Anchor windlass/gyspy/chain

[Slow_boat]

I have an old Vetus hand crank windlass on the boat. The chain is not calibrated and snarls up, resulting in it not feeding down the hawse hole.

If I buy a calibrated chain, how I ensure it is calibrated to the gypsy?

Can you buy a new gypsy to go with the chain?

If I were to fit an electric windlass in the future, would I have to buy a new calibrated chain, and possibly a matching gypsy, as well?

 

[NormanS]

Does your windlass have an effective chain stripper?

 

[VicMallows]

With 14095 posts to your name since 2005, what topics have you been following

 

[GrahamM376]

I have an old Vetus hand crank windlass on the boat. The chain is not calibrated and snarls up, resulting in it not feeding down the hawse hole.

If I buy a calibrated chain, how I ensure it is calibrated to the gypsy?

Can you buy a new gypsy to go with the chain?

If I were to fit an electric windlass in the future, would I have to buy a new calibrated chain, and possibly a matching gypsy, as well?

You take the gypsy with you when buying chain to see if it's DIN or ISO

Yes you can buy a new gypsy but the last Lofrans one I had retailed around £150

If you buy an electric windlass in future, buy one which has a gypsy to fit your chain. Some makes can be supplied with different ones.

 

[vyv_cox]

There is a page on the subject here http://coxengineering.sharepoint.com/Pages/Chaindefinitions.aspx

The chain standard is stamped on modern gypsies but perhaps not on older ones. For metric sizes DIN and ISO are the same, except for 10 mm, where they differ by 2 mm. ISO has a greater tolerance, so DIN chain fits ISO with no problems but there just could be a problem in the reverse case. As GrahamM346 says, either take the gypsy with you or buy a short length of the chain as a sample. If you buy modern DIN chain it will fit any current DIN gypsy: AFAIK no manufacturer has his own calibration now, they all use international standards.

 

[Neeves]

There is a page on the subject here http://coxengineering.sharepoint.com/Pages/Chaindefinitions.aspx

The chain standard is stamped on modern gypsies but perhaps not on older ones. For metric sizes DIN and ISO are the same, except for 10 mm, where they differ by 2 mm. ISO has a greater tolerance, so DIN chain fits ISO with no problems but there just could be a problem in the reverse case. As GrahamM346 says, either take the gypsy with you or buy a short length of the chain as a sample. If you buy modern DIN chain it will fit any current DIN gypsy: AFAIK no manufacturer has his own calibration now, they all use international standards.

Vyv is of course referring to metric chain - if for any reason you are thinking 'international' then the Americans are completely different. Their chain is good old honest 'Imperial' and their different strengths, G30, G43 (or HT) and G70 chains are slightly different sizes. They call their chain 'short link' as we do - but they are entirely different. We, who are not Americans, should be grateful for metric standard.

If you measure your can link size you should be able to refer to Vyv's link (sorry for the pun) and identify what chain you have. If you go to buy a new windlass this will narrow down the choice of size (a bit). Most windlass have interchangeable gypsies.

A horizontal windlass (which will have a vertical gypsy) is more accommodating of chain size as the links only pass through 90 degrees, a vertical windlass has a horizontal gypsy and the chain usually pass round 270 degrees and any mismatch of chain and gypsy really stands out.

Jonathan

 

[NormanS]

Vyv is of course referring to metric chain - if for any reason you are thinking 'international' then the Americans are completely different. Their chain is good old honest 'Imperial' and their different strengths, G30, G43 (or HT) and G70 chains are slightly different sizes. They call their chain 'short link' as we do - but they are entirely different. We, who are not Americans, should be grateful for metric standard.

If you measure your can link size you should be able to refer to Vyv's link (sorry for the pun) and identify what chain you have. If you go to buy a new windlass this will narrow down the choice of size (a bit). Most windlass have interchangeable gypsies.

A horizontal windlass (which will have a vertical gypsy) is more accommodating of chain size as the links only pass through 90 degrees, a vertical windlass has a horizontal gypsy and the chain usually pass round 270 degrees and any mismatch of chain and gypsy really stands out.

Jonathan

Surely it's 180º?
The reason that I asked if the OP's windlass has an effective stripper fitted is that normally, with the slow speed of the chain coming in on a hand operated windlass, it would be unusual for the chain to give any trouble. This of course does not apply if the chain is running free when anchoring, when it may well jump on the gypsy.

 

[vyv_cox]

A horizontal windlass (which will have a vertical gypsy) is more accommodating of chain size as the links only pass through 90 degrees, a vertical windlass has a horizontal gypsy and the chain usually pass round 270 degrees and any mismatch of chain and gypsy really stands out.

