An Anchor Thread! Grab your beers and popcorn.

[RupertW]

You misunderstand. I'm not complaining about your posts. Post as much as you like.
What I do find a bit wearing, is your constant and repetitive advice to all and sundry, that they would be better off with lighter chain, and a cat's cradle of elastic, instead of the perfectly good equipment that they already have. You don't know these people, or their capabilities. You don't know their boats, or the areas in which they sail. There is just a possibility that they might know better.

Except they don’t know better - they stick with the old fashioned evidence-free approach of yours. Your belief in catenary is aways touching but never backed up by anything.

 

[NormanS]

Except they don’t know better - they stick with the old fashioned evidence-free approach of yours. Your belief in catenary is aways touching but never backed up by anything.

Well, it works for me, but I have adequate sized chain. I prevent my boat from yawing about by rigging a riding sail when required. I use topography and a fishfinder to ensure that I'm dropping the anchor in a sensible place. If it's windy, or likely to be windy, I'll anchor in deeper rather than shallower water. Obviously catenary doesn't work in shallow water.
It would maybe be interesting to hear from you and other deniers of the benefits of catenary, as to what you do.

 

[Tranona]

Well, it works for me, but I have adequate sized chain. I prevent my boat from yawing about by rigging a riding sail when required. I use topography and a fishfinder to ensure that I'm dropping the anchor in a sensible place. If it's windy, or likely to be windy, I'll anchor in deeper rather than shallower water. Obviously catenary doesn't work in shallow water.
It would maybe be interesting to hear from you and other deniers of the benefits of catenary, as to what you do.

It is not a question of denying, but of understanding of what it is and how it works. There is nothing to dispute about how it works, the debate is about how useful it is and its limitations. we know that it absorbs movement of the boat; that the longer the chain the greater the amount of absorption; the heavier the chain the greater the amount of absorption. So in your very narrow set of circumstances (deep water, heavy chain) it can reduce your swinging room and the amount of movement of the boat. However the other known fact is that once the chain is straight catenary disappears and the chain is then just a connection between the boat and the anchor where the only property required of the chain is to be stronger than the load placed upon it. The loss of catenary occurs at surprisingly low loads (generated mostly by wind acting on the boat) in the range of 25-35 knots and largely unaffected by the size of the chain. So in relatively benign anchoring conditions catenary has a value, but once you move outside that range it has no value and you need to consider alternative ways of absorbing the variable shock loads which could result in the anchor breaking out as well as making life on board more comfortable. snubbers are the current preferred alternative.

If we move into the "real" world and look at the types of boats that most people now have and the way they anchor, we find that your narrow specific set of circumstances are not the "norm". Very few people have heavy deep boats that can tolerate carrying large amounts of heavy oversized chain, do not normally anchor in deep water(for all sorts of reasons) and are not able to set a riding sail. So hardly surprising that they might look for different ways of safe and comfortable anchoring. So choosing a lighter chain that is still strong enough and using a snubber can achieve the same objective as carrying unnecessary amounts of heavy chain with its bulk, cost and affect on sailing performance. The same applies to anchors. "bigger and heavier" does not necessarily mean better - see the setting and holding performance comparisons between aluminium and steel versions of the same designs.

So, please stop talking about denial, except perhaps at those who do not seem to accept that there are alternates available that are not only well proven but more appropriate to their boats and the way they use them.

 

[RupertW]

Well, it works for me, but I have adequate sized chain. I prevent my boat from yawing about by rigging a riding sail when required. I use topography and a fishfinder to ensure that I'm dropping the anchor in a sensible place. If it's windy, or likely to be windy, I'll anchor in deeper rather than shallower water. Obviously catenary doesn't work in shallow water.
It would maybe be interesting to hear from you and other deniers of the benefits of catenary, as to what you do.

Very similar to you but are aware that heavy chain adds absolutely nothing to the hold except even more chafe resistance. If you said you do all the above and also ensure your chain is a bright a yellow as possible then it woudn’t be the colour that is keeping you safe, it’s your good technique and decent anchor.

