Boat denigration

[byron]

Watching but not adding to the Sealine Saga made me wonder. If someone says "I don't like Birchwoods because I think they're rubbish" or somethink like "I think Sealines are poop" surely that is a view they are entitled to and cannot be pursued by a Solicitor for having had that opinion, whether or not they have added the 'IMHO' to the message.
I mean, I think the dolphin nose on earlier Sealines is 'orrible, almost as bad as Syd in his underpants. As for Birchwoods I loathe the later ones. Surely this is a fair comment and I am entitled to my point of view.
To put it another way, do I get nasty when youse guys say I am far too attractive to be a mere human and likened to a Greek God.
My wife always says that when she married me I had the body of an ancient Greek God and now I have the body of an ancient Greek. I'm not sure what she means but I think she is saying something nice.

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[NorthernWave]

Dolphin nose and dolphin tail radar arch. (What are they on, it's a boat???)

)

My Birchwood is an 88 does that mean it's nice???

Chris

Relaxation starts at the pontoon gate

 

[jfm]

Elegance personified

I'm sure you're fine if you are stating an opinion or stating fact. For example, Bwoods have been likened to Reliant Robin on this forum. Is that a fact? You decide.......

Funny thing is, the caption below this pic on the Bwood website is "Elegance personified". Jeeze, they just dont get it do they?

 

[kimhollamby]

Views such as that are fine. But as you know people come on here and are looking for deeper value judgements than whether it looks nice. They wouldn't really be asking unless they thought they liked, or at least could live with, the look.

The only area I really have an issue with are inaccurate blanket statements such as "don't buy one of those, they always suffer from major structural problems" or the like. We've had a few posts like that recently and it doesn't really help the enquirer or the forum as a whole in the long run. And before anyone rises to the bait, I have absolutely no-one in mind when saying that. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Another point made on here recently is that manufacturers should be grateful for the critical feedback. Perhaps they are but if the criticism isn't balanced then you are never going to get manufacturers to take comments seriously because, being blunt, they won't place a very high value on this place. Their loss, you might say, but if you read the genuine expressions posted recently that people here want to see things improved then perhaps it is our loss also.

Hopefully that clarifies. Doesn't stop any of the fun but does perhaps indicate that there are moments when it is helpful to be a bit serious about it too. For my part really enjoyed the latest 'Sardine' thread and spent far too much of my day contributing to it.

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[hlb]

Re: Elegance personified

Ha,ha ha,pthth ha, ha, ah, pthhahahahahahahahahahah/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif

<font color=red> No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Haydn

 

[jfm]

Re: Root cause of ugly boats?

Praps we should blame fibreglass. If it didn't exist, and everything was plywood, people wouldn't be able to make this kind of stuff

 

[lanason]

In the interests of a balanced view - are only negative comments an issue ??

If I was to say xyz was wonderful, no structural problems, handles as sweet as a nut, never breaks down etc ..... would it be regarded in the same light.

Would I get a lawyers letter saying "actually our boats do sometimes breakdown" or "we have had structrual problems" ???

Errrr I wonder ...........

Who said John Major was a nice guy - where are the writs against him ?????

Adrian

/forums/images/icons/smile.gif <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.arweb.co.uk/argallery/kelisha>Kelisha Pics</A> /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[boatone]

Re: Elegance personified

Oh dear, I fear I am about to start a mild spate of hysteria in some quarters when I say.....wots wrong wiv it?

As a photographer, I think the picture itself is clicheed beyond belief (tobacco grad filters ....yuk) but the boat itself looks no better and no worse to me than many of the other fibreglass modernisms that seem to abound nowadays....no names cos they all look much the same to me!

I am an unashamed traditionalist and to me boats should look like boats. Plastic bubbles, however streamlined their appearance, hold little charm for me, personally, but I certainly have no problem with others liking them. Some practical aspects of modern design I do find at odds with my own views on boat handling and safety. Not being able to reach the foredeck from the cockpit, without going down below and up thru the forehatch, I find particularly irritating and many first time buyers I have spoken to on the Thames have confirmed this is something they wish theyd had more knowledge about before their enthusiastic purchase.

As far as 'the knuckle' is concerned, what is it that incenses some folk so much? I actually quite like it visually - but then I like Nelson 42's and Linssen Sturdy's so I suppose that says it all, really!

We bought the Princess 32 cos swmbo fell in love with the huge cockpit although, at first I was a bit concerned that it didnt fit my traditional 'image' as much as I'd have liked. After a season's use, I'm happy to say her judgement was great - the cockpit is the best thing since sliced bread and I will have a problem deciding what to replace it with if and when the time comes!

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[simongoldthorpe]

Re: Elegance personified

It's a shame they didn't describe the background. Where is it? Could the architecture be described as ' early pool's winner period '?

 

[byron]

Re: Elegance personified

/forums/images/icons/wink.gif I must say the jelly mould background goes well with the jelly mould design. IMHO of course /forums/images/icons/laugh.gif

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[tcm]

Various canned fish

Fair enough.

But a large number of newbie posts ask exactly that - the image, the looks and so on. In early stages many are blind what looks good and what doesn't. Small children have the same blindness to almost evrything

Now, some journos v wary bout giving subjective judgements re looks of boats. But there is lots of agreeemt amongst everyone at least within the same geographical regin or country: Marilyn Munro, E-type jags, many ferraris, and the cities of Paris and Venice are evidently v good-looking.