This season we came across a couple who had bought a long length of 10 mm ISO chain but then discovered that they had the DIN gypsy, on a horizontal windlass. The two were totally incompatible (the chain and gypsy, not the couple). What was really frustrating for me was that they had attended my CA course earlier in the year, where I thought I had laboured this particular point quite strongly!

 

[Neeves]

I'm not sure to which windlass you refer to the 180 degrees - but our horizontal gypsy (vertical windlass) - according to Wiki - should be called a capstan? You are quite right that the chain is loaded or gripped is through 180 degrees.

I actually went to see Muir, who make our windlass (or capstan), to check a new bit of chain (which did not fit any of their metric gypsies) - their simple and crude way of checking compatibility (of chain) was to simply wrap the chain round the gypsy through 360 degrees. Mismatch stands out like a sore thumb.

Jonathan

 

[GrahamM376]

I'm not sure to which windlass you refer to the 180 degrees - but our horizontal gypsy (vertical windlass) - according to Wiki - should be called a capstan? You are quite right that the chain is loaded or gripped is through 180 degrees.

I actually went to see Muir, who make our windlass (or capstan), to check a new bit of chain (which did not fit any of their metric gypsies) - their simple and crude way of checking compatibility (of chain) was to simply wrap the chain round the gypsy through 360 degrees. Mismatch stands out like a sore thumb.

Jonathan

We had the 10mm ISO/DIN problem some years ago. Lofrans windlass bought in UK, new chain later bought in Spain from Lofrans dealer, sample length just laid over horizontal gypsy indicated it fitted OK, as you say only about 90 degrees working area. Under load it kept jamming and it turned out that most Lofrans 10mm supplied in UK were ISO and those supplied in Spain were DIN. A full wrap of chain around the gypsy (when removed) showed it was way out.

 

[NormanS]

I'm not sure to which windlass you refer to the 180 degrees - but our horizontal gypsy (vertical windlass) - according to Wiki - should be called a capstan? You are quite right that the chain is loaded or gripped is through 180 degrees.

I actually went to see Muir, who make our windlass (or capstan), to check a new bit of chain (which did not fit any of their metric gypsies) - their simple and crude way of checking compatibility (of chain) was to simply wrap the chain round the gypsy through 360 degrees. Mismatch stands out like a sore thumb.

Jonathan

I've no wish to make a big deal over this, but it was you who said #6 that with a horizontal gypsy the chain would pass round 270º.

 

[Slow_boat]

So I need to check what is stamped/written on the gypsy and if in doubt, take it to a supplier to check?

Thanks, all.

 

[Neeves]

Vyv,

How do they mark modern gypsies in the UK/Europe. Ours is simply marked with the dimension in the casting of the gypsy and it only denotes size. Do gypsies in Europe, if they are 10mm, also define ISO and DIN? I wonder what happens for American gypsies are they marked, say, 5/16th inch BBB (or G43 etc) or simply 5/16th inch.

CMP, who now market the Rocna, are big in chain, www.titanmarineproducts.com made in their own factory in Ningbo (anchors and chain were meant to create synergy). They sell a DIN G30 chain with both a long (short link) 10mm and a short (short link) 10mm. The chain is marked CMP and G3. CMP chain are available here in Oz (at prices only marginally lower than domestically made chain), presumably in N America but no-one seems to recognise them in the UK?

Jonathan

 

[vyv_cox]

Vyv,

How do they mark modern gypsies in the UK/Europe. Ours is simply marked with the dimension in the casting of the gypsy and it only denotes size. Do gypsies in Europe, if they are 10mm, also define ISO and DIN? I wonder what happens for American gypsies are they marked, say, 5/16th inch BBB (or G43 etc) or simply 5/16th inch.

CMP, who now market the Rocna, are big in chain, www.titanmarineproducts.com made in their own factory in Ningbo (anchors and chain were meant to create synergy). They sell a DIN G30 chain with both a long (short link) 10mm and a short (short link) 10mm. The chain is marked CMP and G3. CMP chain are available here in Oz (at prices only marginally lower than domestically made chain), presumably in N America but no-one seems to recognise them in the UK?

Jonathan

In the case above the gypsy, on a Lofrans windlass I think, was definitely marked 10 mm DIN. Not sure this would be the same for other sizes, where presumably size only would be sufficient.

I have not come across CMP here. When I bought my dozen samples for testing from chandleries all across North Wales I saw none by them.