anyone know the legal stance of surveyors.......

[ianainge]

liabilites.
had the hull surveyed last year when i purchased the boat, found to be ok all .he remarked that the under the a/f he found a green covering known as gelshield. when scraping away some of this he found gel coat. just had the bottom steamed off ready to do a/f and found under the gelshield is what looks to be bare laminate on 3/4 of the hull below waterline.he is going back down tomorrow to report on it. if it does turn out to be bare laminate is he liable or is he protected with some small print somewhere making a survey a complete waste of time.

 

[byron]

<font color=blue>Tricky one really because he did bring the anomaly to your attention at the time. Can it be argued that you should have had the matter investigated deeper? Or can it be argued that he is the expert and he should have advised that step.


http://www.alexander-advertising.co.uk

 

[wakeup]

Not sure on the legal position here but I would assume he has some sort of professional indemnity insurance.

Why not sound him out by asking for his PI insurance policy details?

Save a cow, eat a vegetarian.

 

[ianainge]

what anomaly? he advised that under gelshield he found the gel coat not bare laminate which is the case.

 

[tr7v8]

Not sure of the issue, surely Gelsheild is an epoxy replace gelcoat for maladies like osmosis, I wouldn't have thought you'd have needed both IMHO.


Jim
----------

 

[jimg]

International Gelshield 200 is often a Manufacturers "option list" item that is applied to on top of the gelcoat. International also do a Gelshield 2-part kit that is applied to the laminate.
Which does this boat have?

International Gelshield Kit

A high build, 2-pack solventless expoxy that is used to seal glass fibre laminates and to fill any cloth fibres that have been voided of resin. Gelshield provides an exceptional water barrier to protect against the reoccurrence of osmosis.

International Gelshield 200

A quick drying, high performance, two-component epoxy for application to sound gelcoats to help protect against osmosis. Gelshield is provided in two shades (green and grey) to ensure complete coverage. Suitable for use in temperatures down to 5°C.


<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by jimg on 20/01/2003 12:54 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[miket]

JIMG has it.

 

[ianainge]

Thanks i am aware of all this, my problem is there is no gelcoat which obviously would have been there when the boat was made, the coating on the boat is green i.e gelshield 200. the problem as stated in my first post is that the surveyor claimed that on scraping away the gelshield he revealed gelcoat as you would expect, however there is no gelcoat under the gelshield.

 

[ianainge]

Jim the issue is clear surveyor says on scraping away gelshield he revealed gelcoat.thats what you would hope to find.Fact 1 year later on scraping away same there is no gelcoat .the boat has had either osmosis damage or hull damage thats why we pay for a survey, he is saying he found no evidence of thus by giving the boat a clean bill of health, if thats the case has my gelcoat suddenly dissolved. answer no of course not , he failed to report the real findings didnt he?

sorry if this sound a bit abrupt but no appears to be reading my first post.

 

[Guest]

Everywhere, though? A surveyor will only scrape away a limited number of test patches, otherwise you'd have to re-antifoul everytime you had a survey done. If he found gel where he looked, then he's safe. If there's no gelcoat anywhere at all, then you have him by the privates.

 

[ianainge]

the only parts that show gelcoat are the sides up to boot top and then the first foot down to the first rib therefore for the rest of the hull 90% has no gelcoat the only way he could have missed it was if he only scraped what was on his eye level and not right under the boat. There must be guidlines that say they have to check it so many times and over a wide area not just the first bit they can get to without bending down.

 

[Guest]

Sounds like it's been peeled for osmosis, but that's unusual in what must be a relatively recent boat, surely? Targa 31 can't be much over 10-12 years old, can it?

 

[sailbadthesinner]

Ian
the rya might be able to help you here

I never eat on an empty stomach. i like to hear the food splash as it hits

 

[Observer]

What are the implications?

Sorry, it's not obvious to me but..

1. From what's been said, I understand that a "gelshield" coating has been applied over a large area (75%?) of the underwater surfaces onto the laminate (rather than over an existing "gelcoat" layer). This implies that the original "gelcoat" had been removed at some time, perhaps to repair osmosis/delamination damage.

2. Your surveyor's original report stated that "gelshield" had been found on top of "gelcoat" (as somebody else said, his test patch(es) may have just happened to be on the 25% which still had "gelcoat" layer). I don't know how many test patches should be checked. Suggest you confirm with another surveyor. If he did as much as any other professional surveyor would have and just reported what he found, you have no grounds for complaint. Possibly you should have questioned why gelshield had been applied and asked direct questions of your seller. Then, if you received inaccurate answers (like "it's just a small repair"), you may now have a claim on the seller for misrepresentation.

3. Anyway, if 75% of the outer coating is "gelshield" instead of "gelcoat", how much does it matter? (sorry if I'm missing something).

4. If you suffer no damage, you have no claim. If the surveyor reported what he found and could not reasonably have been expected to discover more, you have no claim.

5. If surveyor did NOT do as much as he should have AND you have suffered/will suffer damage because you now have to carry out major repair, you have a cause of action in negligence.

Don't know if this helps.

 

[longjohnsilver]

Have you taken any moisture level readings. If so and they are low then no gelcoat shouldn't be a great problem, suggest that you add more barriers to prevent any future problems. Praps you can get hold of a moisture meter.

However what you say does sound odd, especially if there is some gel coat left, don't understand that.

 

[ianainge]

10 years, but if why leave the last foot why not do the lot and up to boot-top?

 

[Observer]

Before you have any work done

take at look at <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.yachtsurvey.com>http://www.yachtsurvey.com</A> under the "blisters" pages

 

[byron]

<font color=blue>Give me a break, just 'cos I can't read properly

http://www.alexander-advertising.co.uk

 

[oldgit]

Read somewhere that you do not need any gel coat over matting,it is purely just to get pretty pretty type finish.
Large MOD craft minesweepers etc have no gel coat hence no osmosis problems.
So no good trying (riddled with osmosis mate) to bid down price if buying one.

Oooh look its still not dark and its nearly 5pm

 

[MarcusMan]

Re Oldgits comments the article he is refering to is in a recent (last three months) PBO