Brilliant (not!)

[DukeII]

Hello again,

As I mentioned in a previous thread, we've got to get a new cooker installed for our BSC, which we failed Friday.

In the process of removing the old Flavel, we decided to revamp the cooker surround as it's old and looks awful (it's bright yellow). We were going to buy some formica laminate to put on there, but as time is short , thought we'd just paint in with high temp paint for now and worry about doing the job 'properly' later. It looks like the new cooker can be installed with flexible pipe (correct me if this is wrong) so whipping it out later and doing the formica shouldn't be a prob (so we thought)

OH has just removed the old surround to bring it home and has imparted the slightly worrying news that he thinks it's asbestos. Great....

Is this possible do you reckon? The boat is a 1973 Seamaster 27... Can I find out for sure somehow or do we need to get out an expensive asbestos expert to test it properly and find out?

I find it comical that we failed on several trivial items, including such things as very occasional yellow in the flame on our burners....yet the facts the boat could be full of asbestos, or have a 50p size hole in the hull, seem to not form a part of the BSC test.

Yours fed up...

Emma

 

[Captain Coochie]

It does look like it and there isnt many other things that do look like asbestos . Blue asbestos is the nasty one . The grey one ( used for roofing ) isnt too bad for you although does have to be disposed of properly (speak to your local council )
You can get fire proof materials from places like wicks to replace it if you want to .

 

[VicS]

In 1973 is was very probable that an asbestos based board was used.

Cannot tell anything from your picture. To positively ID asbestos requires a polarised light microscopy technique or x-ray diffraction. (Used to be a small part of my job at one time)

However it is possible to get a pretty good idea using an ordinary low power microscope although one of the above techniques is required for confirmation

If you have access to a low power microscope then tease out a fibre from the board and examine it. Asbestos fibres can be broken down into finer fibres. If the fibre cannot be broken into finer fibres then it is probably not asbestos.

Most sensible thing in view of its age is to dispose of it at the local tip that will accept it ( One in your area will and the council website should tell you which) and replace it with an asbestos free product.

FWIW the pictures below compare asbestos fibres with other, man made, fibres. You can see that asbestos fibres are bundles of finer fibres.

 

[byron]

very[/I] occasional yellow in the flame on our burners....yet the facts the boat could be full of asbestos, or have a 50p size hole in the hull, seem to not form a part of the BSC test.

Yours fed up...

Emma

Whilst I commiserate with you on your Trials and Tribulations with the Test and I know how over zealous and nit picking some Inspectors can be. Think back to when the Test first came out when some rules insisted you made some boats unseaworthy before they could pass.

 

[TrueBlue]

Don't fret about your asbestos cement sheet. Just wrap it up and seal in two layers of (should be 500 gauge) polythene and take it to whichever of your Local Authority's recycling sites is listed as accepting such material.

Have a look at your LA's website for details. Because the site will want you to load it into the container yourself, you'll probably get away with a less quality wrapping as lond as it looks well parcelled up.

It's not hugely dangerous if you treat it with respec'. There was a lot of argument about sheeting on one of the YBW forums a while ago.

Byron has a point, the BSS has been mucked about with over the years, and like so many of these quasi government bodies; Corgi (or was), the other boiler body, the electrical outfit as well - that the execution is largely left to what passes for an inspector feels on the day.
There's not a lot the bod at the receiving end can do - except to find a competent inspector.

 

[DukeII]

Thank you for the replies...Just getting a bit downhearted this end as there's been a serious amount of work going on to the boat every weekend without fail over the winter in all weathers (upside-down fibreglassing to strengthen the deck, deck scraping, deck painting, wood repair/renewal, chroming, bilge cleaning, new electrics, polishing, osmosis sorting, antifouling etc etc) and now to fall at the last hurdle and find a heap load more money/effort has to go in 4 days from lift in makes it all seem rather depressing.

Any thoughts on simply brushing over the bare parts of panels with liquid sealant and refitting them?

Can't seem to find any real suitable replacement heat proof material that isn't a complete git to work with...

Emma

 

[Captain Coochie]

It isnt dangerous as it is . Only when you break it and the fibres are released .
I would change it myself but then i see it as a very simple job . You may not .
Out of interest how big is it and how many of them do you need ?

 

[Andrew_Fanner]

Whilst I commiserate with you on your Trials and Tribulations with the Test and I know how over zealous and nit picking some Inspectors can be. Think back to when the Test first came out when some rules insisted you made some boats unseaworthy before they could pass.

Remember the early rule that effectively banned your gas fridge when there were no alternatives available? Didn't do the BSS credibility any good

I have an area to heatproof from a galley rebuild. Thinking of formica panels because I have some left from the old galley but I will also go into the local builder's merchant and see if there is anything they suggest. An asbestos millboard substitute presumably exists. Cuchillo, any suggestions as a resident expert on doing things with wood, how might one heatproof? Needs to be suitable for being next to hot kettle/pan and not subject to direct flame, just radiant heat from hot metal objects on the hob.