 

[NormanS]

It is not a question of denying, but of understanding of what it is and how it works. There is nothing to dispute about how it works, the debate is about how useful it is and its limitations. we know that it absorbs movement of the boat; that the longer the chain the greater the amount of absorption; the heavier the chain the greater the amount of absorption. So in your very narrow set of circumstances (deep water, heavy chain) it can reduce your swinging room and the amount of movement of the boat. However the other known fact is that once the chain is straight catenary disappears and the chain is then just a connection between the boat and the anchor where the only property required of the chain is to be stronger than the load placed upon it. The loss of catenary occurs at surprisingly low loads (generated mostly by wind acting on the boat) in the range of 25-35 knots and largely unaffected by the size of the chain. So in relatively benign anchoring conditions catenary has a value, but once you move outside that range it has no value and you need to consider alternative ways of absorbing the variable shock loads which could result in the anchor breaking out as well as making life on board more comfortable. snubbers are the current preferred alternative.

If we move into the "real" world and look at the types of boats that most people now have and the way they anchor, we find that your narrow specific set of circumstances are not the "norm". Very few people have heavy deep boats that can tolerate carrying large amounts of heavy oversized chain, do not normally anchor in deep water(for all sorts of reasons) and are not able to set a riding sail. So hardly surprising that they might look for different ways of safe and comfortable anchoring. So choosing a lighter chain that is still strong enough and using a snubber can achieve the same objective as carrying unnecessary amounts of heavy chain with its bulk, cost and affect on sailing performance. The same applies to anchors. "bigger and heavier" does not necessarily mean better - see the setting and holding performance comparisons between aluminium and steel versions of the same designs.

So, please stop talking about denial, except perhaps at those who do not seem to accept that there are alternates available that are not only well proven but more appropriate to their boats and the way they use them.

I'm only saying what I do, and what I have. Unlike some others on here, I'm not interested in persuading other people to do either one thing or the other.
It is, of course, nonsense to state, as you do, that the chain becomes "straight". That is an impossibility. I do accept that a chain will at times reach a situation where it can cease to give any effective damping, in exactly the same way that a nylon or similar snubber will reach its elastic limit, and again cease to have any benefit.
A couple of other points that you mention:
You say that catenary is largely unaffected by the size of the chain. Sorry, but that's comical nonsense. A simple experiment will demonstrate.
I'm not at all sure what point you are trying to make in your statement about " bigger and heavier" anchors. I have said nothing on that subject.
What I will tell you is that I carry three main anchors, all of completely different designs, and can and will use the one, or, in some situations, two, best suited to the situation.

 

[geem]

I'm only saying what I do, and what I have. Unlike some others on here, I'm not interested in persuading other people to do either one thing or the other.
It is, of course, nonsense to state, as you do, that the chain becomes "straight". That is an impossibility. I do accept that a chain will at times reach a situation where it can cease to give any effective damping, in exactly the same way that a nylon or similar snubber will reach its elastic limit, and again cease to have any benefit.
A couple of other points that you mention:
You say that catenary is largely unaffected by the size of the chain. Sorry, but that's comical nonsense. A simple experiment will demonstrate.
I'm not at all sure what point you are trying to make in your statement about " bigger and heavier" anchors. I have said nothing on that subject.
What I will tell you is that I carry three main anchors, all of completely different designs, and can and will use the one, or, in some situations, two, best suited to the situation.

