Bavaria Yachts

Squeaky said:
Good morning:

I have just received an e-mail with three attachments showing the bow of a Bavaria 46 (2007) which had been ripped off. The message stated:

This is a Bavaria 46 (2007). It was sailing in the sheltered bay of Poros with a maximum wind speed of 20 kts and flat water.

As you can see, a section of the bow tore off still attached to the forestay and the mast came down. Luckily no one was hurt.

If this is the way yachts are built today we are all at risk.

I have sailed (motored) a yacht in to a quay-side at 8 kts and the results were nowhere near like this. I didn't even manage to hole the yacht!!!

In the past yachts were "over built" yet they weigh the same as yachts today.

So why do we sail this ****.... time to make some changes, don't you think?


I have read the instructions for posting an image however for some reason the box "manage attachments" does not react when I click on it.

The images which were attached to the e-mail are quite impressive and it would be nice if I could attach them so any suggestions will be welcome. The posting rules indicates that I am permitted to post attachments.

Cheers

Squeaky
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Someone is telling porky's here!
I can shed some light on this, as how it was described by a crew member of one of the other competing, (sorry flotilla) yachts.

About a dozen or more Dutch crewed yachts came into Aegina port on the last Friday, all with numbers on so I assumed and was told they had been racing. The Bavaria in question was in collision with another yacht and sustained some damage to it's bow. The captain was advised not to continue racing but in his wisdom tried a jury rig using his kite uphaul to assist the damaged bow and forestay anchor point.
He was told not to go out again but once again ignored the advice. This is when the bow failed and he became de-masted.
The wind speeds are you have given are correct and probably your appraisal of Bavarias too.
Where I can agree with you on anything about Bravaria it's far quicker to describe their good points rather than bad.
Assuming what I was told was correct which I can't believe any reason for it not to be, then this was down to pure stupidity......!

_________________________________________________________________________
 
If anyone is worried that their bow lay up might be as thin as this, it is easy to have a look at the anchor locker drain holes for reassurance. I have just been down for a look and it is more than twice as thick and that is in a less stressed location.
 
I'm no great Bav supporter but am very suspicious that this sort of post on the www is often part of an attempt to put pressure on the company concerned.. I'd be pretty sure that the boat had previous damage / abuse to have this happen. After all, Its bound to have been out in more than 20kn previously.

Its a bit like the current Toyota claims.

P.S. Went round Northshore when they were finishing off a Southerly 110 and fitting a bow thruster. The apperture had been cut and the laminate at that point was over an inch thick. OK this was at the bottom of the bow but still startling for a modern boat. Poor cost control eh?
 
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Bosun Higgs said:
P.S. Went round Northshore when they were finishing off a Southerly 110 and fitting a bow thruster. The apperture had been cut and the laminate at that point was over an inch thick. OK this was at the bottom of the bow but still startling for a modern boat. Poor cost control eh?
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Was it proper laminate or that sprayed on slurry stuff they tend to use today?
 
Bosun Higgs said:
I'd be pretty sure that the boat had previous damage / abuse to have this happen. After all, Its bound to have been out in more than 20kn previously.
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You are not suggesting that sailing a Bavaria in over 20kn of wind is tantamount to abuse, surely? I thought it needed a bit more than that before their bows (or keels) fell off.

Like shooting fish in a barrel ........
 
manners maketh the man

I read Squeaky's post. It was a copy of an e-mail received .
At no point did HE criticise Bavarias.

Certain posters on here who inferred it was a troll,or that he was lying need to sharpen their pencils and write an apology----and sharpen their wits so they read a post and understand it.:(
 
So, Boat is in collision... skipper is idiot and fails to follow advice... result is loss of stemhead fitting, and rig.

No hint or information that this is anything other than collision damage, no indication in the pictures or otherwise that build is deficient or that laminate quality is poor, or even of method of build.

I do not understand why this sort of rubbish slaggin off of a particular builder goes on. Its really complete *******s.

I have seen Bene's involved in T-bone racing accidents with huge effing holes in the sides... I have seen a Dufour 38 with identical damage show to this boat.. So, lets get one thing straight... IF YOU WHACK YOU BOAT INTO SOMETHING, ITS GONNA GET DAMAGED.

NEXT!
 
Ludd said:
I read Squeaky's post. It was a copy of an e-mail received .
At no point did HE criticise Bavarias.

Certain posters on here who inferred it was a troll,or that he was lying need to sharpen their pencils and write an apology----and sharpen their wits so they read a post and understand it.:(
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Cobblers.

He repeated what is looking like false and malicous hearsay without presenting any supporting evidence. Here's a idea... put up a post asking how to put up pictures... then when that is sorted put up the email and pictures.

That email is hearsay. He published it knowing that was the case. He has to take responsibility.
 
grumpygit said:
Someone is telling porky's here!
I can shed some light on this, as how it was described by a crew member of one of the other competing, (sorry flotilla) yachts.

