Boatbuilder/adviser in the NorthEast

[carl170]

Hi.

I am needing to put a couple of stringers and partial bulkheads (which are missing) on my boat. Previously, work has been carried out which bears no resemblance to the original plans (which I have). I will have to work around what is currently there to install these.

I wopuld like to find a local boatbuilder (even a competent amateur!) to look over the boat and plans and basically and advise if what I am proposing will work.

The boat is in Newcastle.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers!

Carl

 

[Caer Urfa]

Hi.
I am needing to put a couple of stringers and partial bulkheads (which are missing) on my boat. Previously, work has been carried out which bears no resemblance to the original plans (which I have). I will have to work around what is currently there to install these.

I wopuld like to find a local boatbuilder (even a competent amateur!) to look over the boat and plans and basically and advise if what I am proposing will work.The boat is in Newcastle.

Thanks in advance.Cheers!

Carl

Hi Carl

You do not say what sort of boat it is, Motor boat or yacht, what size what make?? steel, GRP, Wood ??.

A local professional boatbuilder will come at a cost, Tyne Slipway South Shields http://www.ukdocks.com/tyne-slipway/
Can not recommend anyone in Amble!
You could try Phil at http://www.palynch.co.uk/

If I can help I am down at Royal Quays but I mainly specialise in Colvic Watson Motor Sailers

Mike

 

[carl170]

Mike,

She is a small 19ft grp/wooden sailing boat. Hull is grp, cabin and cockpit are wood.

One of the previous owners has decided not to use the recommended structural supports as outlined in the plans (but used his own method, which hasn't work). As a result, she sags when sitting on her keels. This is why I need to put the support back in.

Regards

carl

 

[Caer Urfa]

Mike,

She is a small 19ft grp/wooden sailing boat. Hull is grp, cabin and cockpit are wood.

One of the previous owners has decided not to use the recommended structural supports as outlined in the plans (but used his own method, which hasn't work). As a result, she sags when sitting on her keels. This is why I need to put the support back in.

Regards

carl

Hi Carl

If you have the 'original plans' then I would work to them, but does the plans show the position of the bulkheads and longitudinal structral supports stringers etc as these are usually part of the hull GRP moulding.

If you know where the cross supports and bulkheads should go then they can be added using hardwood templates/profiles and then glassed in, BUT, you can do a lot of damage removing existing bulkheads etc.

If the boat is quote 'sagging' sounds like you need longitudinal strengthening and maybe a bulkhead, however do not remove any bulkheads which are under the mast.

Sorry it's difficult to say without seeing the boat and the problem first hand and many a fine boat has been ruined by a keen DIY nut case.

One other option is if you know the type of boat you have come on this site to find other boat owners with the same type who may also be able to help you of how their boats constructed.

Mike

 

[carl170]

Mike,

I would be adding bulkheads and leave the existing ones in. The mast compression post would be left in too.

The boat is chined and what someone has done is to sort of line the hull with a sheet of ply. But they have glued it flush on the chine side and then glassed it in to the two runners going down the centre of the bilges. This has left the ply with a one inch tapering gap. The keels have then been fitted using a mish mash of wood that does not appear to offer ny real support. When the boat takes any weight on the keels, the ply flexes, as does the hull (because of the gap). I think the the box section of the berths stops the whole thing from collapsing (All the floorboards lock tight, and you cannot lift them.)

Its kind of like if you took two credit cards and glued them together with two matchsticks in between them at each end. Any pressure to the mddle caused the surfaces to touch. Sorry this is really difficult to explain!


My idea is to cut gaps in the ply and reinstate the berth bulkheads and the V shaped bilge supports (there are none of these at the minute). As I cannot access the bilges, these will have to be done whe the boat is afloat.


Thanks for your suggestions so far.

Regards

 

[Caer Urfa]

Mike,

I would be adding bulkheads and leave the existing ones in. The mast compression post would be left in too.

The boat is chined and what someone has done is to sort of line the hull with a sheet of ply. But they have glued it flush on the chine side and then glassed it in to the two runners going down the centre of the bilges. This has left the ply with a one inch tapering gap. The keels have then been fitted using a mish mash of wood that does not appear to offer ny real support. When the boat takes any weight on the keels, the ply flexes, as does the hull (because of the gap). I think the the box section of the berths stops the whole thing from collapsing (All the floorboards lock tight, and you cannot lift them.)

Its kind of like if you took two credit cards and glued them together with two matchsticks in between them at each end. Any pressure to the mddle caused the surfaces to touch. Sorry this is really difficult to explain!


My idea is to cut gaps in the ply and reinstate the berth bulkheads and the V shaped bilge supports (there are none of these at the minute). As I cannot access the bilges, these will have to be done whe the boat is afloat.

Thanks for your suggestions so far.
Regards

Hi Carl
When you say Keels do I read that you are referring to Twin Bilge keels?

