Bad survey - what should I do?

Razorfish

Razorfish

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Having purchased a boat on the basis of a relatively positive survey a rather expensive problem has become apparent. It is now obvious to me (once the problem and its signs had been pointed out) that the surveyor should have spotted this.

Do I contact him directly with a request that he/his insurance company make good the problem?

or

Do I get the lawyers involved from the start?

Other suggestions welcome.

Andy
 
That was my 1st instinct but wondered if it was a correct one. Hopefully there will be someone here who has 1st hand experience of this.

thanks jokaboat.
 
Save time and go straight in with your documentary evidence - either a report on the issue from another surveyor, or an 'expert assessment' from your boatyard, etc, clearly expressing surprise that this fault was overlooked during survey. (Most yards will write something suitable if they're going to be awarded the remedial work.)

Crucial thing is to include an official estimate for repairs, as well as additional costs of re-surveying, time, hassle etc. Send it to your surveyor with a polite invitation to a) settle the amount in full, b) come and have another look at the boat to satisfy himself the problem was indeed overlooked or c) pass the matter to his insurer for settlement.

Chances are he'll go straight to c) and you can spend the next few years dining out on a story of how slapdash surveyors can be.

Well, it worked for me!
 
after a recent survey when I asked for particular attention to be paid to the sails, I was not amused that after purchase I discovered the UV strip on genoa was U/S and the sailmaker quoted 600 euro plus to replace, I 'e'mailed said surveyor who responded immediately by refunding my survey fee, which fortunately exceeded the cost of the repair, however he did state that that was to be the 'end of the matter' a position I never agreed to, as yet I have to launch the boat and any major problem would of course need to be referred back to him, so I would inform your surveyor of the problem and your next steps depend upon his reaction, I advise you only to invoke the law as a very last resort, it could require expert opinion to pursue and defend any action, and that needs to be paid for, a court would not have any sympathy if you act in an unreasonable manner, so see what he proposes and get it in writing from the very start. good luck
 
Cover all your bases, Document the fault, get prices for the repair, etc etc.

Do not be too greedy but ensure you cover your additional costs,

Then ask for his comments and go from there.

BUT !!! Before you do anything, Read the small print on his survey and his invoice or any other documents that you have from him, his website etc, has he any sort of limitation or exclusion clause, it is possible to limit his liability for defects to a set value ( such as the price of the survey) or even to exclude it entirely.

The last thing you want is to find that you have allowed the yard to "talk up" the value of the repair and that you cannot nail the surveyor to pay for it.

Be careful, he may have been down this road before.
 
You are a little vague about the problem which may have certain folk going down the wrong track...Can we assume it is nothing as obvious as osmosis????

If it is anything to do with the engine and drive then he will have weazly words inn his report to protect him and the same goes for rigging etc which might have been erected and out of reach.

Read his literature very carefully before going to far. If there is a genuine problem he has insurance to cover events like this.....We hope.!!
 
Yeah, many surveys say stuff like "engine not started", "Sails not available" or "furniture not dismantled" which implies that the inside of the hull cannot be fully accessed. Some are not worth the paper they are written on and are simply done in order to obtain insurance.
 
GOOD LUCK !!! is what I think you need; IMHO surveys are worth FA; they (surveys) are there to keep the insurers happy (who insist on a survey???).

Having been in a similar position of buying a boat with a problem that (i think) a reasonable (person) surveyor should have found I got nowhere...it cost me £2.5k 10 YRS AGO!!!

Document everything; be reasonable to start with then go in all guns blazing when the initial approach fails....
 
If the surveyor is a member of a proffesionall body such asYBDSA etc If the direct approach fails they may have a grievance procedure.Any surveyor should have insurance for situations like this but as has been said allready it may be wrapped up in clever wording in the report.
 
Freind of mine bought a Centaur about 5 years ago, he had a survey and asked for the keel areas inboard to be singled out for an area of concern, a glowing report came back with the reccomendation that the keels would need beefing up within the next "few years" so the boat was bought at top doller, on the first sail we noticed water under the sink that wasnt there before, it was coming up from the starboard keel bolts,made a few phone calls to boat repairers between 1500 and 3000 grand to sort out, surveyor didnt want to know, on closer inspection his report had get out clauses all the way through, not worth the paper it was printed on IMHO.
 
You hit the nail on the head Searush. Best advice BEFORE appointing a surveyor is to ask around - your local club, marina etc for names who have been around a bit. From a personal view think there is a great deal of difference for a survey to satisfy an insurance wallah and a genuine buyers survey.
 
As an ex Yacht Surveyor .. decided against continuing once I concentrated on work abroad.

To say a Surveyor "covers his posterior" is correct. It is no different to any other biz or profession. If he didn't - then all sorts of impossible stuff would be lain at his door.
Average surveyor is NOT a) engine mechanic, b) elctrician, c) electronics expert. He is generally jack of all trades but master of none.
Many reports are sparse ... why ? Because Client says "I only want to get Insurance cover ... ". When Client wants to break a sellers price - then it seems they'll spend a couple quid more for a report - but blimey the excuses and wangles I've heard from people to get fees down ! And my fees were fiver a linear foot for general assessment Survey !

Can anyone here really write report covering areas of a hull or structure that cannot be got at ? Are you going to be at risk of claims for something you cannot inspect ?
Are you going to dismantle that boat to get at all nooks and crannys ? I think owner may have something to say if yoy were to go that route ... plus the fees would escalate crazily due to time factors.

To original Poster : Read the report carefully. Note the clauses and exceptions. Compare these with your later findings. See if any reasonable room for movement. Contact the Surveyor and discuss all with him - see where he leads. If you are still not satisfied, then approach him for his P&I details.

Onto exceptions and clauses :

Most reports carry these and are generally accepted but can lead to disagreements that can end up being settled in Small Claims Court or higher authority. Exceptions and Clauses are not actually so cast in stone that you cannot win your case. Courts have right to overturn or put aside any unreasonable exception, clause as they see fit.

Consider carefully, maybe have word with Citizens Advice about Small Claims ?
 
On a slightly different note, has the seller "failed to notify you of any significant facts" about the vessel that would affect its value? If so, there may well be a claim against a commercial seller, but much harder if a private seller as courts are more likely to say "caveat emptor". Still worth talking to seller as well tho'.
 
Thanks everyone - I have taken stock of all the very sensible advice and have contacted the surveyor directly but have lined up a solicitor who specialises in commercial law just in case.

All I wanted was to go sailing.

Sodding boats /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
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All I wanted was to go sailing.

Sodding boats /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

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Join the happy throng !
 
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