When a snubber reaches the end of its elastic limit, it has done so by stretching. How can you possibly say that this is comparible to catenary. I have experienced chains going bar tight and the snatch load is horrendous. You will never experience the same snatch load on a suitably selected snubber.
Have you ever dived on an anchor/chain in 40kt gusts to see how straight the chain will go? I have. It would be very hard to describe the chain as having any catenary. The chain was bar tight. If it wasn't for our long nylon snubber we would have felt the the snatches

 

[NormanS]

When a snubber reaches the end of its elastic limit, it has done so by stretching. How can you possibly say that this is comparible to catenary. I have experienced chains going bar tight and the snatch load is horrendous. You will never experience the same snatch load on a suitably selected snubber.
Have you ever dived on an anchor/chain in 40kt gusts to see how straight the chain will go? I have. It would be very hard to describe the chain as having any catenary. The chain was bar tight. If it wasn't for our long nylon snubber we would have felt the the snatches

I don't get snatch loads. Where we anchor we get winds, so far up to 70 odd knots, but we anchor in places sheltered from the sea, - plenty of these on the West Coast of Scotland. We don't yaw about, which is presumably where you're getting your snatch loads, partly due to the design of the boat, and partly by being proactive, riding sail, decent sized chain, two anchors if and when required etc.
No I never have, and never will dive down to see my anchor at work. It manages to do that all by itself. ?

 

[geem]

I don't get snatch loads. Where we anchor we get winds, so far up to 70 odd knots, but we anchor in places sheltered from the sea, - plenty of these on the West Coast of Scotland. We don't yaw about, which is presumably where you're getting your snatch loads, partly due to the design of the boat, and partly by being proactive, riding sail, decent sized chain, two anchors if and when required etc.
No I never have, and never will dive down to see my anchor at work. It manages to do that all by itself. ?

Where we sail we get squally gusty weather. With anchor catenary we will be pushed backwards by the wind until the catenary has gone, then the snubber takes over. When the squalls hit hard the windage of the boat will drive the boat back fast. Design of the boat is irrelevant in my experience. We are not a lightweight production boat with high windage. We are a heavy displacement cruising yacht.
The idea of diving on your anchor was to educate yourself but I can I imagine that snorkeling in West Scotland in 45kts of wind does not have much appeal?

 

[Neeves]

My graph in post 80 illustrates the difference between nylon rope and chain. As the tensions increase the nylon continues to accept the increased tension, measured for the graph as energy, the chain loses any ability to accept increased energy fairly quickly and then 'its' graph levels out as a straight horizontal line - in contrast to the nylon.

I'm afraid arguing with quantitative evidence lacks any logic. Yes you can deploy more chain - but most people carry a finite amounts of chain. There maybe rocks immediately behind you, there may be other yachts - you may not be able to deploy more chain. A 10m snubber will offer more snubbing ability than 30m of chain and in the seas developed in the image below a snubber would do much to manage those seas. Where the ketch is anchored they have plenty of room to deploy more rode - but that extra rode will do nothing to quell this seas (as useful catenary has gone).

Nylon stretch vs tension (or energy) is roughly a straight line relation ship double tension, double stretch - and nylon will continue to offer this straight line relation ship until it fails. Catenary on the other hand straightens and when straight has no ability to accept more energy.

Of course catenary never disappears - but the ability to be useful to a yacht at anchor has gone, dependent on the size of the chain, length deployed and depth of water.

Initially the chain develops its customary catenary and the nylon contributes little but as the chain straightens the nylon starts to stretch - and as I say - will continue to stretch until it fails.

The trick with a snubber is using a size (and size, diameter and length) that offers you elasticity and is sufficiently strong to accept the tension and this latter is a function of wind and your windage. Inevitably the strength of the nylon will be much less than the strength of the chain (or it will not offer sufficient elasticity).


One problem with discussion on snubbers and chain is that we have no definitions of the conditions. We have sheltered from storms where wind speeds were 70 knots - but we did not record 70 knots, or anything like 70 knots - maybe we would have recorded 15 knots (we took shelter). Other times we record 35 knots at the masthead but wind at deck level might be 20 knots - because we were sheltering 'under' a very low hill only 15m high and our wind gear enjoyed the full rigours of the 35 knots but there was little wind where we actually have windage (down on the deck).

There is a tendency to exaggerate and a tendency to quote the wind speed that was forecast not what was relevant at deck level - how many of us can measure deck level wind speed. How many of us when a forecast 50 knots is forecast anchor in an open roadstead where we know there will be no shelter from the wind - at all. If you are sheltered from developing seas - then you are sheltered from the worst of the wind. We can measure windspeed at the top of the mast - but that is totally irrelevant when I know that the low hill between us and the average wind is providing full shelter and the water is flat.

