there possibly some behaviour modification required? [/serious mode]
 
Steve Clayton said:
[serious mode] So do an hour to 2 hours deckwork & sails up/down on the berth (you don't have to go through everything) and then go out and practice (head to wind or whatever) what you have gone through.

If it helps, and I think it might and I don't mean to be disrespectful, my SWMBO says to me: "You don't explain things as nicely to me as you do to others when they come out with us" so is there possibly some behaviour modification required? [/serious mode]
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Steve thanks for comments, the problem is she confidence and her wanting someone to help do it a few times (she did all aspects in port once or twice when we tried the 5 headsails the boat came with :/).

Agree about teaching partners wifes and own off-spring over a certain age, I am sure that issue is to come. So far I do not think its an issue but am keen to avoid it...
 
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ianat182 said:
Have you trie the alternative method whereby you do the crewing and she takes the helm; you may find that she becomes the one that wants to tell the crew to tweak. Its a fact that a fair bit of the enjoyment of sailing is sensinig the speed and attitude of the boat either through the helm or the seat of your pants; if you've sailed dinghies and raced you'll know what I mean. A little coaching won't go amiss with SWMBO but don't always take the helm away from her, let her try berthing the boat too, its all a matter of trust - both ways.
Try it out, you may be pleasantly surprised.

ianat182
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+1
I agree.
Nice and gently does it...encouragement and confidence grow together.
And no shouting...
 
onesea said:
As far as I am concerned she can have the helm when ever she wants it!

I do not take the helm off her. She passes it to me when she decides she is not doing it right, even for all my assurance she is doing fine... So much so she will sit and criticise me when I get it wrong...

She berths the boat its only in tight berths she declines or I take over.

Part of the reason for wanting a crew is she feels useless stuck on the helm and wants to help and understand the ins and outs of the clutches and deckwork.

Once she can, crew will be able to become guests again...

I trust her completely, she would get by in most situations with the knowledge she has. She knows I do but just does not understand why...

Its just hard to teach some one how to put the head sail up a foil on the foredeck when you are in the cockpit!
Click to expand...

But you can do a lot to help her....
Why not sit down at home and explain what halyards do and outhauls, and the topping lift, and the kicker, and the sheets and everything else using drawings so she can get the picture bit by bit so when she goes aboard she can understand more in context?
Then if you have friends crewing and they trim etc., for you.... none of it will be the mystery it was before to her as a result of having incomplete information.
Then you may find suddenly her confidence and ability will go forward in leaps and bounds, and be pleasantly surprised as a result.
 
Further to VO5's comments. Sometimes you'll find that your lady will respond to a new crew member who is inexperienced. Quite often it works out that your lady will take on the explaining in 'girltalk' for a lot of the small tasks aboard your boat, unlike perhaps our male counterparts who may be less attentive unless its a man to man job.
I often have guests for perhaps just one or two trips aboard and spend time during the sail to ensure that they understand the winding of sheets around the winches clockwise and keeping fingers well away from the winch. If two guests then I split them to port and starboard duties when tacking etc. and either have a lady on the helm with myself in the hatchway,where I don't interfere, but can call for the tack to be performed and am handy for any really awkward snarl-up. If we're on port tack I'll ask the starboard crew to assist me in setting a reef in the mainsail so the other crew member stays put, handing sail ties up to tidy the reefed main.( I don't have my halyards led aft so I need to go forward to lower the sail anyway) the crew then hauls in the outhaul and jambs in the cleat.
After a decent length of time I get each of the crew to do some helming, often it takes a short while for them to grasp the direction relative to the tiller movement, and then it is just a matter of showing them how responsive the helm is, and properly done how gently and easily to correct the course.
I'm sure that this is much the same on your yacht, at least your wife does want to sail, so that's a good start! Sadly my other half has Meniere's disease of the ear and gets sick with vertigo, even on the pontoon, so she won't venture aboard nowadays!!

Hope it works out

ianat182
 
ianat182 said:
Further to VO5's comments. Sometimes you'll find that your lady will respond to a new crew member who is inexperienced. ......................

Hope it works out

ianat182
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We have sailed a couple of times with other experianced people and she later made comments about there ablities! Its just her doing it herself that worries her.

From day one I have encouraged her to partipate, maybe to much! First time she left the river she was steering and I was putting mooring ropes, fenders away, it was a little bit busy :o

She has a grasp of what ropes do if not the names, I have always tried to teach the big picture not irrelevent things like names. Blue Rope, White, rope etc she is learning the names slowly in time. More important she has a fair grasp of what most ropes do and there effects and roughly ish enough when they are wrong.

Maybe I need to step back and keep her in her comfort zone for a whilst. Also maybe she needs to start showing some one else what she knows often helps you realsie what you know.

