Bavaria 34 .... perfomance and suitability for north sea

[smeaks]

I know the reputation of some of the Bavaria fleet... but i suspect some of the critism maybe un founded and mis percieved.

With an interest in upgrading my current Moody i am looking at many options and the Bav is one. Can any current pwners or past owners offer any advice on the performance of these boats?

I am not a racer though do like a little competitive cruising from time to time and sailing in the NE you always need to have confidence to weather the odd blow.

Thanks

 

[lw395]

I've sailed on a charter Bav34.
I'm not convinced that all Bav34s have exactly the same rig, so I would do some research on sail measurements if I were you.
The one I sailed on was an OK AWB, despite being held back by tired sails and a fixed prop.
There may be keel variants too?

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I've sailed on a charter Bav34.
I'm not convinced that all Bav34s have exactly the same rig, so I would do some research on sail measurements if I were you.
The one I sailed on was an OK AWB, despite being held back by tired sails and a fixed prop.
There may be keel variants too?

Definitely, some have them others don't.

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

[/COLOR]

Definitely, some have them others don't.

:encouragement:

 

[coopec]

[/COLOR]

Definitely, some have them others don't.

I wondered why you said that so I did a couple of searches and came up with:

Bavaria lost keel again - Yachting and Boating World
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?317389-Bavaria-lost-keel-again

May 27, 2012 - A well maintained Bavaria 390 Lagoon lost her keel in the middle of the Atlantic on 22. May 2012. Just the waves were enough to separate the ...
Bavaria Keel Problems 17 Nov 2017
Bavaria 39 keel problems 22 Mar 2011
Bavaria 42 Match - keels problem........ 4 Sep 2005
Rimini Harbour Bavaria keel disaster 21 Apr 2017
More results from www.ybw.com

 

[pvb]

I wondered why you said that so I did a couple of searches and came up with:

Bavaria lost keel again - Yachting and Boating World
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?317389-Bavaria-lost-keel-again

May 27, 2012 - A well maintained Bavaria 390 Lagoon lost her keel in the middle of the Atlantic on 22. May 2012. Just the waves were enough to separate the ...
Bavaria Keel Problems 17 Nov 2017
Bavaria 39 keel problems 22 Mar 2011
Bavaria 42 Match - keels problem........ 4 Sep 2005
Rimini Harbour Bavaria keel disaster 21 Apr 2017
More results from www.ybw.com

More useless info from Google! Bavarias are built to very high standards, but like any boat there can be problems as a result of poor maintenance or, in the case of keels, groundings. These are usually the reasons why keels fail on any make of boat.

If you want a more balanced view of the incidence of keel failure, this old thread might open your eyes - https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/lost-keels-request-for-information.39377/

 

[lw395]

TBH, when I was sailing in the Solent a lot, 'Bavaria' was almost a byword for 'sailing school boat'.
Sailing schools do not make a habit of buying fragile boats.

 

[coopec]

More useless info from Google! Bavarias are built to very high standards, but like any boat there can be problems as a result of poor maintenance or, in the case of keels, groundings. These are usually the reasons why keels fail on any make of boat.

If you want a more balanced view of the incidence of keel failure, this old thread might open your eyes - https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/lost-keels-request-for-information.39377/

More useless information from Google!! I suppose you used Google to find that link on boat design?:encouragement:

Seriously: the number of yacht losing their keels is apparently increasing because of the design of yachts these days.

The number of keels lost is increasing and will increase much more in the next years if nothing is made, simply because boats with bolt on keels (almost all today) will become older and the lack of maintenance and the number of damages due to keel grounding will become bigger with time, as well as material fatigue with the results that are to be expected.

https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2018/03/29/keels-falling-off/

This is a very interesting article on keel design:
Choosing a Blue Water Yacht – Keel Type

https://www.grabauinternational.com/news/choosing-a-blue-water-yacht-keel-type/

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I wondered why you said that so I did a couple of searches and came up with:

Bavaria lost keel again - Yachting and Boating World
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?317389-Bavaria-lost-keel-again

May 27, 2012 - A well maintained Bavaria 390 Lagoon lost her keel in the middle of the Atlantic on 22. May 2012. Just the waves were enough to separate the ...
Bavaria Keel Problems 17 Nov 2017
Bavaria 39 keel problems 22 Mar 2011
Bavaria 42 Match - keels problem........ 4 Sep 2005
Rimini Harbour Bavaria keel disaster 21 Apr 2017
More results from www.ybw.com

You obviously missed the

I quite deliberately set the hare running in full knowledge that it would spark once again the argument about Bavarias and keels or lack of. It is quite amusing to follow the responses that tie up quite well with the other contentious arguments about the suitability of light vs heavy displacement yachts for ocean cruising or distance sailing and of course keel type with or without skeg.