This is where the fear factor can be engendered, or not "We anchored in 70 knots and slept soundly", "we often anchor in 50 knot wind and our ground tackle is perfect we have no need for a fancy and expensive modern anchor ...." etc etc. .......Really? .... not very useful, economical with the truth to a point where it is dangerous.

To be fully exposed to 50 knots you will enjoy the resultant waves and seas and they will be so uncomfortable that the sound of the wind will pale into insignificance as your yacht will be bucking like a demented cow.

This is what 50 knots looks like, fully exposed to the fury of wind and seas. This is off New Brighton, looking roughly NW. The wind is blowing straight into the Mersey estuary and the fetch is many miles (there nearest shelter from this weather is Ireland. Tell me you anchor in 50 knots - and you slept through these conditions. I don't know but there may be effect of wind over tide.




Not quite the same - but here we are anchored and measuring 35 knots at the mast head. The wind is blowing from right to left and the island where we are sheltered is about the same height as the land behind us to the left of the little hill. You can tell there is little wind where we are anchored as there are no seas, at all. The seas to the left of the image - way in the distance are angry and white - but they are exposed to the full fury of the winds, much higher than 35 knots and the fetch stretches all the way to Antarctica. But we would not anchor fully exposed to winds off the Southern Ocean and that 1,000s on miles of fetch - we would seek shelter and a 10m hill would remove any seas - even if it was still a bit breezy.

Quo Vardis, the ketch, is anchored in 50 knots, we are anchored in 35 knots - not quite the same, ignoring the difference in wind speed.


Anchoring and being exposed to the full brunt of 50 knots is fool hardy - I'm not impressed and simply don't believe it - except when I see photographing evidence - and know the full story (rescued by the RNLI).

Jonathan

 

[Tranona]

I'm only saying what I do, and what I have. Unlike some others on here, I'm not interested in persuading other people to do either one thing or the other.
It is, of course, nonsense to state, as you do, that the chain becomes "straight". That is an impossibility. I do accept that a chain will at times reach a situation where it can cease to give any effective damping, in exactly the same way that a nylon or similar snubber will reach its elastic limit, and again cease to have any benefit.
A couple of other points that you mention:
You say that catenary is largely unaffected by the size of the chain. Sorry, but that's comical nonsense. A simple experiment will demonstrate.
I'm not at all sure what point you are trying to make in your statement about " bigger and heavier" anchors. I have said nothing on that subject.
What I will tell you is that I carry three main anchors, all of completely different designs, and can and will use the one, or, in some situations, two, best suited to the situation.

I know you are only saying what you do and what you have, which limits the validity to your specific circumstances - as I tried to point out. The flaw is in generalising from the specific. So to dismiss others' experience and reasoning does not help at all, particularly when then claiming they are "deniers". All I and others are saying is that catenary is only one factor in the anchoring "problem" and its benefits are limited, plus they can be largely replicated by the use of snubbers which avoids the need for heavy chain. Understanding of what is going on comes from challenging, not accepting the status quo. Just because you are happy with your arrangements does not mean that they are the best even for you, never mind being appropriate for others. BTW would welcome your data on the effect of chain size on catenary to support your view that my observation is "comical" . How are you defining and measuring the effect?. For example have you tried 8mm chain on your boat and found it ineffective? and in what way?

 

[NormanS]

I know you are only saying what you do and what you have, which limits the validity to your specific circumstances - as I tried to point out. The flaw is in generalising from the specific. So to dismiss others' experience and reasoning does not help at all, particularly when then claiming they are "deniers". All I and others are saying is that catenary is only one factor in the anchoring "problem" and its benefits are limited, plus they can be largely replicated by the use of snubbers which avoids the need for heavy chain. Understanding of what is going on comes from challenging, not accepting the status quo. Just because you are happy with your arrangements does not mean that they are the best even for you, never mind being appropriate for others. BTW would welcome your data on the effect of chain size on catenary to support your view that my observation is "comical" . How are you defining and measuring the effect?. For example have you tried 8mm chain on your boat and found it ineffective? and in what way?

