B&G Halo 20 radar issue - why does it automatically shut down when boat stops moving??

[Pleinmont]

Hi
I have a 2018 Simrad GO9 MFD connected to a 2022 B&G Halo20 radome (I know I don't have a yacht, bear with).
Everything works ok but the radar goes into standby mode a couple minutes after the boat comes to a stop (to anchor or moor up).
Does it regardless of whether the engine is left running or switched off.
I cannot find any reference to this online or how to turn it off in the settings and the previous Simrad 3G radome did not do this.
All software is up to date.

Anyone know how to set it up so it stays on permanently as I have to reactivate it every time I start the engine and move the boat?
Not a big issue but it's quite irritating and also can't set up a guard zone when anchored.

I don't have a yacht but the B&G radome was all Navico had with the Covid supply chain issues back then still triggers my OCD every time I look at it
Did originally have a 2018 Simrad 3G radome which just died for no reason a few months after it's warranty expired.
I then got the B&G at a small discount direct from Navico end of 2021.

 

[vas]

are you sure it's not battery voltage related, and once you go to idle or kill the engine there's not enough juice for it?
else seems v.strange.
Check settings for a minimum voltage value for it maybe...

 

[Pleinmont]

That's a good point, will have a look.

The odd thing is that it does work for a minute or two before shutting down (which is more time than a drop in voltage would take to occur).
It did noticeably get affected by low voltage 2 yrs ago just before I had to replace a dying battery but in that case the MFD screen started going dark with the engine off etc.
Replaced the batteries and everything works as it should just the radar switches itself off.

Will check the voltage as suggested and see if anything looks off. I think I can get the MFD to display the voltage on screen so should be easy to test.

 

[vas]

unless of course the radome has it's own power supply straight from a breaker or whereever you wired it. In which case MFD can be reporting decent voltage, and radome could be starved due to bad earth or whatever...
Not sure there are radomes that take power straight from the MFD nowadays, @PaulRainbow could help here I guess!

If as you say there doesn't seem to be such an option (tbh would be silly to be and to be automatically on!) I'd try to make sure power supply is not to blame and then I'd start looking elsewhere!

 

[Boathook]

That's a good point, will have a look.

The odd thing is that it does work for a minute or two before shutting down (which is more time than a drop in voltage would take to occur).
It did noticeably get affected by low voltage 2 yrs ago just before I had to replace a dying battery but in that case the MFD screen started going dark with the engine off etc.
Replaced the batteries and everything works as it should just the radar switches itself off.

Will check the voltage as suggested and see if anything looks off. I think I can get the MFD to display the voltage on screen so should be easy to test.

Really want to test the voltage by the radar than any where else.

 

[Pleinmont]

unless of course the radome has it's own power supply straight from a breaker or whereever you wired it. In which case MFD can be reporting decent voltage, and radome could be starved due to bad earth or whatever...
Not sure there are radomes that take power straight from the MFD nowadays, @PaulRainbow could help here I guess!

If as you say there doesn't seem to be such an option (tbh would be silly to be and to be automatically on!) I'd try to make sure power supply is not to blame and then I'd start looking elsewhere!

Thanks - ok, understand. I'd not considered that but yes makes sense.
I only went up and replaced the radome and connected the single cable back up again - not sure about the power supply setup.

 

[Minerva]

It sounds like a power management / power efficiency setting to me.

doing a quick google throws up this marketing blurb;

Ready Instantly
HALO20 Radar wakes instantly from its low-power standby mode, delivering radar coverage exactly when and where you want it. Even if your HALO20 radar is completely powered down start-up is a matter of seconds, not minutes like traditional pulse radar.

I'd be having a look to see if disabling the low power stand by mode gave you your "always on" requirement.

 

[Pleinmont]

Really want to test the voltage by the radar than any where else.

Yes that sounds sensible given what Vas was explaining above.
There's only a single cable with tiny multi pin fittings to connect on these radomes - not sure if can easily test them with a multimeter??

 

[Pleinmont]

It sounds like a power management / power efficiency setting to me.

doing a quick google throws up this marketing blurb;

Ready Instantly
HALO20 Radar wakes instantly from its low-power standby mode, delivering radar coverage exactly when and where you want it. Even if your HALO20 radar is completely powered down start-up is a matter of seconds, not minutes like traditional pulse radar.

I'd be having a look to see if disabling the low power stand by mode gave you your "always on" requirement.

Ah... another good point... thanks!
I'm going down there at lunch, I'll see if I can find that in the settings.

 

[vas]

Yes that sounds sensible given what Vas was explaining above.
There's only a single cable with tiny multi pin fittings to connect on these radomes - not sure if can easily test them with a multimeter??

did a bit of googleing, seems that I'm wrong, it only has a single cable going it, so both power and signal through it, so most likely goes straight to the MFD...
I was pretty sure that all digital radomes nowadays have on powersupply and a fancy or not so fancy ethernet connection to the MFD.
If MFD is behaving, doubt it would be powersupply issues (unless cable has corrosion or other issues...)
I'd check @Minerva suggestion first!

