6 lead ECG monitor in your pocket

Irish Rover

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At the risk of stirring more controversy following on from the onboard defibrillator thread here's a link to another piece of kit that might interest boaters with cardiac issues. You can email the ECG printout directly to your doctor from the app. It's no substitute for a visit to your doctor but that's not always possible when we're on the boat and a cardiologist told me he'd be happy to give advice based on a readout from this pocket deviceAliveCor
 

mjcoon

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It was being given a monitor to wear for 24 hours of my normal activity that told the NHS that I should have a pacemaker pronto several years ago. But I'm sure it did not have as many as 6 leads; that sounds more like the bedside one I was using at the weekend!
 

Irish Rover

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It was being given a monitor to wear for 24 hours of my normal activity that told the NHS that I should have a pacemaker pronto several years ago. But I'm sure it did not have as many as 6 leads; that sounds more like the bedside one I was using at the weekend!
I think the bedside one has 12. I specifically mentioned the 6 lead device because there is also a cheaper single lead device of the same name which, while useful, gives the Doc far less information and data.
 

johnalison

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A single lead will normally give enough information to diagnose an arrhythmia adequately. It may or may not show signs of a myocardial infarction. Even a full ECG may not show one since signs sometimes take days to appear. On the whole, I think having an ECG available is likely to be of more use than a defibrillator, mentioned in the other thread.
 

mjcoon

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I think the bedside one has 12. I specifically mentioned the 6 lead device because there is also a cheaper single lead device of the same name which, while useful, gives the Doc far less information and data.
I read the device blurb and noted that apparently three contact pads yields six leads, which I do not profess to understand! As for the number of leads I had at the weekend, I don't know but was still peeling contact buttons off my chest when I got home...
 

grumpy_o_g

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A single lead will normally give enough information to diagnose an arrhythmia adequately. It may or may not show signs of a myocardial infarction. Even a full ECG may not show one since signs sometimes take days to appear. On the whole, I think having an ECG available is likely to be of more use than a defibrillator, mentioned in the other thread.

Wouldn't a defib also need to be at least a basic ECG, just not one that actually graphs if you see what I mean?
 

Irish Rover

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I think having an ECG available is likely to be of more use than a defibrillator, mentioned in the other thread.
Of course it's not an either or situation. They're 2 entirely different appliances for use in entirely different circumstances. Having one of them doesn't affect the need or desirability of having the other.
 

secondmate

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Some automated defibrillator machines have an ECG display, they all are able to recognise the heart rhythm or absence of a rhythm and then advise whether a shock should be given
 

johnalison

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Wouldn't a defib also need to be at least a basic ECG, just not one that actually graphs if you see what I mean?
A defibrillator has only one use, to deal with VF, which is probably going to be untreatable while on passage. Other cardiac problems could crop up where ECG information sent for professional advice could be useful. I don’t think it would be part of most sailors’ kit unless a member of the crew were known to be at risk though.
 

grumpy_o_g

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A defibrillator has only one use, to deal with VF, which is probably going to be untreatable while on passage. Other cardiac problems could crop up where ECG information sent for professional advice could be useful. I don’t think it would be part of most sailors’ kit unless a member of the crew were known to be at risk though.

I will bow to your vastly superior and professional knowledge then. I incorrectly thought that some forms/types of fibrillation were at least temporarily corrected by a defib, at least for a while.
 

PilotWolf

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A defibrillator has only one use, to deal with VF, which is probably going to be untreatable while on passage. Other cardiac problems could crop up where ECG information sent for professional advice could be useful. I don’t think it would be part of most sailors’ kit unless a member of the crew were known to be at risk though.

Do the AED shock (pulseless) VT?

Oh and the number of 'leads' doesn't equate to the number of wires. I rusty on ECG but can't still reconise the main rhythms, others can probably explain better.

W
 
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johnalison

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I will bow to your vastly superior and professional knowledge then. I incorrectly thought that some forms/types of fibrillation were at least temporarily corrected by a defib, at least for a while.
VF or ventricular fibrillation is what a defibrillator will correct. As stated before, the chances of someone surviving recovery from this without full support are not good, which makes its use on passage of limited help. There are other forms of dysrhythmia, such as the common AF or atrial fibrillation which do not lead to immediate death but which may disable the sufferer and need treatment. The correction of these, when needed requires specialised treatment, either electrical or with drugs. On passage, AF or one of the tachycardias would not be treatable without the right drugs to hand and all one could do would be to rest the subject. Communicating the ECG could be useful in assessing the risk and expediting treatment or having the sufferer taken off by lifeboat or helicopter.
 

