Battery

STILL AFLOAT said:
No, wrong... They differ, since there is no liquid to spill, dunno what theaters you have ever been in, but a lead acid battery with a couple of AK 47 rounds though it , is a dead battery !
An AGM battery, with a couple of bullet holes in it, makes no difference
nothing leaks out ,and the outboards, start perfectly !
Click to expand...
The last theatre I was in was Wyndham's for Leopoldstadt, but I don't think it is relevant. You clearly use the term "lead-acid battery" to mean only "flooded-type lead-acid battery", while those disagreeing with you use the same term to refer to all batteries using lead plates and an acid electrolyte. The disagreement (as is so often the case) is therefore about the meaning of words.
 
Cotillion !
No, you cannot put a traditional lead acid battery, sideways !
That s like lying an open bottle of beer , on its side !
 
alan_d said:
The last theatre I was in was Wyndham's for Leopoldstadt, but I don't think it is relevant. You clearly use the term "lead-acid battery" to mean only "flooded-type lead-acid battery", while those disagreeing with you use the same term to refer to all batteries using lead plates and an acid electrolyte. The disagreement (as is so often the case) is therefore about the meaning of words.
Click to expand...
So you admit, that a traditional car battery, cannot be laid, on its side , or at an angle, due to leakage ?
Whereas, an AGM battery ( irrespective of chemical composition ) can be mounted, any way , you choose ?
In which case, we do not have anything to argue about !
Ok, supposedly the AGM s can be mounted upside down, but that , I have never tried !
 
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STILL AFLOAT said:
Right, now turn all your batteries upside down !
then in 15 mins, try and start something ............
The only one able to carry on working, will be the AGM !
Click to expand...

Two errors......

If you tip the wet cell battery upside down and wait 15 mins, it will almost certainly start your engine. Maybe not many times :)

AGM batteries are not supposed to be mounted upside down. On their side, yes, but not upside down.

You are also incorrect to say that AGM are not lead acid, they are, it's just that the electrolyte is absorbed into glass fibre matting, making it spill proof.
 
That , comes down to nitpicking, traditional so called Lead Acid batteries, have to be placed on a flat surface.
AGM batteries may have the same chemical composition as Lead Acids, but they can be mounted on end , or sideways , and even shot full of holes , and still work ..... Traditional lead acid batteries ....not at all.
Your supposedly superior technical knowledge, is based on theoretical yadda yada, whereas my responses, are based on real life experiences ! That, makes all the difference !
Rather like those record players, that promise 0,001 WoW & Flutter !
Sounds good, but in actuality the human ear , cannot hear any difference !
 
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STILL AFLOAT said:
That , comes down to nitpicking, traditional so called Lead Acid batteries, have to be placed on a flat surface.
AGM batteries may have the same chemical composition as Lead Acids, but they can be mounted on end , or sideways , and even shot full of holes , and still work ..... Traditional lead acid batteries ....not at all.
Your supposedly superior technical knowledge, is based on theoretical yadda yada, whereas my responses, are based on real life experiences ! That, makes all the difference !
Rather like those record players, that promise 0,001 WoW or Flutter !
Sounds good, but in actuality the human ear , couldnt hear any difference !
Click to expand...

Yes, of course, your real life experience would be vastly greater than mine. It's not like i do this for a living, is it ?
 
If you Sikaflex a lid on a bucket of water, to stop the water leaking out if the bucket is on its side, it's still a bucket of water :)
 
Yes, true, but a bucket of water, will not, start your engine ?
Whereas a modern sideways mounted AGM battery, will work every time !
Everyone knows, water , will not start an engine ?
Your comment sort of makes you look dubious !
Especially as you , supposedly , do this for a living ?
 
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RichardS said:
I think that AGM batteries are also lead acid. :unsure:

Richard
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Quite correct, but technology has moved on. AGM - Absorbed Glass Mat allows the plates to be constantly wetted so the chemical action continues at any attitude.

One of my race bikes used a small AGM slotted under the seat like a car radio in a dashboard, on its side. Some production motorcycles ditto.

I have some improved AGM's - spiral wound technology - on the boat.

Lead Acid flooded cells should remain, if possible, upright.
 