 

[Pleinmont]

Popped down to the boat at lunchtime and switched on the radar and MFD without starting the engine at all.
Left it running off the leisure battery and it was perfectly happy operating for 25mins with me manually putting it into standby and putting back on now and again.

So the radome automatically going into standby when I arrive at a destination appears not to be related to movement or low battery voltage (as it was running off the battery with no additional charging from the engine).
Voltage on MFD was 10.5v and Navico says Supply Voltage should be 10.5 - 31.2 VDC (12/24V systems). That was similar to what the fishfinder on the right was saying.
Even when it dropped to 10.2 after 15mins it was still fine.
I turned the cranking battery on too but that made no difference.

I also could not find any settings related to low power standby mode (it's either operating and showing returns or on standby). Had a look right through all the settings and install menus.

Will try it with the engine running on a combination of tick-over and running revs next time and see if I can get it to go into standby that way.
Weirdly it always happens when we arrive somewhere and I go out the wheelhouse and moor up or go to sort the anchor out - I come back inside and it's on standby.

Maybe it is a voltage thing but related to when the engine drops from cruising revs down to tick-over?
Doesn't seem to affect anything else!

 

[KevinV]

Weirdly it always happens when we arrive somewhere and I go out the wheelhouse and moor up or go to sort the anchor out - I come back inside and it's on standby.

I know nothing about modern radar, but is it possible that it seeing you on the fore deck and shutting down so as not to fry your brains (as old-style radar would)?

 

[PaulRainbow]

The Halo 20 has a single cable at the radome, but this splits at the other end into a data cable and a power cable, which should be connected either directly to the battery (B&G suggest this) or via a switch (in any event it must be fused). So the radr does not draw power from the MFD.

A battery voltage of 10.5v is totally unacceptable, never mind 10.2v. 10.5v is a very flat battery, so much so it's most likely knackered. That said, i would not trust the voltage reading of any of the displays to be 100% correct.

You need to get a multimeter and check the voltage at the batteries, then the switch panel etc, in particular the MFD connections. If you can, check at the MFD too. Do the tests with the MFD on. Also, check the domestic battery voltage with and without the engine running.

Check the engine battery voltage, with and without the engine running.

Note all of the above and report back here.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I know nothing about modern radar, but is it possible that it seeing you on the fore deck and shutting down so as not to fry your brains (as old-style radar would)?

Nope.

 

[TK Blue MAX]

Extra current draw from anchor winch????

 

[Pleinmont]

The Halo 20 has a single cable at the radome, but this splits at the other end into a data cable and a power cable, which should be connected either directly to the battery (B&G suggest this) or via a switch (in any event it must be fused). So the radr does not draw power from the MFD.

A battery voltage of 10.5v is totally unacceptable, never mind 10.2v. 10.5v is a very flat battery, so much so it's most likely knackered. That said, i would not trust the voltage reading of any of the displays to be 100% correct.

You need to get a multimeter and check the voltage at the batteries, then the switch panel etc, in particular the MFD connections. If you can, check at the MFD too. Do the tests with the MFD on. Also, check the domestic battery voltage with and without the engine running.

Check the engine battery voltage, with and without the engine running.

Note all of the above and report back here.

Hi
Many thanks for the troubleshooting tips - that's very helpful.
Both batteries were replaced in 2022 so maybe the displays are not very accurate (hopefully the battery is not knackered).
I'll check the battery voltages and the connections as suggested with engine on and off and see what it all looks like.
Cheers!

 

[Pleinmont]

Thanks for the advice all. Been doing some investigations, learnt a few things and fixed the problem
Based on my engineer's advice from years ago that it's not ideal to leave a boat on shorepower permanently (cooking batteries and wrecking anodes etc), I had always relied on my batteries charging and staying charged sufficiently when using the boat every few weeks.
Did that for the last 8yrs with this boat and only needed to change the batteries once (2yrs ago). Seemed to work ok with batteries lasting 6yrs before replacement and everything working as it should.
With a background concern over anodes, cooked batteries and fire etc I never leave it on shorepower unless staying on the boat in the marina (shorepower charger unit is quite basic).

That said I didn't appreciate that this wasn't ideal for battery health in times of extended inactivity and a bit of shorepower is sensible to keep things topped up.
With less use of the boat this year (weather and commitments) I suspect I let the batteries drop too much in between using the boat hence the low readings and devices shutting down.
The starter battery hasn't shown any cause for concern (always turned over the engine) but the leisure one was obviously getting low.

In my electrical ignorance I wasn't looking at the battery output values on the plotter with the understanding I have now!
Didn't realise that anything around 11.5v is nearly flat, was just aware of things either working or not.

