Atlantic Circuit post Brexit

[Kelpie]

We are hoping to set off next year on, hopefully, an Atlantic circuit. We would like to keep options open and one possibility would to not cross the pond in the first year, but hang fire in the Algarve or Med before heading for a Transat in late 2022. I quite like the idea of the Rio Guadiana and had envisaged spending a fair bit of time there.
Pre-Brexit this would have been no problem, and I'm now realising that we will only have 90 days at a time in Schengen. This seems to completely rule out the option of delaying the transat, and even a crossing in 2021 would be totally messed up- we would hope to have crossed Biscay by July, but not leave the Canaries until Christmas.

Am I misreading things? Do we have to leave the boat somewhere and fly home for 90 days (can't really afford that)? Would we have to sit it out in some combination of Gib/Morocco? Will we have to get a marina contract and then apply for residency (many reasons we don't want to do that)?

 

[Graham376]

This year we are still EU citizens under the transition arrangements and unless the transition is extended, those without residence will be treated the same as any other country outside the EU from 1st January. Obtaining residence once we cease to become EU citizens may not be as easy as it is now. We will have to wait and see whether the 90 day rule will apply or whether a longer stay visa becomes available, it all depends on negotiations. By the way, many leave the Guadiana for July and August because of the heat.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I second Graham posting , it can get very hot up the river ,
But not only there it seen more and more people now leave their boat in the high of the summer months and head for cooler places .
We love the heat unless it get to 38c then it gets a bit uncomfortable.
North Africa countries have started to be more welcoming to yacht , they want our money too , and they are worth visiting , not as easy to more around as Europe having to deal with officials in every port but we always found them friendly and mostly easy to deal with.
So if you needed to get out of the EU for a while , it's a good option .

 

[Kelpie]

Rough plan is to spend July/August exploring the Rias, then continue south towards the Algarve. So we'd likely be past the worst of the heat by then.

The main problem is that to do the trip on a sensible schedule requires about 7 months continuously in Schengen. If we are only allowed 3, then crossing Biscay at a sensible time of year puts you too early for the transat.

 

[nortada]

Rough plan is to spend July/August exploring the Rias, then continue south towards the Algarve. So we'd likely be past the worst of the heat by then.

The main problem is that to do the trip on a sensible schedule requires about 7 months continuously in Schengen. If we are only allowed 3, then crossing Biscay at a sensible time of year puts you too early for the transat.

Good plan.

As Graham says, get Portuguese Residencia before the end of the transition period and Schengen should no longer be an issue so plain sailing from there on?

If you require more on residency in Portugal, there are a number of threads on it on this forum, including The Truth About Sailing In The Algarve.

Best of luck?

 

[Kelpie]

Yeah but we're leaving next year, not this year

 

[Graham376]

Yeah but we're leaving next year, not this year

There will be time this year for people to fly down and get residence, authorities don't look to see the boat is there

 

[BurnitBlue]

I have the same problem. Sailaboutvic hints at the official plague of entering different countries nowadays. I now consider cruising to be a long distance project outside the EU or roadsteading flying the Q flag. Even that will be a freedom of the past as more and more countries demand advance notice with application forms or single side band communication or fax. The restrictions under corona -19 will become a permanent feature as I cannot see the officials letting go of such control that have been set in place under corona-19 reasons.

I would like to leave Sweden this year in my Northern based IFboat and head for the Bahamas. My original plan was to fly down to Greece and make a second serious attempt in my Moody to escape the Med. But lockdown restrictions will prevent that as I need to prepare that boat early and I am rather suspect of the flight plus the long busride to Preveza. After suffering through 4 month of lockdown i have no desire to chuck that effort away by travelling on public transport so early.

The usual route or skandinavian boats to head south is to avoid the English Channel with its tides that make the water level go up an down and instead cross to the Caladonian canal then sail south between ireland and UK.

As you can see as the time gets closer and more critical I will not have a clue what to do. I do have a way out with the IFboat but what a choice I face.

 

[Kelpie]

After a bit more research on Noonsite, it looks like the most promising option is to seek a visa extension in Spain. This would give us a maximum of six months from crossing Biscay to having to leave the Canaries (need to look in to Cape Verde too as we would prefer to take the southern route).
And maybe I am worrying over nothing. Perhaps Brexit will be postponed again. Perhaps we won't go no-deal after all. And perhaps the post-Covid world will mean a whole new set of restrictions anyway.

 

[25931]

We are hoping to set off next year on, hopefully, an Atlantic circuit. We would like to keep options open and one possibility would to not cross the pond in the first year, but hang fire in the Algarve or Med before heading for a Transat in late 2022. I quite like the idea of the Rio Guadiana and had envisaged spending a fair bit of time there.
Pre-Brexit this would have been no problem, and I'm now realising that we will only have 90 days at a time in Schengen. This seems to completely rule out the option of delaying the transat, and even a crossing in 2021 would be totally messed up- we would hope to have crossed Biscay by July, but not leave the Canaries until Christmas.

Am I misreading things? Do we have to leave the boat somewhere and fly home for 90 days (can't really afford that)? Would we have to sit it out in some combination of Gib/Morocco? Will we have to get a marina contract and then apply for residency (many reasons we don't want to do that)?

Technically if you can't stay neither can the boat.

 

[Kelpie]

Technically if you can't stay neither can the boat.

Didn't know that, thanks. Not an option we would want to take anyway.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Technically if you can't stay neither can the boat.

Why that ?

 

[Graham376]

Why that ?

That's what I wondered, boats can normally stay for 18 months after which the either leave or pay VAT.

 

[25931]

In the old days a foreign boat was only allowed 180 days - I've earned a bob or two taking boats to Ayamonte harbour (no marina then) overnighting, paying and returning with the receipt. Surely there must be the possibility of those conditions, or worse, returning post Brexit ?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Posted twice

 

[sailaboutvic]

If the worst happen then as long as a boat is EU vat paid the boat can stay in the EU how ever long it like , the people on the other hand 90 days in 180 days , if in the other hand not vat paid as a non EU contry which the UK will be the boat will have to leave every 18 months that the way it seen to work unless someone know for sure any different

 

[25931]

Nobody knows how the EU will react after Brexit and I was just warning of the possibility to avoid someone getting a nasty shock.

 

[Graham376]

Nobody knows how the EU will react after Brexit and I was just warning of the possibility to avoid someone getting a nasty shock.

The 18 month rule applies to all boats not not flagged in an EU country so doubt if we will be singled out for shorter period.

I still don't understand how the EU are able to legally cancel the VAT paid status of UK owned EU VAT paid boats which are outside the EU on B day. Just taking the goods out and then back under the same ownership is not a chargeable event and they also have the Returned Goods Relief, as we do. I suspect that someone will bring a test case to court on this issue.

 

[sailaboutvic]

The 18 month rule applies to all boats not not flagged in an EU country so doubt if we will be singled out for shorter period.

I still don't understand how the EU are able to legally cancel the VAT paid status of UK owned EU VAT paid boats which are outside the EU on B day. Just taking the goods out and then back under the same ownership is not a chargeable event and they also have the Returned Goods Relief, as we do. I suspect that someone will bring a test case to court on this issue.

Yes that's a big mystery, lucky most of us are in the EU .