From MBY this month, I'd say the Rodman is bit nasty-looking for a 55footer, whereas AZ55 easily best looking of the bunch.

 

[kimhollamby]

No, you wouldn't get a lawyer's letter. But if you kept posting wonderous prose about a specific product or boat I would take an interest in where you were coming from. Hidden agendas are not especially useful for positive or negative comment.

It is true that most boat owners are likely to be a bit biased regarding their own craft. Not only do they mostly like their boats but also they literally have an expensive investment to protect.

Anyway, that kind of thing has not been much of an issue here, has it? Apart with Soltron perhaps and I guess for whatever bizarre reason I've given up trying to deal with that /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[tcm]

Re: atlantis?

is it the new development on bermuda or carribee somewhere. Very rich, unnecessary and trashy i understand. Somebody's bound to know?

 

[tcm]

Re: boatone

ah buit you confirm the point. jfm has seriously considered a birchwood from a buyers and and engineers point ofview and has developed an eye for form and function. With different expertise, you have developed an even more expert eye for what a good and badly-take picture looks like having seen zillions. Does it not make sense that a not-so-good photographer is also selected by the same company that obviously likes the nasty boat appearance - and the trashy architecture too come to that...

 

[halcyon]

No I think the problem is global generalisation.
To say Sealine are poop because an individual does not like 18 inches of fibre glass moulding at front, does not mean every boat built is useless. So why not say I think the anchor storage on the Sealine looks poop is fine, the third party can say yes I agree or no I love it. If you owned a boat and the doors fell of because half the screws were missing is fair complant, it means that everyone with one can check there's, or someone buying one can check the one they intend to buy.
There's loads of boats I would not touch, just because I do not like there looks, but that is just my personal view, and see no point in in telling a potential buyer not to buy it because it's crap.

One day in the future you may be sitting typing " were have all the British power boat builders gone ", all we have are these cheap Bav or sweedish ones we cannot afford. After all the yachties did it with the Britsish yacht builders, and look at there choice to-day.

Brian

 

[lanason]

Kim - your quite right.

I do get fed upset with the "Blame Culture" that appears to gripping us with the added American twang. Have you had an accident ?? phone 0000-0000--0000 and sue the pants off them.

How do we get a balance back - Here, you provide that morale judgement but how can we re-create that balance in business and in wider society. If I offer to help you tie a boat up would I get sued if the rope came loose.

Where are the role models that our kids can look up to. Who in the boating industry is a role model ????

I think MBM does a good job of setting a standard but where else is behaviour more important than a fast buck ???

Adrian

/forums/images/icons/smile.gif <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.arweb.co.uk/argallery/kelisha>Pics of Kelisha</A> /forums/images/icons/crazy.gif

 

[jfm]

Re: atlantis?

No, it's not Atlantis. That's full of megayahchts but this pic isn't. Must be somewhere similar. bottle of Balvenie praps?

 

[kimhollamby]

Re: Various canned fish

'Looks'...ummm...okay, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, is it not?

Always remember one of the very first issues of MBM we tested a Halmatic Azure (what you might ask, not many built to be sure). It had a pink interior that was like an inverted furry dice, not the kind of thing I would personally want to wake up to (or invite friends into) but there you are. Owners thought it wonderful and got far more upset than builder when we criticised.

Were we wrong? Probably not but it was an easy call. In many other cases the choices are more subtle and there is not necessarily a right or wrong and in any event, surely 'the look' is the relatively easy part for anyone to make their mind up about.

I really don't need Clarkson to tell me that a Ferrari is the sexiest thing on four wheels but on the other hand it would be nice if he, once in a while during his tenure at Top Gear, had provided some objective facts about the cars that were more likely than not were going to be on my next company vehicle options list. That instead of five minutes of film with 20 poses snoozing on the bonnet of vehicle X, Y or Z because it was boring. Fun, after a fashion, but not helpful.

'Image' however is perhaps another thing again. Now you are into light the blue touch paper time. You can take the whizz out of car builders all you like and they'll live with it; I doubt they even notice it; indeed they can even survive it with honours as Skoda has proven. But the boatbuilding industry is tiny in comparison -- if you go for the corporate jugular you are in effect going for the singular personality more often than not and that is why it can get particularly sparky.

What does your boat say about you? I guess forum members will feel that there is a very legitimate role they can play in this area with regard to educating newcomers, one that I suspect might not make my life any easier. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Instead of triggering answers to the last par I would genuinely like to know views on the following: do people these days buy boat brands according to brand image, like labelled clothing or fashion accessories, or did we leave that all behind in the late 1980s?

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[hlb]

What you and Kim seem to forget. Is, this forum is called. Motor Boat Chat. And some times thats just what we do. Chat. Othertimes, when the mood takes us. We ramble on in great detail on our chosen subject. We are not here for our jurnalisic talents, nor do we ge paid. So we do not feel that we have to be graphicaly correct all the time. Far easier just to say it's crap that go waffling on in great detail.
Might waffle on a bit about that picture JFM has posted. Not sure I know enough expleteths though!!

<font color=red> No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Haydn

 

[jfm]

Haydn, I just called Birchwood for you. They will be very happy to take your Princess in part ex for the boat in the photo, they have one in stock to deliver to Plymouth next week, so go on what are you waiting for!