Left the batteries charging on shorepower the other day for 12-15hrs and a couple days later when I tested them with multimeter across the terminals they both still showed 12.5v which is about 80% capacity.
Will check again in a few days. I think they were down around 11.5v when the radar was switching off (not as low as the Simrad showed but down to around 30% which is bad).
Comparing with the multimeter, the Simrad display seems to be always 1v lower. Not sure why or if it matters but fingers crossed the batteries just need a spell on shorepower once or twice a month to keep them topped up.

You live and learn

My shorepower charger unit is a bit agricultural from 2005 (not a smart one) so maybe a newer smart one (like the Victron) might be a good investment so I could leave the shorepower on and not worry about cooking stuff but keep the batteries conditioned.
Victron 12V 3 Bank BlueSmart Battery Charger

I have two of these batteries btw - 1 cranking 1 leisure.
YBX1627 - YBX 1000 SHD - Commercial Vehicles - Batteries

 

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks for the advice all. Been doing some investigations, learnt a few things and fixed the problem
Based on my engineer's advice from years ago that it's not ideal to leave a boat on shorepower permanently (cooking batteries and wrecking anodes etc), I had always relied on my batteries charging and staying charged sufficiently when using the boat every few weeks.
Did that for the last 8yrs with this boat and only needed to change the batteries once (2yrs ago). Seemed to work ok with batteries lasting 6yrs before replacement and everything working as it should.
With a background concern over anodes, cooked batteries and fire etc I never leave it on shorepower unless staying on the boat in the marina (shorepower charger unit is quite basic).

That said I didn't appreciate that this wasn't ideal for battery health in times of extended inactivity and a bit of shorepower is sensible to keep things topped up.
With less use of the boat this year (weather and commitments) I suspect I let the batteries drop too much in between using the boat hence the low readings and devices shutting down.
The starter battery hasn't shown any cause for concern (always turned over the engine) but the leisure one was obviously getting low.

In my electrical ignorance I wasn't looking at the battery output values on the plotter with the understanding I have now!
Didn't realise that anything around 11.5v is nearly flat, was just aware of things either working or not.

Left the batteries charging on shorepower the other day for 12-15hrs and a couple days later when I tested them with multimeter across the terminals they both still showed 12.5v which is about 80% capacity.
Will check again in a few days. I think they were down around 11.5v when the radar was switching off (not as low as the Simrad showed but down to around 30% which is bad).
Comparing with the multimeter, the Simrad display seems to be always 1v lower. Not sure why or if it matters but fingers crossed the batteries just need a spell on shorepower once or twice a month to keep them topped up.

You live and learn

My shorepower charger unit is a bit agricultural from 2005 (not a smart one) so maybe a newer smart one (like the Victron) might be a good investment so I could leave the shorepower on and not worry about cooking stuff but keep the batteries conditioned.
Victron 12V 3 Bank BlueSmart Battery Charger

I have two of these batteries btw - 1 cranking 1 leisure.
YBX1627 - YBX 1000 SHD - Commercial Vehicles - Batteries

View attachment 181339

Thanks for reporting back, good to hear you got to the bottom of it. I would suggest you fit one of the Victron chargers you linked to and leave it on all of the time.

 

[Pleinmont]

Thanks for reporting back, good to hear you got to the bottom of it. I would suggest you fit one of the Victron chargers you linked to and leave it on all of the time.

Yes a new multi stage charger might be best

That said I checked the batts this morning and both still 12.5v with no load or charging (about 80%)
I put them back on shore power to see if they eventually go up to a full 12.8v.
Noticed that when shore power charging on full boost (fan running on charger), the multimeter shows 13.8v across terminals (less than the c.14v they get from the alternator).

After 10mins the charger fan went off and input dropped down - presume this is the trickle / float - shows 13.4v – that seems to be the low rate the charger reverts to long term.
I found a manual for my unit and the figures should be a bit higher but left batts on shorepower charge for now at the float rate and will see what they’re like tomorrow.
At least I know it's not charging on full boost all the time and there is a lower rate.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Yes a new multi stage charger might be best

That said I checked the batts this morning and both still 12.5v with no load or charging (about 80%)
I put them back on shore power to see if they eventually go up to a full 12.8v.
Noticed that when shore power charging on full boost (fan running on charger), the multimeter shows 13.8v across terminals (less than the c.14v they get from the alternator).

After 10mins the charger fan went off and input dropped down - presume this is the trickle / float - shows 13.4v – that seems to be the low rate the charger reverts to long term.
I found a manual for my unit and the figures should be a bit higher but left batts on shorepower charge for now at the float rate and will see what they’re like tomorrow.
At least I know it's not charging on full boost all the time and there is a lower rate.

13.4v is indeed float voltage. But, the Victron charger will not keep the batteries on float forever. If there are no loads, after a while, it will enter sleep mode.

"Sleep mode is activated when the battery is not used for 24 hours. This mode varies the voltage at the cell terminals to limit the effects of premature battery ageing."