A couple of questions re diy replacing standing rigging.

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fredrussell

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I’m going to do my own standing rigging when things warm up a bit. I’m going to send old shrouds to Jimmy Green (?) one at a time to be copied. I have a good means of getting up and down (keel stepped) mast. Obviously I run a compensating line down to relevant deck/toerail before removing each shroud. My questions are:

Does it matter what order I do shrouds in? It’s a double spreader rig.

If I measure tension (using loos gauge) of outgoing shroud pair, then tension new pair to same figure, would that be a good approach?

Do I need to replace bottle-screws? I remember reading somewhere that if they’re chromed bronze ones you can re-use them.

Toggles are always replaced, yes?

Any other tips gratefully received. It looks a straightforward enough task to me but I’m not looking forward to dismantling a 30 year old Rotostay furler. I’ve read they can be a pig.
 
Rather than paying to send each cable to and from Jimmy Green, why not get them made locally Fred ? There is a rigger that lives in Shotley and has a "unit" in Kings boatyard at Pinmill, used to work for Foxs.

https://adrigging.co.uk/

No connection.
 
I would advise you to get the mast down if it has not been done for 30 years...easier to do it on the ground and to change toggles may be very difficult...

I changed toggles a few years ago and think it would have been almost impossible with the mast in place...

One delivery and collection may help save some of the cost of craneage...
 
I'd second PaulRainbow's suggestion of getting it made locally - much cheaper than sending heavy stuff away by courier - but I'm not endorsing his suggested supplier as I have no knowledge of him. Last time I had it done I used the people at Levington.

What I would suggest is that, when you've got it all replaced, you should get a rigger to set it up for you properly. Boat owners rarely tension their own rigging sufficiently, and incorrect tension is one of the main causes of failure. It's fairly cheap, but a good investment. And you'll be surprised how taut everything feels!
 
I've done this, with the exception of the furler which I tackled when the mast was down.

I did them in pairs: first the cap shrouds port then stbd, then the backstay, then fwd lowers then aft lowers. In fact I think I took the lowers off all at once to cut down trips to the rigger. In theory the pairs should all be the same length of course.
Don't think it particularly matters which, but I did the most scary first - you have to be sure you have an idea how the caps detach from the crosstrees.

The Loos gauge has a table to work out the approximate tension settings for your rigging, your stuff may be different so I think it is worth looking at it, as you suggest.

I reused my chromed open style rigging screws and have no plans to change - though I will keep an eye on them each season. Would not change the toggles either, well I might if planning a 5 year circumnavigation but they are well oversize.

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I had my rigging replaced professionally in Plymouth before Lockdown III, what they found that had been done last time was more than a tad worrying! I am pretty sure that I would not have spotted that had I done the job myself.
 
Best investment is removing the mast. All tangs can be closely observed and sheaves. Lights overhauled and spreaders. The jib furler will benefit from a total overhaul.

Getting a quote for all at once will be another saving. A local supplier will likely put in the hour or so to retension. But the final setup had to be afloat and under sail to be completely satisfied.

That's the way I did it.

PWG
 
Cheers guys. Paul, I had forgotten about the guy in Gus’s yard - I’ll give him a call.

Pandos, rigging was last done 16 years ago. Why would mast bring up or down affect toggle replacement? Are we talking about the same thing? I mean the toggles between chainplate and bottle screw. Is that the wrong term? Are there others involved?

PVB, will deffo get a rigger in to tune it all, that bit is beyond me.

Doug, when you say crosstrees, that’s the same as spreaders, yes? A term I’ve never been sure about. I haven’t investigated how shrouds attach to them, will do that soon.

Peter, I simply don’t have the funds to get the mast down at the mo, I’m self employed and 2020 was a tough year earnings-wise. That’s the main reason for doing the job myself. The fine tuning of rig is obviously a jib for a pro, but I reckon I’m capable of doing the rest.
 
fredrussell said:
Doug, when you say crosstrees, that’s the same as spreaders, yes? A term I’ve never been sure about. I haven’t investigated how shrouds attach to them, will do that soon.

The fine tuning of rig is obviously a jib for a pro, but I reckon I’m capable of doing the rest.
Click to expand...


