Can I take an RYA theory exam without the tuition?

[spark]

I have a friend who's keen to do her day skipper theory this winter in advance of doing the practical in the Canaries in March. There are no night classes in the area and the correspondence courses seem very overpriced.

There areplenty of books/CDs covering the syllabus and I have offered to help her through the coursework but don't know how to find an examiner for her so that she can get the bit of paper. The RYA site is kaputt at the moment. Does anyone have any experience of taking an RYA exam without having paid for tuition?

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[Jeremy_W]

Why does she need the piece of paper?

Certainly when I did DS Practical the Theory exam wasn't a pre-requisite. You needed a reasonable grasp of basic navigation (I used Gerry Smith's "Coastal Navigation"), lights and shapes (flash cards) and to know what times the Shipping Forecast was on.

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[alant]

You do not have to have a 'theory' ticket to do any practical course.
However, it is recommended & some schools make it a mandatory requirement, otherwise the instructor is trying to allocate time unnecessarily to one pupil & is unfair to the others.
If the pupil really does know the theory then there should be no problem (many come on courses & say they do, but its not confirmed when asked even to lay off a simple bearing on a chart, let alone know anything about 'course to steer', by which time the instructor is stuck with them).
We've all had pupils who claim "never sea-sick", "done all the theory", "did my theory 10 years ago", but not even picked up a pencil let alone a chart or plotter before arriving on the boat, but its the other pupils who can then have a possible grouse having paid good money for a course.

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[Birdseye]

The course completion cert at DS does not depend on the two simple tests at the end - it depends on sound basic understanding of the subject matter and including a reasonable attendance (and I dont know how they square this with correspondence courses) and completion of the work . There is no pass mark for the DS course.

The RYA answer would no doubt be that you get the course completion cert when the Instructor is happy you have satisfactorily completed the course. How an instructor could do this without any other involvement, I do not know. I wouldnt be prepared to do so.

However, the cert isnt really what its about, is it? The knowledge and understanding is what matters. So if she cant make it to a course, then buy the RYA papers and a good book or two, and systematically work your way through them. Even better, get out on a boat and put them into practise.



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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

So what this says to me, in all RYA training the exam fee is not, it is just another revenue for the course.

All other training, BTEC, Masters etc will allow students to turn in, pays their money and do the exam, however they chose to learn the subject matter, but so far we have heard the RYA don't allow this, but continue to take an exam fee.

The ripping off doesn't stop at the boat show does it?

The exam has no relevence at all to the course?

The exam cannot show that you are up to the desired level?

Therefore the exam is a waste of everyones time and not worth a thing?

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[alant]

When assessing theory papers at Day Skipper level, the instructor is asked to consider them under 4 classifications, which run from Good to Poor. The 'lower' grades - people showing less understanding of the coursework than expected, will if necessary be allowed to be assessed with further papers (effectively a resit). This is not getting just the arithmetic right, but trying to make sure the principles are understood, with the Instructor honestly trying to assess this.
Its not simply a rubber stamping. It will indicate clearly if the pupil is " up to the required level" and is something the instructor is monitoring throughhout the course, not simply at "exam" time.
There is no "exam fee" as such, its all part of the course learning process & these are definitely not "a waste of everybodies time and not worth a thing".
If nothing else, any instructor would be failing in his/her responsibility if they just rubber stamped - letting the pupil go away with a false sense of achievment, letting them assume they know more than they do - perhaps to then get into difficulty putting themselves & others maybe at risk.

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[mldpt]

I am not absolutly sure but I think you can take the RYA yachtmaster practical exam without any of the shore based courses. I fact I you can arrange for the examenor to come on board your boat for the day and access you.
Mike

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[peterb]

The certificate you get at the end of an RYA shorebased course isn't simply a statement of your competence. The Coastal Skipper version (I don't have a Day Skipper ticket, but I'm sure it's similar) reads :

"This is to certify that xxxxxx has attended a shorebased course of instruction and demonstrated a knowledge of theory up to the standard of RYA/DoT Coastal Skipper and Yachtmaster Offshore"

It's difficult to see how such a certificate could be given to someone who hadn't been through a "course of instruction".

Oh, and I don't know of any school that charges an examination fee for a shorebased course. The exam papers are part of the course documentation. They are included in the student pack that each student gets, although the tutor normally removes them from the pack and retains them until the final exam. (Or at least that's how it was done up to a few years ago, I assume it hasn't changed significantly.)

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[wishbone]

I can only tell you my experience! I did the RYA day skipper and vhf in the class room at night school before I had ever set foot on a boat proper, your friend will benefit greatly from the course work even by correspondence. ( I was a late starter in my early forties) when I signed up for comp crew and day skipper later I already had a good idea what was going on! I have found that if you ring an RYA instructor nearest to you he or she will give good advice for the best plan of action. Or contact the RYA I have always found them most helpful. It may be possible for your friend to do the class work in the UK then when doing day skipper in the Canaries take the test paper while there.

Wishbone
Rolling, rolling, rolling keep them doggies moving!
Where’s me chuck wagon gone?


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[Birdseye]

Jools - there is no exam fee for the shorebased DS course because there is no exam. The part of the course fee that goes to the RYA pays for the practise charts, the booklet, and the exercises including the two exercises which are done "under exam conditions" at the end. The large majority of the course fee (typically anywhere between 70% and 95%) goes to the school / club etc providing the tuition and it is the tutor who decides whether you get the course completion cert.

There is an exam for the YM / coastal practical, and that exam can be taken without any prior course, practical or shorebased. I cannot remember whether it is the same for the DS practical.

I share your view of the money grubbing antics of the RYA (the ICC fee for example) but in this particular case, they seem to me to give good value.

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[[3889]]

If you allow the examiner to access you does it guarantee a pass?

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[spark]

Thanks for the clarification. What we have to do is make sure that she knows the theory inside out and then find a school that will take her for the practical without the theory certificate of completion.

I have taught people to sail in the past and it is a pain when the trainees have differing levels of understanding, so I'll make sure she doesn't go into the practical underprepared.

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[Birdseye]

the theory cert is not a pre requisite for the practical courseso that should be no problem

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