But I don't have an "anchoring problem".
As I have said previously, unlike you, I am not trying to force my methods onto others. If you're happy using light chain and rigging a snubber, just carry on doing so.
If you cannot see that the catenary formed in a light chain is different from that formed by the same force in a heavier chain, then further discussion with you is pointless. Goodnight.

 

[Tranona]

But I don't have an "anchoring problem".
As I have said previously, unlike you, I am not trying to force my methods onto others. If you're happy using light chain and rigging a snubber, just carry on doing so.
If you cannot see that the catenary formed in a light chain is different from that formed by the same force in a heavier chain, then further discussion with you is pointless. Goodnight.

When have I ever forced my methods on anybody? Just suggesting that what works for you may not be appropriate for others. One wonders why you bother to even contribute because all you say is what you do and seem unwilling to accept that it may be very specific to you. Nor did I ever say you have a problem - the anchoring "problem" is generic as it clearly is a problem otherwise there would not be so much debate about the alternatives, never mind the huge investment in research and development in finding improved products and techniques.

Of course lighter chain will have less dampening effect than heavier - but the question is how much? and how much difference does it make? I asked if you have tried lighter chain and what the result was - why are you so reluctant to engage at this level?

 

[NormanS]

For some reason you seem very argumentative. You insist that there is an "anchoring problem". I am unaware of a problem. Obviously, as with many things in life, there are many options available, but surely that's not a problem, except for those who insist that their way is the one and only correct way. I disagree.
I am very well aware that what works for me and my yacht, may not be ideal for some other boats, and have never suggested otherwise.
Why would I try, or indeed want to try, using lighter chain? The 10mm chain in use at present is in good condition, having recently been regalvanised, works efficiently and effectively.
I have experience of both lighter and heavier chain. With a smaller boat, I used 8mm chain, with a bigger boat, I used both 16mm and 18mm chain. Relevance?

 

[doug748]

For some reason you seem very argumentative. ☹ You insist that there is an "anchoring problem". I am unaware of a problem. Obviously, as with many things in life, there are many options available, but surely that's not a problem, except for those who insist that their way is the one and only correct way. I disagree.
I am very well aware that what works for me and my yacht, may not be ideal for some other boats, and have never suggested otherwise.
Why would I try, or indeed want to try, using lighter chain? The 10mm chain in use at present is in good condition, having recently been regalvanised, works efficiently and effectively.
I have experience of both lighter and heavier chain. With a smaller boat, I used 8mm chain, with a bigger boat, I used both 16mm and 18mm chain. Relevance?

You are quite correct, some of the comment on this matter is ludicrous.

Enthusiasts tend to get carried away, there are plenty good reasons to carry light anchoring gear but performance of the system is not one of them.



............BTW what is the size of your boat and what size and design is your most used bower? And a long shot.........where did you get your chain regalvanized?


.

 

[NormanS]

You are quite correct, some of the comment on this matter is ludicrous.

Enthusiasts tend to get carried away, there are plenty good reasons to carry light anchoring gear but performance of the system is not one of them.



............BTW what is the size of your boat and what size and design is your most used bower? And a long shot.........where did you get your chain regalvanized?


.

Boat is a 36ft fairly chunky ketch. Anchor in general use is a (genuine) 20kg Bruce, next a Fortress FX23, which is roughly the same dimensions, but not weight, as the (genuine) 20kg Danforth, which it replaced. Third anchor, which is seldom used is a 20kg fabricated (by me) Fisherman type.
I have, in the past, had chain galvanised at Scottish Galvanisers in Glasgow, but more recently at Highland Galvanisers in Cumbernauld, (the heart of the Highlands ?).

 

[geem]

.