I have never shouted at her other than to be heard over sails, even this I try and avoid I am very aware it does not help (and would result in it being painfull later for me :eek:).

We also like to slip in and out of berths and harbours in relative quite so keep coms down.
 
Lakesailor said:
Lots of people are not quite the same in the flesh as they appear on here.
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I've met a few of the most controversial posters this place has ever had, and they have been more than pleasant in real life.
Some folk even get on with me away from here! ;)

It's pointless to judge anyone's personality by what they write on internet forums. :)
 
onesea said:
The boat we have bought is kind of racey and a BIG step up for SWMBO. I know we can handle her but its a BIG step for SWMBO.

Its a difficult place SWMBO given a jib sheet will ask me what to do... I trim the sail and she will tell me I have it wrong (and she will be right :rolleyes:).

I am starting to think that a friend who is nearly or novice is probably better than an unknown... Then SHMBO will get confidence teaching?

Thoughts? suggestions? volunteers?
....
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We had a problem with out first boat. I had only done DS and was still on a steep learning curve, my wife had no practical experience whatsoever, although she had done the DS theory, and was obviously wary of my experience. I didn't feel confident to teach anyone whilst trying to keep myself out of trouble.

Tried getting an instructor on board for a weeken for her benefit but he turned out to be a right w****r, more concerned with bragging about how good he was. In the end, she went down to Hamble and did the day skipper practical and it proved an excellent decision. Came back with much more knowledge and confidence.
 
GrahamM376 said:
We had a problem with out first boat. I had only done DS and was still on a steep learning curve, my wife had no practical experience whatsoever, although she had done the DS theory, and was obviously wary of my experience. I didn't feel confident to teach anyone whilst trying to keep myself out of trouble.

Tried getting an instructor on board for a weeken for her benefit but he turned out to be a right w****r, more concerned with bragging about how good he was. In the end, she went down to Hamble and did the day skipper practical and it proved an excellent decision. Came back with much more knowledge and confidence.
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That's another approach I am trying, she has books (she bought them herself) etc, but she would like to do attendance theory not online. She works shifts and we have yet to find a school (Solent Based) that can work with us on this one...

Your last paragraph is just what I am worried about when finding a crew/ instructor. Like judging from the forums, its hard to know someone is like on a boat till they are afloat.
 
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I used Hamble School of Yachting for my courses, instructor was a chap called John Goldsborough - excellent. They can also arrange onboard own boat tuition if that would fit around your wife's shifts.
 
OK thought I would give an update, after a couple sails where SWMOB worried excessively (clinging on to stantons saying very little etc).

We have taken my daughter and a couple of the family sailing, they are young or novices and she needed to help...

Plus other days out...

As for the last two times out:
Well one was a race (her first) we came 3rd (in a class of 3 :o). By the end of the race she was kicking me to put more sail up. When I suggested spinniker she said we need more practice for that ;)
After the race on the way to mooring she asked me "Whens the next one?" :D

The other sail it was gusty blowing 20+ knots most of the time, we broached a couple of times and she told me she saw the end of the boom in the water :rolleyes:.

All of which she took in her own stride, but she still prefers to go below to make coffee and get food than be left alone steering whilst I go...

Thanks for the advise still some work to do but heading in right direction :cool:
 
I'd say you are 90% there. Come first or second of three next time and you'll be amazed at who is keenest to go sailing/racing. An extra crew member later will be even better, but a cruising chute less hassle than a spinnaker- you can modify the setting to be spinnaker-like, using the pole when well downwind.

Well done!


ianat182
 
onesea said:
The other sail it was gusty blowing 20+ knots most of the time, we broached a couple of times and she told me she saw the end of the boom in the water :rolleyes:.
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To give you a bit more serious a response, I once heard a medic professor on the radio talking about the different biological responses of men and women to risk / excitement. It goes back to evolution and means women producing different hormones in times of stress to those that men produce and the hormones having different effects. What you and I find exciting about racing - the close quarters high risk manoeuvres, the aggressive competition, etc, she will mostly find worrying and her response will be fear and an inclination to avoid. Sure different individuals have varying responses but thats the basics of the situation. You are preprogrammed to fight and take risks, she is pre programmed to run away and hide.

You have no alternative but to adapt your way of sailing to accommodate her fears. Rational explanations of why the boat heels and how safe that is dont work in my experience.

I sail differently winter to summer. Winter is racing with the lads on board and its as all out as you can get in a family cruiser. Summer is cruising with SWMBO and whilst we might gradually build up to going downwind in 20 knots, its mostly gentle sailing in F3 and with the mast as upright as I can get it. The genny is reefed to 110% all summer. But I'm quite happy to potter having thrashed the nuts off the boat during the winter.

No doubt you will find a happy compromise but dont kid yourself that you will ever get her to respond in the same way you do
 
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