Yes, spreaders, crosstrees is a bit archaic.

It cost me nearly 400 quid to have the mast down and up this winter so I have every sympathy with you. A keel stepped double spreader rig is no joke and the rigging is a right mess when it is on the floor. It's also a prime target for damage and theft.
Provided you are fit and youngish, it is arguably less fraught to go up the mast to do it. However if those spreader ends hold the wire by some devilish method you could have a difficulty.

Replace the rig as you found it, with your Loos gauge, and I would see no great motivation to use a rigger. Bit of black magic there in my view.
On boats, the more you do yourself the more you learn, I reckon.


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Ive done mine twice over the years ive owned it.. guess i must be lucky as our sailing club has a mast derick on the pontoon and is a whole £10 to use.. I give all the rigging to a local rigger who makes up all the new rigging, then i refit and tension but mine is single spreaders.. With twin from what i read some time back i would use a rigger to tension it as it becomes a lot more complicated with different tensions dependant on where the wire goes..
 
fredrussell said:
Cheers guys. Paul, I had forgotten about the guy in Gus’s yard - I’ll give him a call.

Pandos, rigging was last done 16 years ago. Why would mast bring up or down affect toggle replacement? Are we talking about the same thing? I mean the toggles between chainplate and bottle screw. Is that the wrong term? Are there others involved?

PVB, will deffo get a rigger in to tune it all, that bit is beyond me.

Doug, when you say crosstrees, that’s the same as spreaders, yes? A term I’ve never been sure about. I haven’t investigated how shrouds attach to them, will do that soon.

Peter, I simply don’t have the funds to get the mast down at the mo, I’m self employed and 2020 was a tough year earnings-wise. That’s the main reason for doing the job myself. The fine tuning of rig is obviously a jib for a pro, but I reckon I’m capable of doing the rest.
Click to expand...
Yes there are also toggles where the forestay and back stay attach to the crane.

When I took mine out I discovered that they had suffered crevice corrosion due to selden stamping the part number along where they were folded...

This could not be seen without removing them completely,

I see the reason for doing it yourself...good on you if you are able but do at least check these when you are up. I knew nothing about them when I did mine 15 years ago...when the mast was down a few years ago I did just them,

this year I intend to drop mine again. It will only cost me 200 quid and that will get my engine out onto the ground and back into the boat...
I'll find a photo of the toggles and post it may help.
 
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I used Adie Gilson at Pin Mill (as referred to above) a couple of years ago and he made a good job of it at a sensible price. I gave him the old set to copy and then rerigged the mast myself, but it was a) off the boat and b) only a single spreader rig. If you did the work yourself as you suggest, I am sure Ady would be agreeable to tuning it for you after fitting.
 
If money is tight then plenty of it to be saved by not using Jimmy Green. Very expensive in my experience.
Try a like for like quote from zspars or some of the other riggers. S3i is very reasonable though I didn't have the greatest experience with them last time.
 
Thanks all, plenty to digest here. I won’t be tackling it till April/May I reckon, unless we get a warm spell before then.
 
I paid a ccompany a few years back to renew my standing rigging. I won't comment about the price but to me it was good value and I learnt a lot from chatting and helping the person doing the work. So good value imho.
 
I replaced my rigging a couple of years ago - mast taken down, old rigging taken to Woodbridge boatyard and they duplioated it . New rigging screws supplied. Just as well I did it, original rigging screws were knackered and a couple of problems found with the babystay connection on the mast, also rewired the mast and unseized the mast head pulleys. They were cheaper than Jimmy Green and did a good job.
 
I replaced my own rigging 8 years ago in Ipswich. I had the mast down to rewire it and check everything up there so it was easier to measure the rigging carefully and send the dimensions to Z Spars in Hadleigh who made it up a few cm overlength and with swages for the top fitting and supplied stalok ends for the bottom fitting. I then cut to length using the old rigging as my template.

I'd recommend waitng until you can drop the mast for the forestay and outer shrouds. You will want to see the condition of the mast fittings up close at some point. Furlers and spreader ends can be a right bugger while the mast is stepped. I have dropped and remounted the furler once while stepped though. Its no fun but doable.
 
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