For some reason you seem very argumentative. ☹ You insist that there is an "anchoring problem". I am unaware of a problem. Obviously, as with many things in life, there are many options available, but surely that's not a problem, except for those who insist that their way is the one and only correct way. I disagree.
I am very well aware that what works for me and my yacht, may not be ideal for some other boats, and have never suggested otherwise.
Why would I try, or indeed want to try, using lighter chain? The 10mm chain in use at present is in good condition, having recently been regalvanised, works efficiently and effectively.
I have experience of both lighter and heavier chain. With a smaller boat, I used 8mm chain, with a bigger boat, I used both 16mm and 18mm chain. Relevance?

The purpose of only carrying the chain required to do the job and the correctly selected anchor rather than an oversized one is to maintain some sailing performance. If you sit at anchor full-time then sailing performance is irrelevant so carry as much chain as you are happy with. Even on our heavy cruiser I remove as much weight out of the ends of the boat when doing an Atlantic crossing. This improves windward performance and we bash through less waves. We use 10mm chain, but that is the correct size for the boat without going to a high spec chain.

 

[Tranona]

You insist that there is an "anchoring problem". I am unaware of a problem. Obviously, as with many things in life, there are many options available, but surely that's not a problem, except for those who insist that their way is the one and only correct way. I disagree.

Read post#1. This thread would not exist if the OP did not have a problem with anchoring which he describes further in post#41. Plus all the other contributors who have described the problems they have encountered together in many cases with the solutions they have used. To claim you are "unaware" of any problems does suggest a very narrow set of blinkers. Glad you have recognised that it is only those who only advocate one solution (to a non existent problem?) that have an actual problem.

As another poster says enthusiasts tend to get carried away and there are some that are fixated on one thing.

 

[nestawayboats]

Short Version. A few people on here have commented along the lines of "they stuck with what came with the boat and it was fine". I suspect this applies to quite a high percentage of boat owners, particularly those who don't use their boats as often as they'd like, and anchor less often. If you're in a rush my post can be summarised as OK, but please check it - especially the connection between anchor and chain.

Long Version. I bought a Sadler 29 a couple of years ago and what I "inherited" was 20m of 10mm chain attached by means of a shiny stainless steel swivel to a very rusty CQR-esque anchor. I didn't really like the look of that anchor so bought a 10kg Delta, on the basis that it was very unlikely to be worse than a fake CQR, also a reasonable compromise between cost, and likely amount of use... and it would fit on the bow roller. I was fully aware that 20m of chain is never enough, and 10mm is overweight for a 29ft 4 tonne boat, but decided I'd add some (nylon) rope to the end of the chain as an interim measure. So merrily I undid the shiny stainless steel swivel and attached the Delta. It then all proceeded to work reasonably well for a couple of seasons. Until I put the anchor down in Newtown Creek and appeared to be dragging. On pulling up the chain we were indeed dragging because the swivel had snapped internally. 10mm chain with half a swivel on the end of it has very little holding power indeed, who knew?! The failure of the swivel was something of a surprise in as much as if I'd thought about it at all I'd assumed that a swivel sized for 10mm chain was, like the chain, massively over strength for this boat... and it had not even occurred to me that the "swivelling mechanism" inside might just be a bit of thread. The similar-looking and expensive swivel I'd had (bought myself) for a previous boat had a set of interlocking castings inside it.

I don't know if the previous owner had knowingly bought a swivel that - I've since been told - was "really designed for use in the fishing industry", but I'd hazard a guess that he bought it in a chandlery and he had no idea there were (at least) two types of internal construction with similar external appearance. When I inherited that swivel I didn't know its age but it "looked OK from the outside" and, inevitably on a second hand boat, there were a lot of other things to think about of more immediately obvious importance.

All I lost in the end was my 10kg Delta but it could easily have been much worse. We'd been anchored overnight in some reasonably windy conditions only two weekends before, completely unaware of the fact that we weren't so much hanging off a 10kg Delta - and 10mm chain and 14mm rope - as the last remaining fraction of a heavily-corroded thread inside what looked like a perfectly healthy swivel. I'd even been up a couple of times in the night to check chafe on the rope where it went over the bow roller... the seemingly oversized metal thing 30m further down the system was not really a concern.

