A very, very lucky girl indeed !!

[armchairsailor]

The whole incident was covered in detail in last month's PBO IIRC, with first hand interviews, the lot. In fact, I reckon it was a good bit of journalism/ reporting.

Since we hear so much about bad reporting on this forum, I feel that it deserves a mention!

 

[DogWatch]

It's just been on the local news. The reason she wasn't wearing the LJ is because it got caught as she fell off - holding her head underwater. To save herself from drowning she took it off and dropped into the water!

So the life jacket nearly killed her, when she went in the water without it she still didn't drown.

And this incident is used as an argument *for* lifejackets?

As usual you have an opinion on everything, but exactly what is it in this case?

Should people wear life jackets or not?

Why is it so important to you that people know you don't?

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

As usual you have an opinion on everything, but exactly what is it in this case?

Should people wear life jackets or not?

Why is it so important to you that people know you don't?

See post 61.

 

[White Horse]

This finally proves that life jackets are not as essential as some people make them out to be.

That's just what I was going to say!

 

[DogWatch]

See post 61.

Fortunately the numbers of deaths in sailing are miniscule, so it's not really worth worrying too much about.

Doesn't add up, your signal to noise ratio on life jacket threads seems to indicate that you worry a great deal about this subject, where you nail your colours however is less clear.

Just as long as no one thinks you're a wussy girly-man that uses a life jacket.

 

[Talulah]

And I received an email last week recalling my Lifejacket which was perhaps giving me a false sense of security about its life saving properties.

 

[Lee999]

Lifejackets!

I'm pretty sure that she would rather have had one on for that two hours. It was actually the lifeline that got snagged and held her under.

I would def agree that a lifeline is more important than a lifejacket but for most of us the two are combined and they're not really so heavy to wear are they?

As for thrashing about to keep warm, that is actually the fastest way to hypothermia. When a real threat exists energy should not be used, nor heat driven to the extremities. Wearing a lifejacket allows the knees to be drawn up and arms locked forward in the heat loss minimising position. Any offshore racing yachtsmen will know this as it is taught to us every three years in the mandatory sea survival course required for the CAT 2 races.

I've never met a lifeboatman who didn't think they were a good idea and they tend to be pretty fair seamen dont they?

 

[Heckler]

And I received an email last week recalling my Lifejacket which was perhaps giving me a false sense of security about its life saving properties.

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=111014&hl=prue&st=25
for info
Stu

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

you worry a great deal about this subject, where you nail your colours however is less clear.

I don't nail my colours to the mast. It's a complex subject. I don't think you could possibly come up with a hard and fast rule.

Just as long as no one thinks you're a wussy girly-man that uses a life jacket.

I suspect you're alone in considering that a factor in your decision.

 

[Jean]

Re: “The whole incident was covered in detail in last month's PBO IIRC”. Lots of food for thought, but what it fails to mention is just how they got in to the “crash gybe” situation in those weather conditions. It seems to have been the gybe that triggered the disastrous chain of events that prevented Buccaneer from staying near the casualty. The article implies that it happened as the skipper took the helm; was it deliberate or accidental? Why did they not simply heave to when it happened? Prue mentions practicing “picking up buoys”, but when did they last practice a MOB drill?

 

[webcraft]

Re: “The whole incident was covered in detail in last month's PBO IIRC”. Lots of food for thought, but what it fails to mention is just how they got in to the “crash gybe” situation in those weather conditions. It seems to have been the gybe that triggered the disastrous chain of events that prevented Buccaneer from staying near the casualty. The article implies that it happened as the skipper took the helm; was it deliberate or accidental? Why did they not simply heave to when it happened? Prue mentions practicing “picking up buoys”, but when did they last practice a MOB drill?

I found this a bit odd as well and can only assume it was accidental. Tacking or heaving to are really the only sensible options with an MOB at night or in rough weather - a sudden thoughless gybe risks injury or damage to the boat, and won't get you back to the MOB any quicker. A crash tack / heaving to is relatively safe and likely to stop the boat very close to the MOB.

- W

 

[Jean]

Reading the PBO article again, looks like the gybe may well have been deliberate; very strange for an "extreamly experienced seaman and sailing instructor", it would be interesting to have him comment if he reads this.

 

[jimi]

Absolutely fantastic survival story and weel done to all involved in those conditions!

several points
1) The issue seemed to be the lifeline holding her under , not the first occurrence. Personally I always keep the lifeline as short as possible for that reason (use a simple OH knot to shorten. I presume the lady would have been happier in the water had she managed to retain her LJ rather than being forced by the situatioon to dump it in the interests of survival! At night particularly, LJ's are a no brainer.
2) Cold water survival. It would appear to me that some people need to do some research. Here's a link which I found using google with some good info. www.leoblockley.org.uk/documents/cold-water-survival.pdf

 

[jimi]

Reading the PBO article again, looks like the gybe may well have been deliberate; very strange for an "extreamly experienced seaman and sailing instructor", it would be interesting to have him comment if he reads this.

Good point, I've argued until I'm blue in the face about this with sailors from dinghy sailing backgrounds. To me a gybe on a yacht for man overboard is an absolute no no whereas in a dinghy it is the preferred modus operandi.

 

[Jean]

Good point, I've argued until I'm blue in the face about this with sailors from dinghy sailing backgrounds. To me a gybe on a yacht for man overboard is an absolute no no whereas in a dinghy it is the preferred modus operandi.

Quoting this incident should help your argument, definitely a no no on a yacht!

 

[reginaldon]

Reading the PBO article again, looks like the gybe may well have been deliberate; very strange for an "extreamly experienced seaman and sailing instructor", it would be interesting to have him comment if he reads this.

In my early says they always said, 'when MOB gybe!'

 

[Jean]

Would that have been when you were dingy sailing? Trying it on a yacht in the conditions experienced that night likely to cause major damage, just as it did for Buccaneer.

 

[Sybarite]

What an ignorant comment; lifejackets are meant to increase the likelihood of survival, not to guarantee it. 30, 60 minutes later, who knows, she might have been sunk/ turned onto her face/ be dead. Without a lifejacket her legacy to her surviving relatives would have been , what, £60 higher?

Don't you recognize a tongue in cheek remark?

 

[richgiddens]

Using this story as evidence that one is a safer without a life jacket is hilarious. It's akin to saying, 'my granny smoked 50 fags a day and lived to be 90'. So what? It's a statistical anomaly.
If the woman' situation was duplicated a hundred times, there's be very few survivors and cosiderably more if lifejackets were worn.

 

[zarathustra]

If the woman' situation was duplicated a hundred times, there's be very few survivors and considerably more if lifejackets were worn.

wouldn't they all have drowned if they all wore lifejackets and duplicated her falling off the side as she did......unless they also cut themselves free thus swimming without a lifejacket, just as Pru did, isn't that the point some are making?