Are boat equipment manufacturers taking us for a ride?

asteven221

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Whilst lying in the sun on holiday last week, just passing the time reading the monthly boat magazines cover to cover, I became aware of something I had not really thought much about before. For no reason whatsoever, it suddenly dawned on me that almost every article relating to using a boat for what it's designed for e.g. sailing, ARC, cruising, motoring etc.... had the same repeating theme. The theme being that boat equipment just breaks all the time. As someone who has spent (still does spend) most of my boating life fixing things on my boat that should not have come as any surprise. I think I just take it for granted that boats are always breaking. I think we all do and just shrug it off as "hey that's boating"! But really, should it be like that?

That led me to ponder over the question of why is it that manufacturers of boating equipment can't make stuff that's fit for purpose? Think about it for a second. Why is it that we are always fixing faulty equipment on our boats? Yes of course it's a tough environment, but hey Mr Manufacturer that's the way it is, so please go away and make something that is fit for purpose in that tough environment, not some half baked bit of kit that isn't even sealed against dampness!

The boat builders themselves seem to be able to build a reliable hull over the long term, with faults being really unusual no matter what nature can do to break them, yet the kit attached to the boat always breaks. Nothing really lasts. Whether it's furling gear, electronics, spars, steering gear, static or running rigging, cooking, toilets, plumbing, you name it and it will likely break pretty quickly - if you actually use it. Winches appear to be a good exception however, as does the core parts of engines, although the peripheral parts to the engine fall apart regularly, as do gearboxes and sterngear. Still, I would like to forgive engines, as they are a bit more complex than say a marine toilet for example - which is pretty useless at being a toilet after a relatively short period of time.

From what I can tell, boat builders have always used the same equipment manufacturers. The chances are that virtually every one of us will have equipment on our boats from the same handful of manufacturers, regardless of the age of the boat or who built it. I would assume that's because few companies make boat kit, so the builders have few options. Hmmm, that's probably answer as to why they can't be bothered trying too hard to make kit fit for purpose.

So am I being unreasonable on the equipment manufacturers and I should be grateful for their fantastic and reliable equipment? Or do I have a valid point and we are being fleeced, as we have to keep fixing and replacing their badly designed products which are not fit for purpose?

Over to you folks, what do you reckon?
 
Any particular examples?

Much of it boils dow to what people are prepared to pay and yes some, a lot of boating equipment is tat, admittedly sold at an inflated price but even then cheap tat. Then you also have the question of maintenance, it seems some owners think equipment will go on forever or at least last until the end of the sailing year when they can have a look at it.
I think you are being a little harsh.
 
I think you are right. It’s definitely a post 70’s thing. I am just taking a break from pounding on a seacock with a mallet. Been doing it for several hours accompanied by periods of intense heat. Looking a bit charred but still perfectly funtional after which i will service and replace it. Try and do THAT with your fancy modern chartplotters pah!
 
Maybe you've been lying in the sun too long. :D

Not long enough unfortunately!!!!!

Sitting at my desk now in front of a computer screen fixing computers and other I.T. systems that keep breaking down too!!! Seems fixing things breaking is a theme in my life :)
 
Winches appear to be a good exception however, as does the core parts of engines, although the peripheral parts to the engine fall apart regularly, as do gearboxes and sterngear. Still, I would like to forgive engines, as they are a bit more complex than say a marine toilet for example - which is pretty useless at being a toilet after a relatively short period of time.

Do engine peripherals, gearboxes and sterngear really "fall apart regularly"? Not in most people's experience.

Are marine toilets really useless? There are service parts (rubber seals and valves) which need replacing from time to time, otherwise they're fairly robust.
 
I had a 24v 50 amp Mastervolt battery charger which needed fixing. Mastervolt agreed to do this and I paid in advance - fixed price repair. All was confimed by the boss in Holland and the engineer in England. Nothing heard for weeks, phoned the English guy, oh sorry company policy is not to repair anything over 5 years old! we are scrapping your unit WHAT??
after 2 phone calls and taking my money!

The Mastervolt unit was replaced by a 1960s Constavolt charger, not smart, no electronics and was still working perfectly when I sold the boat 18 months later. OK, i had to switch it on and off, big deal! We live in a throwaway society, no profit in making stuff that lasts.
 
I do agree with the basic proposition. There are probably physical reasons why some items, such as sails, running & standing rigging and some engine parts will have to be replaced as a matter of course, but I would expect that most parts should last for a substantial part of the life of the boat, say 40 years.

On my HR, which is fitted with pretty decent equipment for the most part, replacing faulty and broken items is a regular chore. Some items have fared well, and after 20 years the following are in good order, touch wood:
Electronics - Raytheon/Raymarine, except the wind sensor vane
Furling gear
Interior woodwork
Fridge
Others have needed regular replacement or attention, such as:
Fresh water system, including accumulator (on 4th), immersion heater, PRV, pressure pump, piping
Webasto, expensive service several times and change of ECU
Sprayhood & cockpit cover
Radio - cable covering falling apart now
Lewmar clutches discoloured & rust-stained
Various plastic retaining clips
 
Blakes heads are immortal provided that you replace all the “perishable parts”, at roughly the cost of a new cheap heads, once a decade or so.