Maybe lots of people will now say "you should always check inside your swivel, it should be part of your annual checks etc" but I'm willing to bet at least one person reading never has! Others will contend you don't really need a swivel either but that's not really the point, some people have got them and probably some of those have never really thought about the integrity of this bit of kit.

Given this "opportunity" to review my anchoring arrangements I decided to replace the whole lot, starting with 30m of 8mm chain, which is same weight as previous 20m of 10mm chain. I didn't want to add weight, I know how much difference weight in the bow makes in a chop, on a relatively small boat. But now wondering if I should have bought 40m or more of 7 or even 6mm chain. I'm sure reading the analysis of shock loads etc 6mm is strong enough, it just "felt" (completely unscientifically), a bit flimsy after having had 10mm! Anyway the new to me bit is, having read about it somewhere before this thread, and thought it sounded logical, it's attached to a nylon rope snubber I lead back along the deck to a sheet winch, rather than the more common couple of metres to a cleat on the foredeck. So not quite as long as Neeves recommends but far longer than I had ever deployed previously, including during my two years anchoring almost every night in the Caribbean (different yacht, not a lot bigger though). I've only used it a few times so far and perhaps it is perception bias but the boat seems to feel "happier" at anchor. The other end of the chain is attached - by the biggest and highest strength shackle I could find - to a (ducks for cover!) 10kg Rocna. I don't really miss the swivel (no windlass, we're pulling this up by hand) and having had this experience I much prefer to be able to see what's holding the anchor onto the chain...

 

[Neeves]

I am frequently criticised for repetition - nestawayboats illustrates why I am repetitive.

Swivels have been thrashed to death, as not actually swivelling and being prone to failure. This is the reason I developed my Boomerang, Boomerang Your Anchor and NormanS developed his bent link.

Anchor Swivels: Caution Required - Practical Sailor

and also

How Well Do Swivels Reduce Twist? - Practical Sailor

These may be behind a paywall. I am sure PBO has published similar articles.

Oscalluti have their own device, a combination of a bent link and a swivel and Vyv Cox had a picture here on YBW illustrating it may have solved one problem but introduced another - that is equally damning of the design. Vyv may have written an article in PBO - but I don't recall.

But people miss these articles, or the posts here. But the more times the issues are aired the more chance people will take notice.

So....repetition is the name of the game - you may not like the repetition but there are people who have not read articles on swivels (or snubbers) and to require once is enough denies opportunity for members here to read something, of real interest. Reading is voluntary - you don't need to bore yourself - be selective and allow others the opportunity to learn.

And for an appropriate shackle - size is not everything. If you want quality buy a Crosby G207a shackle - but check it fits first - the smallest they make is a 3/8th" shackle - but it has a WLL of 2t much better than your chain. I buy mine from Tecni, in the UK. The shackle pin will fit metric 8mm chain but whether the 'eyes' will fit through the slots in a Knox - ask Knox Anchor.

The 'problem' with a mixed rode is that the textile portion needs to be sufficiently strong, and/or as strong as the chain. It thus tends to be a bit more beefy and less elastic than using a snubber.

Anchoring is a series of compromises.

But I'm becoming repetitive I'll have the Forum Police on my back soon for infringing 'topic frequency' rules

Jonathan

 

[rotrax]

It is, of course, nonsense to state, as you do, that the chain becomes "straight". That is an impossibility.

You should read Peter Hawards account of anchoring near Cape Trafalgar during a severe 'Levanter' that stopped passage into the Med. In his most excellent book "All Weather Yachtsman" published by Adlard Coles

When he and the crew raised the hook the galvanising had flaked off of the links and the links has distorted under the load of 120 MPH - recorded nearby - winds.

If you can explain to my satifaction how galvanising and distorted links can be achieved when at anchor without the chain being very straight and under intense load, I would be very happy to listen.