boat models and lengths

[lanerboy]

Hi all

I am a little confused regards boat models and size, i have just been looking at a targa 37 which i thought was 37ft long but it says overall length its 42.5ft is this correct and are all boats longer than there model number??????

Thanks again in advance everyone

 

[Whitelighter]

Because the details in sales adverts are entered in by individuals.

You can measure length over all (loa), length water line (lwl), hull length or just you best guess sometimes.

A targa 37 is not 42.5ft, however you measure it unless you have a f*cking big anchor.

If you think that's confusing, just wait until you get to tonnage

 

[lanerboy]

Was thinking more for mooring costs as at 42ft thats£450 more than a 37ft boat

 

[lynall]

On mine a Sprint they dont seem to count the bathing platform, and call it a 21 when in fact its 23, well so my marina tells me maybe the same with all boats with platforms?


Lynall

 

[lisilou]

Unless it has a 4.5 ft swim platform fitted, the Targa 37 is just shy of 38ft.
L

 

[Spi D]

As mentioned in another post, measures are not given by any standard methods.

You may even see models change length (as per model name) when an update design is released on an else unchanged hull.

Mooring fees are most often calcultated by the actual length, overall. Including sterndrives, platforms, anchors, davits and bowsprits. If mooring between poles the actual area is used, but again the berth must fit the boat.

Beam figures are normally reliable.

 

[jfm]

1. Don't go by adverts for used boats. Duff data entered by advetisers
2. Dont go by model lenght in thr nme of the boat. They are chosen for marketing reasons. Sunseekers are often bigger than the nominal name for example
3. Remeber some of the lenght might be swim platform rahter than real boat
4. Beware even manufacturer's own websites. Their marketing bods don't understnad technical things sometimes, bless 'em. Eg Fairline quotes "length overall including gunwhale". WTF - "including gunwhale" is an oxymoron. Theey might mean "pulpit", which is a different thing from a gunwhale. And for my boat they also quote "length from bow to aft end of bathing platform" when what thay actually mean is to front edge of up/down platform, ie the length excluding the bathing platform

So there is some pretty poor info out there. You're better asking on here when you've narrowed your choice down! Tread carefully anyway. If you want to see what boat you're getting for your money displacement is also a useful additional indicator (excluding fuel and ballast)

 

[jfm]

As mentioned in another post, measures are not given by any standard methods.

You may even see models change length (as per model name) when an update design is released on an else unchanged hull.

Mooring fees are most often calcultated by the actual length, overall. Including sterndrives, platforms, anchors, davits and bowsprits. If mooring between poles the actual area is used, but again the berth must fit the boat.

Beam figures are normally reliable.

SpiD, ref your picture, there is not a universal rule that LOA excludes the pulpit overhang. The website boatingbasicsonline has no particular authority or status so they are no more able to pontificate than say this forum. There just is no consistency on LOA. I'd generally use "LOA" to refer to length including the pulpit

 

[Spi D]

I know and agree. I believe my text indicated that measures are not given by any standard methods.

The picture was for stating that LOA and LWL can be very different.

The space needed to moor a boat ofcourse includes all and everything.

 

[petem]

SpiD, ref your picture, there is not a universal rule that LOA excludes the pulpit overhang. The website boatingbasicsonline has no particular authority or status so they are no more able to pontificate than say this forum. There just is no consistency on LOA. I'd generally use "LOA" to refer to length including the pulpit

I agree. Don't most marinas include Pulpit in their length calc?

 

[lanerboy]

Just had a quote off marina for a targa 37 they never asked me the length of the boat i just told them the make and model


If i turn up with my boat will they then get a tape measure out and start measuring it

If i ask for price prior in writting then do they have to honor this price

Thanks again

 

[petem]

I've certainly heard of marinas measuring boats to ensure they are not undercharging (particularly when people are taking the piss). However if I told them the model and they worked out the length for themselves then I'd think you're pretty safe (once the berthing contract is signed).

Which marina is it? Other might know how strict they are.

One other tip, make sure they give you a decent berth.