KeelsonGraham

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It would be helpful if you would explain why you say the scan watch is better. As far as I can see the scanwatch is equivalent to a single lead ECG whereas the Kardia gives a 6 lead reading.

It provides an instant medical-grade facility for creating an ECG (one push of a button). It’s always on your wrist, it also measures SPO2 and the battery lasts at least a month.

If you have a momentary problem, by the time you dig out the Kardio it’s over. The Kardio is a great bit of kit but I’ve seen no practical differences in the quality of the ECGs of the two.

No, doubt a cardiac specialist might, but for the purposes of amateur monitoring on board a yacht, the waterproof Withings gets my vote.

The Withings BP cuff also has an option to analyse heart valve sounds.
 

PilotWolf

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It provides an instant medical-grade facility for creating an ECG (one push of a button). It’s always on your wrist, it also measures SPO2 and the battery lasts at least a month.

If you have a momentary problem, by the time you dig out the Kardio it’s over. The Kardio is a great bit of kit but I’ve seen no practical differences in the quality of the ECGs of the two.

No, doubt a cardiac specialist might, but for the purposes of amateur monitoring on board a yacht, the waterproof Withings gets my vote.

The Withings BP cuff also has an option to analyse heart valve sounds.

The watch only looks to give one lead('view') as opposed to 6? Different problems will be seen from different angles through the heart.

This might explain it better?


W.
 
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Irish Rover

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It provides an instant medical-grade facility for creating an ECG (one push of a button). It’s always on your wrist, it also measures SPO2 and the battery lasts at least a month.

If you have a momentary problem, by the time you dig out the Kardio it’s over. The Kardio is a great bit of kit but I’ve seen no practical differences in the quality of the ECGs of the two.

No, doubt a cardiac specialist might, but for the purposes of amateur monitoring on board a yacht, the waterproof Withings gets my vote.

The Withings BP cuff also has an option to analyse heart valve sounds.
An Apple watch or a good Android watch will give you a similar ECG single lead reading, as far as I'm aware, and also a blood oxygen reading. Both are also fully waterproof. I'm personally more interested in having a monitor from which I can email results to my doctor to give the fullest possible picture and he tells me that a 6 lead reading is far more useful and informative than a single lead reading. However, I'm saying all this with no direct experience or knowledge of the Withings.
 

KeelsonGraham

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As I said, yes a medical pro will find a 6-lead thingy much more useful. But, on a boat offshore, you probably don’t need anything fancy ‘cos your cardiologist will be many days away from you. A ‘better’ ECG isn’t going to make a blind bit of difference to the treatment you get for your heart condition while on your boat ;)

The Withings produces a PDF which you can send to a doc - as does the Kardia.

The Apple watch is twice the price and can’t go more than a few hours without a charge. The Withings will do a slow Atlantic crossing on one charge.

I’m not advocating for Withings, I’m simply saying that I find it a useful and better system when I’m on my boat.
 

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Rather than being selective about what medical equipment to take on a voyage, wouldn’t it be safer for all us obscenely rich yachties (so I’m told) to be considering a full conversion of the forecabin into a fully equipped theatre to cover all potential health problems and complete with a trained nurse too?
 

Irish Rover

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As I said, yes a medical pro will find a 6-lead thingy much more useful. But, on a boat offshore, you probably don’t need anything fancy ‘cos your cardiologist will be many days away from you. A ‘better’ ECG isn’t going to make a blind bit of difference to the treatment you get for your heart condition while on your boat ;)

The Withings produces a PDF which you can send to a doc - as does the Kardia.

The Apple watch is twice the price and can’t go more than a few hours without a charge. The Withings will do a slow Atlantic crossing on one charge.

I’m not advocating for Withings, I’m simply saying that I find it a useful and better system when I’m on my boat.
If you follow the logic of your first para there's absolutely no point in having any ECG on a boat offshore. My reason for having it is to be able to email to my doctor and take his advice which could be anything from "don't worry" to Mayday. A 6 lead is superior to a single lead in that regard. Keeping my phone charged is an essential safety requirement on my boat. The Kardia does not need to be charged. Your #10 certainly seemed to me you're advocating strongly for Withings.
 
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