During my 'Pre Buying Inspection Visits' of Colvic Watsons I have found a number of badley fitted bilge keels and unless fitted correctly they can do a lot of damage to the hull as most of the boats weight can come down on just one side at times depending on the river bed.

Your proposal sounds ok but where or if you have bilge keels fitted you should have the inside bilge area with a much thicker backing plate and you will need access to the bilge keel bolts.

In other areas one idea maybe is to drill a hole at the top of the laminated areas and pour/pump down 'pre mixed resin' and fill it, this would then set hard and save hacking out the plywood.

Adding additional bulk head ribs will again add strength and better if glassed in, but keep an eye on the weight you are adding as displacement may be your next problem, you may also have to add some ballast to compensate.

Either way not a five minute job but should be worth while

Mike

 

[carl170]

Mike,

I had thought about pouring some type of filler in , but decided against it because of the weight and also I don’t think it would bond - all the surfaces I have poked about were filthy – the spaces under the holes I drilled yesterday were bone dry, but they were really dirty. Bearing in mind that the keels were put on 15-20 years ago, all this muck has been glassed in!

The boat is a caprice and it is a model 4. The model 4 was available for home completion, but included a set of plans for the model 2 to guide the home builder. The model 2 plans shows two longitudinal stringers which the keels bolt to, with a series of partial bulkheads. However, not all builders adhered to this and other model 4’s have a either a grid of glassed in wood, or a series of stringers set like this:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/65801449@N07/5990625402/in/photostream

The Stringers in the pic above look about 2-2.5 inches wide and maybe an inch thick.

As the ones above are still going strong, I need to think along these lines.

The obvious thing would be to rip it all out and start from scratch, however, I don’t know how the hell you would stop the boat from collapsing on itself, and also, this would probably take up most of the season, if not the one after that too!

I too would be at North Shields, if I could afford the fees! Out on the North Sea in 20 minutes, instead of 2-3 hours. The boat is based at Newburn by the way.

Regards

Carl

 

[Caer Urfa]

Mike,

I had thought about pouring some type of filler in , but decided against it because of the weight and also I don’t think it would bond - all the surfaces I have poked about were filthy – the spaces under the holes I drilled yesterday were bone dry, but they were really dirty. Bearing in mind that the keels were put on 15-20 years ago, all this muck has been glassed in!

The boat is a caprice and it is a model 4. The model 4 was available for home completion, but included a set of plans for the model 2 to guide the home builder. The model 2 plans shows two longitudinal stringers which the keels bolt to, with a series of partial bulkheads. However, not all builders adhered to this and other model 4’s have a either a grid of glassed in wood, or a series of stringers set like this:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/65801449@N07/5990625402/in/photostream

The Stringers in the pic above look about 2-2.5 inches wide and maybe an inch thick.

As the ones above are still going strong, I need to think along these lines.

The obvious thing would be to rip it all out and start from scratch, however, I don’t know how the hell you would stop the boat from collapsing on itself, and also, this would probably take up most of the season, if not the one after that too!

I too would be at North Shields, if I could afford the fees! Out on the North Sea in 20 minutes, instead of 2-3 hours. The boat is based at Newburn by the way.

Regards

Carl

Hi Carl

Well you sure have a bit of work to do looking at the pictures.

• First point what looks like 'allthread' I would not use this for Keel bolts as far as I know it's not HT like a bolt.

• I would also add small bulkheads in between the two main longitudinal stringers to add strength to the kell area with a central drain hole so water will run aft hopefully to a bilge pump.

• Not sure if it is just a scratch or in the last picture is that a crack in the bulkhead starboard side? if yes it must be fully repaired.

What I cannot tell is if the side bulk head strenthens go all the way up the sides 'inside' the plywood.

I would post again on here but for Caprice 4 owners who hopefully can photograph their own boats internals for you which will be the best guide for you,

Good luck
Mike

 

[carl170]

Mike,

The pics are NOT my boat! It was the structural side I was looking at.

Sorry for the confusion! I should have made that clear.

Cheers

Carl

 

[carl170]

Mike,

I have been studying the plans for a day or two now and had a poke around the boat. I think there is enough support for the keels. The reason the central bilge boards tighten is because the berth frames are not glassed in!. They are just screwed to 2 of the stringers! I will do this over the summer and I think the problem will be solved.

Thanks for your input though!

Regards

Carl

 

[ianj99]

Hi Carl

Can not recommend anyone in Amble!

Mike

and you'd need to have very deep pockets!
Pity the many poor unsuspecting yachties whose keels have caught the harbour bar and needed repair. Makes you wonder whether the lack of dredging was deliberate since the yard owner was also a harbour commissioner!

Amble Boatyard did employ expert boat builders but the last of them is probably long since retired by now. (Peter Banks)

I