 

[Tranona]

As already suggested there is no consistency in the way measurements are used in a marketing sense, although there is an ISO standard that is used when filing the data on the boat to conform to the RCD.

Most marinas accept the length you say, or are familiar with the boat so will use their own figure. Others measure, particularly if the boat is on the margins of berth size and may include pulpits, platforms, davits etc. In Europe, if you are a visitor they generally rely on the length shown on the registration document, but some also charge by area (L*B) and some charge by berth size irrespective of size of boat. As the length on the SSR is what you declare on the form, it makes sense to keep it under the known breaks (eg 10m or 12m) if this is realistic..

 

[Piers]

We had to get a definition of LOA to make sure we were applying the COLREG sound signalling rules for the four diffrerent boat lengths, correctly.

We approached the MCA and the IMO for their definition of LOA. It was,

"The length overall (loa) of the vessel is measured from the foremost part of the stem to the aftermost part of the stern, including any fixed projections extending beyond the stem and stern."

The word 'fixed' is interesting, since, for example, a retractable swim platform or bowsprit would not be taken into account.

 

[jfm]

We had to get a definition of LOA to make sure we were applying the COLREG sound signalling rules for the four diffrerent boat lengths, correctly.

We approached the MCA and the IMO for their definition of LOA. It was,

"The length overall (loa) of the vessel is measured from the foremost part of the stem to the aftermost part of the stern, including any fixed projections extending beyond the stem and stern."

The word 'fixed' is interesting, since, for example, a retractable swim platform or bowsprit would not be taken into account.

The word "fixed" isn't clear. I'd expect many bowsprits on bigger boats would be fixed. An up/down platform is debatable - it moves so in that sense it is not fixed, but as it moves it does not appreciably reduce the LOA so you'd think the draftsman didn't intend to exclude it. Hmmm. Clear as mud!

I'm not worried though - I've specced a really loud horn rated to 75m LOA for my next boat

 

[Piers]

The word "fixed" isn't clear. I'd expect many bowsprits on bigger boats would be fixed. An up/down platform is debatable - it moves so in that sense it is not fixed, but as it moves it does not appreciably reduce the LOA so you'd think the draftsman didn't intend to exclude it. Hmmm. Clear as mud!

I'm not worried though - I've specced a really loud horn rated to 75m LOA for my next boat

I'ts interesting you've raised the qn re 'fixed'. I emailed them this morning for a definition of 'fixed' and will let you know what cones back.

The horn you've specified is loud - and I really mean LOUD.

 

[wakeup]

I've specced a really loud horn rated to 75m LOA for my next boat

Are horns rated to boat length not db?

 

[MapisM]

An up/down platform is debatable

Is it? An up/down platform should always be considered in LOA, afaik.
But Piers mentioned "retractable swim platform", which is a very different thing.
Actually, there are just a very few boats with platforms sliding out from the stern (which is what "retractable" reminds me), but in some big stuff it's not unusual to see the whole stern hinged at its bottom, opening to create a huge platform. I would think that those platforms fit the "retractable" concept, but not the hi/low ones.

 

[MapisM]

The horn you've specified is loud - and I really mean LOUD.

Out of curiosity, do you specify a minimum safe distance from points reachable by anyone onboard, for that sort of stuff?
IIRC, the arch on theSq78 is not that high, so I guess it's not easy to place the horn in a place where you are 100% sure to not blow a passing crew member's ear out...

 

[Piers]

Are horns rated to boat length not db?

Hi wakup,

The following defines what's required for sound signalling, and applies to all boats 12m LOA and over. Just to make the point, that's whether they are leisure, commercial, coded, whatever - it doesn't matter. It's every vessel over 12m.

Vessels 12-<20m which requires a frequency of 250-700Hz at 120dB
Vessels 20-75m which requires a frequency of 250-700Hz at 130dB
Vessels 75-200m which requires a frequency of 130-350Hz at 138dB
Vessels >200m which requires a frequency of 70-200Hz at 143dB

The full requirement definition is here: http://www.kahlenberg.co.uk/imo-sound-signal-requirements