Boat electrics

[mulligan]

I have recently re-built a yacht in Cyprus but am struggling to get the electrics done out there. I want a simple system and have thought about doing them myself, can anyone recomend any books to assist my with this.

Regards

Ross

 

[heerenleed]

Mastervolt must have one. I have it here in the Netherlands. It is in Dutch, of course, but I cannot imagine that they have no English version. Have a look at their web site at www.mastervolt.com
There is an English version.
Of course, their book is ment to promote their products, but it gives very good technical information which is of much use, even if you don't use their stuff.

good luck


Peter a/b SV Heerenleed, Steenbergen, Netherlands

 

[ccscott49]

Theres a book called the 12 volt bible, don't know the author, but it has everything you need to know, somebody here will know where to get it. I would reccomend you get hold of Index Marines, catalogue, it has everything you will need to do the job. I would also reccomend you use only "tinned" copper cable and crimp on connections for your wiring connections and when you buy/make a switch panel leave about ten spare switches/holes for stuff you have yet to buy and fit, I garuantee there will be stuff, also I would draw up a wiring diagram/plan before I start and mark every wire with either its name or a number and reference it, maplins would also be a useful supplier of stuff, including the marking number/letter stuff and gold plated busbar and fuse holders, (from car audio) for critical stuff like autopilot etc. (totally non corrosive) Hop this helps you, best of luck.

 

[mickp]

Try the 12 Volt Bible for boats by Miner Brotherton, available from Amazon

 

[Forbsie]

I read an article in one of the mags earlier this year about a new connector system that pierces the PVC to make a connection to the cable, sort of like an RJ45 connector does. I recall it also used epoxy to bond cable and connector together. These were sold by either Maplin or Radio Spares with the idea that they were much safer than crimp or bare wire and busbars. I can't find the article anywhere nor can I find these things on either site. Any ideas?

 

[ccscott49]

Sounds a good idea, but do you get enough contact area, for electronics its no problem, but current carrying cables?

 

[Forbsie]

If I could find the article, I would be on a better footing but I'm sure that these were designed for power rather than instrumentation data. I fully see your point though. Like Mulligan, I will be installing the electrics afresh and want to ensure that I use the best components available but as with any Microsoft product, I don't want to be the first to use them!

As ever, being the novice that I am, at most things :-( I am grateful for all advice i.e. I didn't know you could get gold-plated busbars. My main worry is that if I ever eventually meet you, I'll be due you a bottle of malt that costs more than the boat is worth. ;-)

 

[ccscott49]

Don't worry about the malt, we'll get Ferrier to put it on his expenses, or mine, then he can sign them! Personally I like to be able to SEE my connections, clean them and refit, it's maybe an old fashioned way of looking at things, but.... The gold connections are used by these guys with motorised stereos, for no loss connections for speakers and cd's and all that guff! but of course are excellent conductors and corrosion free. They are also not expensive, because they are not marine!

 

[jollyjacktar]

Good brass buzz bars are adequate, one for all the +ve connections, the other for all the -ve connections, solder all terminals to the wires, label all the wires, really quite simple, draw up a diagram first. Feed mains to +ve and -ve buzz bars, fuses in circuits each separate line if possible, direct wire radio transmitter, all other feeds thru main feed circuits thru main battery selecter switch to buzz bar. I think I had better stop, seemed simple to start out with now I have written this seems to be confusing. But if you are unfamiliar with electrical things get the book. My recommendation though is solder terminal joints do not rely on crimps.

It is worth doing the DIY as then you will be familiar if you have an emergency. Good luck

 

[ccscott49]

Don't solder the joints, unless you want them to corrode and make the ends of the wires stiff, so they can fracture with vibration even in the auto motive world they now crimp, and in electronics. I said use gold terminals for the critical circuits, why use brass, which will corrode and make a bad connection, when you can use gold plated, which you will find is not much more expensive and will never corrode? Think about it.