STILL AFLOAT said:
No, wrong... They differ, since there is no liquid to spill, dunno what theaters you have ever been in, but a lead acid battery with a couple of AK 47 rounds though it , is a dead battery !
An AGM battery, with a couple of bullet holes in it, makes no difference
nothing leaks out ,and the outboards, start perfectly !
Click to expand...

When in a hole, stop digging.

AGM batteries ARE without any doubt, lead/acid technology.

I have had one explode in my near proximity - the pratt was trying to get a knackered one back to life and rammed 24v through it. It would take a tiny bit of charge, lasted but a few seconds. He left it on, took a 'phone call, whizzed off to action his phone call when the battery ruptured.

He rushed in, disconnected the HD charger and picked the ruptured battery up, despite me telling him to leave it alone.

He needed new Levi's new socks and new trainers.

H2SO4 tends to do that............................
 
ROTRAX.. YOU STOP DIGGING !
Who , introduced 24 v charging ? out of the blue ?
Nobody else mentioned, charging a 12 v battery, with 24 volts ?
What is your point ?
The initial question, was, can I put a typical 12 v car battery, at a 45 degree angle !
No, since the electrolyte will run out ( ie Battery Acid ) and burn the substrate !
Your whole post, is irrelevant to the initial question !
But OK, I hope you feel all warm & fuzzy, now. irrespective , that your post , has nothing to do, with the original question !
 
STILL AFLOAT said:
ROTRAX.. YOU STOP DIGGING !
Who , introduced 24 v charging ? out of the blue ?
Nobody else mentioned, charging a 12 v battery, with 24 volts ?
What is your point ?
The initial question, was, can I put a typical 12 v car battery, at a 45 degree angle !
No, since the electrolyte will run out ( ie Battery Acid ) and burn the substrate !
Your whole post, is irrelevant to the initial question !
But OK, I hope you feel all warm & fuzzy, now. irrespective , that your post , has nothing to do, with the original question !
Click to expand...


If you cant see the point there is little chance you would understand it.

But, I shall indulge you.

Due to a pratt trying to revive a knackered AGM battery, it ruptured.

The inside of the battery got on his clothes.

It ruined his socks, trainers and jeans.

It ruined them because it was a gell of dilute concentrated H2SO4 - Sulphuric Acid.

My experience of practical matters tell me that if it smells like battery acid, it came out of a battery and it makes white patches on clothes befor they turn into holes, it is a fair bet it is Sulphuric Acid.

But you maintain AGM batteries are not lead acid batteries.

Well conlusively and completely, you are WRONG.

They are not flooded cell lead acid batteries, but they ARE lead acid batteries. That is how the chemistry works.
 
Stemar said:
Without checking prices, I'd think it would be cheaper and probably more secure to build a shelf and fit a car battery than to get AGM.
Click to expand...
That's what I did, using an 063 which is about the standardest and availablest car starter battery there is. The first battery I fitted failed in Loch Sunart (to be fair it had spent fifteen years in my laid-up Triumph Herald and was therefore probably a bit tired when it went in) and I was able to pick one up off the shelf from a car spares place in Oban.
 
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STILL AFLOAT said:
Yes, true, but a bucket of water, will not, start your engine ?
Whereas a modern sideways mounted AGM battery, will work every time !
Everyone knows, water , will not start an engine ?
Your comment sort of makes you look dubious !
Especially as you , supposedly , do this for a living ?
Click to expand...

According to you, absorbing the electrolyte in glass mat changes it from a lead acid battery to something else, what does it change into ?

I answered the OP in post #2

Your posts, #15 and #16 probably tell everyone how much you know about batteries.

You suggested others try Google, i'd suggest you might want to take your own advice ;

Absorbent Glass Mat (AGM) Battery Information - Battery University
 
STILL AFLOAT said:
Sorry, AGM batteries, stand for Absorbed Glass Matting ! THEY ARE NOT LEAD ACID !
You can shoot holes, in an AGM battery, and nothing will leak !
On top of that, even with a few bullet holes AGM batteries, still work ! Dont ask !
I had an oddesy AGM battery, in my Moto Guzzi, and it was fitted,stood on end !
Lasted 80 000 miles !
Get an AGM and even fit it upside down, if you want !
Click to expand...

Brilliant post. That shouty bit has totally convinced me. :giggle:

Richard
 
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