Thanks for taking the bait and keeping the ball rolling.:encouragement:

 

[jordanbasset]

Interesting link here which details keel problems
https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/lost-keels-request-for-information.39377/
Fixed Keels/bulbs:
1) Drum-lost keel in Fastnet-Simon le bon- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623
2) Holland 67- Charley- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623 more info helpful
3) Martella(of Finland) 89 Whitbred- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623 more info helpful
4) Warriors Wish-Ronnie Simmons- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623 more info helpful
5) Coyote(20 years ago) http://www.sailingbreezes.com/sailin...rokenseas5.htm
6) Wasabi-18 days ago http://www.cyca.com.au/newsDetail.asp?key=5347
7) Strewth TP 52 March 22, 2008 Rolex China Sea Race http://sailjuiceblog.com/tag/strewth/
8) Cheminee Poujoukat Armor Lux-need more info
9) Heatwave J-80 http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...3-30&dayid=251
10) Excaliber-need more info
11) Excide Challenger 1997 Tony Bullimore-need info
12) Bavaria Match 42 about 2005 Bavaria Match 42 lost its keel...
13) Cape Fear 38 http://www.soundingsonline.com/featu...-for-oversight
14) Moquini http://www.soundingsonline.com/featu...-for-oversight
15) Hooligan V http://www.soundingsonline.com/featu...-for-oversight
16) VM Materiaux-keel bulb -day 58 Vendee -Jean le Cam- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623
17) Pandemonium, Nelson-Marek 66 lost keel on return from 89 Transpac, http://www.iataia.com.mx/modules/06-...ai/results.htm
18) 37' Jenneau lost ballast keel 2002. http://www.sailnet.com/forums/genera...st-keel-2.html
19) Time to Burn - BBW 52
http://maritimenz.govt.nz/Publicatio...report2008.pdf
20) Espana92 AC boat--see pdf below


-----
May be canting keels--need more info:
1) Veolia Environment day 85 Vendee-Roland Jourdain- http://www.latitude38.com/lectronic/...8-17&dayid=623
2) Duracell- Mike Plant- Vendee
3) Skandia- Nick Moloney-Vendee
-----
Canting Keels:
1) Rambler Fastnet 2011
2) Shock 40 inshore race-need more info
3) Ericsson VOR 05-06- need more info
4) Skandia-Sydney Hobart 2004
5) Le Cam -transat-need more info
6) Ecover-Mike Golding-need more info"

Not many Bavarias on that list,

 

[pvb]

Interesting link here which details keel problems

That's the one I included in post 6.

 

[jordanbasset]

That's the one I included in post 6.

Yes sorry

 

[pvb]

Yes sorry

No problem, you went to the trouble of doing the copy & paste. And, as you observed, not many Bavarias on the list!

 

[scottie]

I know the reputation of some of the Bavaria fleet... but i suspect some of the critism maybe un founded and mis percieved.

With an interest in upgrading my current Moody i am looking at many options and the Bav is one. Can any current pwners or past owners offer any advice on the performance of these boats?

I am not a racer though do like a little competitive cruising from time to time and sailing in the NE you always need to have confidence to weather the odd blow.

Thanks

I sailed a lot on one several years ago which had a reasonably good sailing performance an d was ok to live on for 4-5 guys
From memory it did tend to slam a bit and was I always concerned that it would round up to the extent that I avoided helming on the club racing start line (it was the owners names on the insurance)
I don’t recall anything falling off or breaking
We had the mainsail recut to raise the boom as one owner was 6,2 and got fed up ducking
We cruised and club raced on the west of Scotland

 

[pvb]

With an interest in upgrading my current Moody i am looking at many options and the Bav is one. Can any current pwners or past owners offer any advice on the performance of these boats?

Can't comment on the Bavaria 34, but I'm very pleased with my 37. It's exceptionally well built (compared with the Hallberg-Rassy I had before) and there are no creaks or leaks. It just works. Maybe not the fastest, but great for the average cruising owner.

 

[coopec]

This doesn't impress me! (Give me a full length encapsulated keel anytime).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU1qTwkDSjo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmRIrh2hK5U

 

[lw395]

This doesn't impress me!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU1qTwkDSjo

Bulb keel racer gets damaged by charter sailing in shallow water.
Now there's a thing!

I've seen hull damage around the keels on just about every make of racing boat I can think of.
Only in the case of Beneteau has it been tragic.

Of course most Benies are not like the 40.7 and most Bavs are not much like the Match boats.

 

[pvb]

This doesn't impress me! (Give me a full length encapsulated keel anytime).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU1qTwkDSjo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmRIrh2hK5U

One Bavaria Match 42 lost its keel, just one. Bavaria recalled all the Match 42 and Match 38 boats and reinforced the keel attachment area. The boats were designed by J&J, who did the stress calculations for the lay-up, and Bavaria built the boats according to J&J's specs. Obviously J&J's specs were wrong.

 

[jwilson]

This doesn't impress me! (Give me a full length encapsulated keel anytime).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU1qTwkDSjo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmRIrh2hK5U

I think I have said this before, but I've seen more or less the same hull/keel flexing when hanging in the slings on quite a lot of boats including on a Contessa 32 (which has an encapsulated keel and a skeg-hung rudder). Apart from one specific type of Bavaria Match racer there are AFAIK no cruiser Bavarias that have lost keels in normal use - ie not after bad groundings. And there's an awful lot of them about, many doing very high mileages with charter and sailing schools.

Look at the wings of an airliner when on ground with full fuel tanks, and then in the air: then add turbulence and watch them go up and down......

 

[Just_sayin']

You need to buy one of these quality Oysters :

https://www.europeanmarinesurveys.com/2016/01/oyster-825-major-keel-failure-polina-star-111/

and not watch YouTube channels such as SV Compromise or Britaly who are taking themselves and their children to the Med in Bavaria’s.

And as for Patrick Laine, ex-carrier fighter pilot single handed to The Azores, then Shetland and then round Iceland (the country not the store).

In a Bavaria.

Apparently nothing broke.

No, get an Oyster - the safe if expensive choice ?