Sestrel compasses benefit from a new agate every half century or so, and if they have “Brytlit” lighting they need a new capsule every 15 years. Barry Phillips of BPSC is your man, here, and he is currently replacing the capsule on the handbearer that I bought new at Woolverstone Marina for £27 in 1973.

The Seagull 40 has been placed in reserve after 50 years (Saving Old Seagulls are the people...)

My Grabit boathook dates from before WW2 - it’s a pre-Davey &Co model.

My Walker Excelsior IV log was inherited from my father and is at least 70 years old.
 
boat equipment just breaks all the time. As someone who has spent (still does spend) most of my boating life fixing things on my boat that should not have come as any surprise. I think I just take it for granted that boats are always breaking. I think we all do and just shrug it off as "hey that's boating"! But really, should it be like that?

Maybe you should have bought a better equipped boat. We spend 6 - 7 months aboard each year and very little breaks. Still on the 30 year old furler and I've just replaced the last of the 30 year old instruments. Windlass and heater still work fine after 15 unserviced years as does most equipment.
 
I do agree with the basic proposition. There are probably physical reasons why some items, such as sails, running & standing rigging and some engine parts will have to be replaced as a matter of course, but I would expect that most parts should last for a substantial part of the life of the boat, say 40 years.

On my HR, which is fitted with pretty decent equipment for the most part, replacing faulty and broken items is a regular chore. Some items have fared well, and after 20 years the following are in good order, touch wood:
Electronics - Raytheon/Raymarine, except the wind sensor vane
Furling gear
Interior woodwork
Fridge
Others have needed regular replacement or attention, such as:
Fresh water system, including accumulator (on 4th), immersion heater, PRV, pressure pump, piping
Webasto, expensive service several times and change of ECU
Sprayhood & cockpit cover
Radio - cable covering falling apart now
Lewmar clutches discoloured & rust-stained
Various plastic retaining clips


Going through your list:rolleyes:

Fresh water accumulator almost certainly the diaphragm which in common with domestic hot water systems is prone to failure, not a problem uniquely marine. Poxy 12 volt immersion heaters I think it is pot luck the 240V ones seem a little better but again pot luck, I never had a problem. pressure pump, diaphragm again not unusual in such pumps. piping always down to poor installation.
Webasto and Ebberspacher I have some sympathy here I inherited an old Mikuni which was crap but my self installed Ebber. worked flawlessly, I think much is down to how they are used and serviced, they do need the occasional "decoke" which seems beyond many of the marine bodgers.:rolleyes: Failure to maintain leads to other problems.
Sprayhood and covers, we expect an awful lot from them but a well made one removed during the winter will last a long time.
Can't comment on your radio wiring but I suspect down to poor installation.
Lewmar clutches, plastics inevitably discolour due to UV but I don't think that affects their serviceability the rust stains are down to accountants penny-pinching on the construction materials but easily remedied and again doesn't affect serviceability.
Plastic clips:eek::rolleyes: Say no more.
 
Before marinas and grp boats where laid up in September stripped of their rigging the mast and all equipment stores away and the boat covered up in a mud berth or undercover in a shed these days boats are at the mercy of the elements 24/7 etc and obviously suffer wear and tear even without actually being used so probably most yacht gear is built for purpose except where you want to mix electricity and water!
 
Just pulled a VP twin engine. Still running after over 50 yrs, some of it in fishing, so well used. Expect to fit fresh rings and seals, grind the valves and back in.
Tend to agree with modern elektoniks, people expect to update often for the recent bells and whistles so they ae not expected to last as long as a sextant....
 
Manufacturing is easy as long as you understand there is a triangle of Price, Speed and Quality. You can take two of the three variables. Customers always want speed and price. Simples.
 
Manufacturing is easy as long as you understand there is a triangle of Price, Speed and Quality. You can take two of the three variables. Customers always want speed and price. Simples.

Quite, I have a friend who, is keen to buy some kit. Prob is, he looks on the net and sees cheap stuff. I then have to point out the relationship between the price and durability/warranty.
 
...the kit attached to the boat always breaks... if you actually use it...

Over to you folks, what do you reckon?

and that I'm afraid is where you're getting it wrong.
To achieve a modicum of reliability and economy we hold to a simple doctrine: If you don't fit it, then it can't break, but if it's already fitted and still working, then try not to use it as it will break.
 
Quite, I have a friend who, is keen to buy some kit. Prob is, he looks on the net and sees cheap stuff. I then have to point out the relationship between the price and durability/warranty.

I have an old sailing friend and I was constantly saying to him, "You know the price of everything and the value of nothing" It was well born out on a visit to a boat show when after visiting several stands in search of something he eventually found it, tried to negotiate a price and eventually wore the guy down after successive visits who agreed a reasonable reduction which my friend replied to wit " I will think about it" and walked away. His logic was that he would return just before end of day and get it even cheaper apart from not wanting to stay till the end of the day I was a bit pissed off but cheered up immensely when we duel arrived at last knockings and my friend started with his patter only to be told to "Pisss off and stop wasting my time":D
 
Manufacturing is easy as long as you understand there is a triangle of Price, Speed and Quality. You can take two of the three variables. Customers always want speed and price. Simples.

There is a boatyard in Curacao which displays several signs advising:

"We can do any job cheap, fast and well, but we can only ever achieve two out of the three, please advise which two you'd prefer for your job."
 
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