 

[Captain Coochie]

There is a material called asbestolux ( spelling ) That has taken the place of asbestos . Cheapest option would be plasterboard . Not ideal on a boat but i'm sure for us tootling up and down the Thames it would be fine .

If you wanted something a bit nicer then i have recently been dealing with a company called Envirograf and they sell an intumescent paper with a timber veneer on the front . Its used for fire proofing doors and would be more than enough to do what you need it for .

 

[VicS]

There is a material called asbestolux ( spelling ) That has taken the place of asbestos

You sure about that.
I thought Asbestolux was the old asbestos containing board and that Supalux was the non asbestos replacement.

 

[DukeII]

Well, we need 4 sheets (approx 4-5mm thick depending on if we go the formica route) and the biggest sheet is 570 x 580mm.

Emma

 

[Captain Coochie]

well i got the lux bit right , just spelt the first bit totally wrong

 

[Phill]

Thank you for the replies...Just getting a bit downhearted this end as there's been a serious amount of work going on to the boat every weekend without fail over the winter in all weathers

All this downheartedness will fade away the first weekend you're away on your boat, and whats more, it will feel all the more special because of all your winter efforts. Trust me, I know, I've done it twice! Enjoy it.

 

[DukeII]

All this downheartedness will fade away the first weekend you're away on your boat, and whats more, it will feel all the more special because of all your winter efforts. Trust me, I know, I've done it twice! Enjoy it.

I know, I know...It is amazing though what strain having a boat can put on a long standing relationship sometimes!

I am very lucky to have a fella who can put his hand to pretty much any horrible, dirty, smelly job and make a tidy end result of it. This is fortunate really as it was me that talked him into getting the b***dy thing in the first place!

My folks used to have the use of a little Hardy moored up on the backwater by Freebody's in Hurley and I grew up loving the river, exploring and fishing it most weekends...I'm hoping when it's all fixed up we can winch the old parentals aboard and pay back the experience (if it ever gets back in!)

Emma

 

[Captain Coochie]

Hmmm looks like you need a full 1200 x 2400 sheet to do what you want . I have a few off cuts of fire proof MDF kicking about but nothing that size or as many peices . MDF is probably the new asbestos though
You may be able to use them Andrew ?
Just a thought but could you not tile the area and use fire proof cement to fix the tiles ? Although if it where me i would just put that stuff back in and do that bit at a later date . Its not a big job to do and theres nothing more fun than messing about on boats when they are floating .

 

[DukeII]

Just a thought but could you not tile the area and use fire proof cement to fix the tiles ? Although if it where me i would just put that stuff back in and do that bit at a later date . Its not a big job to do and theres nothing more fun than messing about on boats when they are floating .

My OH says you're a genius!!!

Just off to look at B&Q's website now to see how thin we can get tiles (I think we need to butt up to the existing front surround wooden trim which is 5mm deep)

Thank you so much for an excellent suggestion.

Emma

 

[Captain Coochie]

Your OH may well be right

Topps tiles may be a better option as they do trade . Not so much for the tiles but for the cement .

 

[Phill]

Could you not put the original surround back but cover it in sheet aluminium first?

 

[Cliveshep]

You need to use Superlux or Masterboard as a fire-proof board.

For your asbestos, give it a good wetting to stop free fibres, and bag it up and take it to the proper place for disposal where they'll chuck it in a pit, squash it down with a digger or loader machine that releases loads of fibres and then cover it. So-called licensed site practice!

I never told you to dig a hole in the garden, wet it, tread on it to break it and bury it deep did I?

 

[ccscott49]

In 1973 is was very probable that an asbestos based board was used.

Cannot tell anything from your picture. To positively ID asbestos requires a polarised light microscopy technique or x-ray diffraction. (Used to be a small part of my job at one time)

However it is possible to get a pretty good idea using an ordinary low power microscope although one of the above techniques is required for confirmation

If you have access to a low power microscope then tease out a fibre from the board and examine it. Asbestos fibres can be broken down into finer fibres. If the fibre cannot be broken into finer fibres then it is probably not asbestos.

Most sensible thing in view of its age is to dispose of it at the local tip that will accept it ( One in your area will and the council website should tell you which) and replace it with an asbestos free product.

FWIW the pictures below compare asbestos fibres with other, man made, fibres. You can see that asbestos fibres are bundles of finer fibres.

DO NOT start messing with it and teasing fibres out etc. Leave it in one piece and get it disposed of at the correct council tip. Its not dangerous left alone, but whenyou start messing with it and releasing the fibres, it can be. Old adage "if you dont know what it does/is, dont mess with it" Repalce with non asbestos heat proof stuff.