 

[Rowana]

Couldn't agree more. Don't use solder
I work in the offshore oil & gas industry & it's all crimped connections.....
Now there's a hostile environment.....
Need I say more ......

Jim

 

[ccscott49]

Funnily enough, I'm offshore on the Ekofisk, right now!!
I've been trying to get this message through for a dozen times, but there you go, everybody has opinions, right or wrong.

 

[ToMo]

Hasn't anyone heard of or tried these: http://www.posi-lock.co.uk/

 

[andyball]

How much ?

they probably work ok, but what a price! (£1.28 for 2 inline connectors).

I use tin-plated brass bullets/receptacles from wurth/amp/vehicle wiring products, with clear "splashproof" covers,but you do need a crimp tool.

 

[Guest]

Add "marine" to anything innocuous and triple the price. "Marine" bog roll anyone?

 

[jollyjacktar]

In 45 years of boating and vehicle motor maintenance the most failures I have encountered are through improperly crimped connections. Done properly these do not give too much of a problem. But there is a proper way to do this. Do you know how? I can spot a good solder job and a poor one.

I have NEVER had a good solder connection fail on me yet. Stiff wires???!!!! how much do you solder, a foot or two????. The solder joint does not need to go beyond the stiff connector lug that is being soldered. Quel horreur!

As for Brass vs Gold, sure, do not use brass if you intend to expose your wiring to the elements, but if you do or you intend to run semi-submerged most of the time well maybe gold plated may give you something extra, it is very fashionable and as well you can then brag at the bar of your sailing club that all onboard electrics are gold plated. I am sure that you will be admired and worshipped. I have even seen some boats with gold-plated battery connecting lugs real posh they are too and match the gold plated spa pool taps. And as well the marine chandlers will welcome your bank account at all corners of the compass.

If you are worried about brass corrosion, smear a thin layer of vaseline over the completed connections. If brass buzz bars were not suitable they would not be on sale.

All that glitters is not gold.

 

[ccscott49]

Hey! Buy the correct crimping pliers, not the crap sold on the market, proper proffesional ones! Buy your connections gold or otherwise from maplins, non marine! The statement that they woulodnt sell brass ones if they weren't any good is naive in the extreme! They sell an awful lot of gear that is no good, just because its always worked, doesn't mean it cant be improved with new techniques and materials, get your head out of the sand! The crimped connection is superior, the proffesionals amongst us know that. Please lets not go on, I'm not going to answer anymore, just ends up a slanging match, "i've been doing this for years and its never failed"

 

[Paulka]

I fully agree with ccscott.
I worked for 30 years in power plants construction and maintenance, and can guarantee you that soldered connection is just a "no-no"!
Of course, the right tools, though expensive, are a must.
You will be rewarded, with a long, long time without any failure!

If it's worth doing it, it's worth doing it the right way.

Paul

 

[andyball]

hell\'s bells

even motorcycles/cars stopped using plain brass connectors 'cos of all the corrosion prob's........."tin plated" is std. now, likely ok for a busbar in a closed electrics panel tho'.

I've not seen many solder type terminals (except for some multiway conn's) around. In rather less than 45 years I've seen most every type of connection fail/corrode : clearly they were all unsuitable/shouldn't have been for sale/were not made by an expert.

 

[Trevethan]

Until a few days ago I knew nothing of boat electrics. However thanks to the guys here, a book called Basic Boat Electrics, and about 4 hours messing with a multimeter, I now have the basis of a reliable electrical system, As opposed to the speaker wire the previous owner employed.

The principles are pretty straightforward and providing you plan what you are doing, think about it while you are doing, use good quality connectors and wiring and test thoroughly while making up the system, you shouldn't go too far wrong.

Given the poor quality of the existing wiring, I found it easiest to rip it out and start again. I did try testing the old wiring using a spare battery. The loss through resistance was amazing. Having replaced the cable on the running lights with proper stuff they seem at least twice as bright as before.


Good luck and enjoy.

Regards,

Nick