About a dozen or more Dutch crewed yachts came into Aegina port on the last Friday, all with numbers on so I assumed and was told they had been racing. The Bavaria in question was in collision with another yacht and sustained some damage to it's bow. The captain was advised not to continue racing but in his wisdom tried a jury rig using his kite uphaul to assist the damaged bow and forestay anchor point.
He was told not to go out again but once again ignored the advice. This is when the bow failed and he became de-masted. The wind speeds are you have given are correct and probably your appraisal of Bavarias too.
Where I can agree with you on anything about Bravaria it's far quicker to describe their good points rather than bad.
Assuming what I was told was correct which I can't believe any reason for it not to be, then this was down to pure stupidity......!_________________________________________________________________________
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So just why do the usual suspects engage mouth before brains and spew out the same old same old prejudices?

I don't own a Bavaria and never have so I have no axe to grind other than being very irritated by closed minded people who use every opportunity to have a dig at someone that dares think outside the MAB box.
 
Tch Tch, Photodog, calm down son. You will be having another one of your little do's if you carry on like that. :rolleyes:

You were a little sharp in your first post. We have now had a bit more info from GrumpyGit, (who seems to be anything but that) and abuse to the boat is clearly likely. However, I must admit that I would be dissapointed if that happened to my old Westerly, even after a collision, overtightening the backstay AND carrying on "cruising competitively". But then I am no longer that competitive as I am happy in my skin & don't feel the need to prove anything to anyone.:cool:

Looking at the pics, there looks to have been cracks down the side of the stemhead fitting that perhaps should have sounded alarm bells.
 
Searush said:
However, I must admit that I would be dissapointed if that happened to my old Westerly, even after a collision, overtightening the backstay AND carrying on "cruising competitively".
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If that happened to my Bavaria I would be a little more than dissapointed!:eek::D

I was a bit sharp... but cmon... without putting up the pictures it was pretty bad form... I dont come on here and slag off other folks boats, I think its very bad manners.

Saying bad things about someone elses pride and joy is a really nasty thing.

If there is a real problem... properly evidenced, then fair comment, but for some bizarre reason normally lucid and balanced people feel it is perfectly ok to come on here and make me feel bad about my choice of boat.

I think that is a pretty nasty thing to do.


I think that in this case the OP was being straight... but they should have shown better judgment to avoid the possibility of being called a troll.
 
Now if only it had been a Bavaria belonging to Sunsail being sailed by a Hooray Henry as opposed to a Hoorah Henrikke, then some people's cups would have runneth over bigtime methinks.;);):D

Tim
 
The laminate is not very thick but IMO is perfectly adequate and it didn't fail for being too thin but because there was previous damage.That section of the hull is U shaped which makes it much stronger than another flat area of the same thickness .Many other Bavarias are made to the same specs and don't lose their bows so it makes no sense trying to find a flaw here.
For the record I don't have a Bavaria but a Westerly and the bow area is more or less the same thickness as on this boat.How do I know?I broke it off once!:D
 
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Good afternoon:

Photodog: I don't know who the **** you think you are but I don't think there is anything in the forum rules that gives you the right to dictate how posts should be submitted nor is there anything that states that images MUST accompany posts.

I started with the intention of posting the images so they would accompany the post however the "manage attachment thingy" did not work so I carried on an submitted the text asking for assistance which I received.

You have now seen the images thanks to Searush so you have b****ger all to complain about.

Bad form, my a**e.

Please do me a favour and keep away from any further posts I submit.

Squeaky
 
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Dear Squeaky,

As you can see, Photodog is an oversensitive Bavaria owner, which explains a lot. You have impugned his precious, & he struggles to cope with the fact that you were only trying to help. :D

Photodog,
Can you see into the back of your bow to check for cracks? Does daylight show through it? :confused: :p
 
Squeaky said:
Good afternoon:

Photodog: I don't know who the **** you think you are but I don't think there is anything in the forum rules that gives you the right to dictate how posts should be submitted nor is there anything that states that images MUST accompany posts.

I started with the intention of posting the images so they would accompany the post however the "manage attachment thingy" did not work so I carried on an submitted the text asking for assistance which I received.

You have now seen the images thanks to Searush so you have b****ger all to complain about.

Bad form, my a**e.

Please do me a favour and keep away from any further posts I submit.

Squeaky
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The road to hell is paved with good intentions... You came on and posted a load of hearsay which was specifically designed to rubbish someones pride and joy.

Which, as it turns out from another poster, was blatant cobblers.

I have no complaints about the images... but you should be more carefull about publishing things which are clear hearsay and malicious untruths.

Would you come on here or anywere else and repeat a racist email that you had received?? Of course not, so why would you repeat the one you did being based on as much fact..??

If you come on here, and post rubbish like that, then expect to get challenged over it. Thats what happens here.

Loads of people have problems posting pictures here, and there is lots of help available to get them on-line. The form here is to simply ask for that help... but you simply could not wait to propogate the email could you?

If you come on line and criticise other peoples boats you had better be prepared to take some stick.
 
Ubergeekian said:
Was it proper laminate or that sprayed on slurry stuff they tend to use today?
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No way of knowing since they did the mouldings elsewhere. Mind you it was vinyl resins as well, not the el cheepo ortho types. Should be at 150k I suppose

And the woodwork was out of this world - significantly better than anything I've seen on Swedish boats.
 
Searush said:
Dear Squeaky,


Photodog,
Can you see into the back of your bow to check for cracks? Does daylight show through it? :confused: :p
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I am gonna wait for nite and then shine a VERY powerfull light on the outside... and if that doesnt throw up any problems I am gonna stress test it by suspending the boat from the bow sprit.:D
 
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