Yell Sound, The Shetland Bus, Sea Lice, Curlews and Bikinis

jac said:
As an alternative suggestion why not a virtual subscription thing rather than PayPal taps and then get full access. You tube is too easy to just forget to go to your site and pay, especially if I'm streaming via the DVD player to the biggish TV.

I'm not suggesting that you go to the trouble of building some kind of subscription engine on KTL as the stuff is on YouTube anyway. Instead, just make it easy for your fans to remember to pay our dues every time.

I would happily set up a SO say £5pm to watch your films.

It saves me the bother of going to PayPal to send to you each time I watch one and if you get a few doing that, you get a regular source of income.

If doing it I would perhaps suggest setting up a separate bank account to receive the money. Then transfer once a month.
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the problem is that I can only make eight half hour films a year

and those go out in the winter so for six months of the year you would be paying for nothing

you tube is really clever - it is like a cuckoo in the nest placing itself between us.

I have dancing with google algorithms for the past eight years

once you are on youtube they do a great job of keeping you there.

I have been sorting out the youtube chanel so that it will be tidy should I never touch it again

I have been re-digitising and uploading films that I used to sell on DVD. The music has been paid for.

this is what my inbox looks like - within seconds they have pounced on it and declared it theirs

google-grab.jpg


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dylanwinter said:
the problem is that I can only make eight half hour films a year

and those go out in the winter so for six months of the year you would be paying for nothing

you tube is really clever - it is like a cuckoo in the nest placing itself between us.
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Sneaky littl ebu88ers really aren't they.

My point re enabling alternative ways to pay though still stands.

Don't look at it as someone paying £X per month to watch a video, therefore there needs to be a video every month. Instead, look at it as someone paying £X per year to watch 8 videos. So as long as you get the 8 videos out then no issue. Having the payment monthly just means that for the subscriber, it's a tiny amount they won't miss. If you asked for it in one annual payment then they might think twice. Now you might think £60 a year to watch some old bloke in a old boat is excessive so might want to lower your suggested amount but even £1 a month every month from all the people who watch your videos may be more reliable and lucrative than expecting people to move from the nice you tube app on their smart telly, find a tablet / laptop, go to your site. Tap the PayPal button, fill in some details then send you $1 of which PayPal take 40%.

Far easier for viewers to set up a regular standing order once, you get all the money and then the viewers can relax and binge on all the films you put out, safely knowing that they have paid there dues.
 
jac said:
Sneaky littl ebu88ers really aren't they.

My point re enabling alternative ways to pay though still stands.

Don't look at it as someone paying £X per month to watch a video, therefore there needs to be a video every month. Instead, look at it as someone paying £X per year to watch 8 videos. So as long as you get the 8 videos out then no issue. Having the payment monthly just means that for the subscriber, it's a tiny amount they won't miss. If you asked for it in one annual payment then they might think twice. Now you might think £60 a year to watch some old bloke in a old boat is excessive so might want to lower your suggested amount but even £1 a month every month from all the people who watch your videos may be more reliable and lucrative than expecting people to move from the nice you tube app on their smart telly, find a tablet / laptop, go to your site. Tap the PayPal button, fill in some details then send you $1 of which PayPal take 40%.

Far easier for viewers to set up a regular standing order once, you get all the money and then the viewers can relax and binge on all the films you put out, safely knowing that they have paid there dues.
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you speak good sense

but you see I like it that people tap better on a good film than an okay one

different films say different things to different people

I would hope that some of them stick in peoples heads long enough for at some stage when they are on paypal for ebaying antifoul to their front door they might just go - oh yes.

Idealistic bollix perhaps

The other thing - I am currently re-digitising the stuff that was formerly on the DVDs and sticking it up on Youtube at the best quality and in the order and with wording the algorithm would like them in.

People tapping for old films that they had missed or forgotten about - or now mean something different to them if they have sailed in my wake

in the days of DVDs it was called the long tail

when I was making DVDs I would get orders for years 1, 2 ,3 , 4, and 5

at christmas blokes might all five sets - $125

Google has eaten the long tail. This paypal what you like when you really like something seems to be working sort of okay.

there are some paypal stats on my website

.

It is basically watch now - show your appreciation later if the film is good enough for you to remember

am I convincing you?

I am not even sure I am convincing myself

that aside it is a more interesting way of doing things. It is a bit clunky but it works. Bit like an old Centaur.
 
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dylanwinter said:
you speak good sense

but you see I like it that people tap better on a good film than an okay one

different films say different things to different people

I would hope that some of them stick in peoples heads long enough for at some stage when they are on paypal for ebaying antifoul to their front door they might just go - oh yes.

Idealistic bollix perhaps

The other thing - I am currently re-digitising the stuff that was formerly on the DVDs and sticking it up on Youtube at the best quality and in the order and with wording the algorithm would like them in.

People tapping for old films that they had missed or forgotten about - or now mean something different to them if they have sailed in my wake

in the days of DVDs it was called the long tail

when I was making DVDs I would get orders for years 1, 2 ,3 , 4, and 5

at christmas blokes might all five sets - $125

Google has eaten the long tail. This paypal what you like when you really like something seems to be working sort of okay.

there are some paypal stats on my website

.

It is basically watch now - show your appreciation later if the film is good enough for you to remember

am I convincing you?

I am not even sure I am convincing myself

that aside it is a more interesting way of doing things. It is a bit clunky but it works. Bit like an old Centaur.
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Fair point but two factors for you to consider.

1) do you want feedback or cash to enable you to continue. And if you want feedback, what's wrong with the YouTube thumbs up or thumb down bit. Also no need to get rid of the PayPal tap.

2) you assume that people use PayPal. I don't since I found out how much they rip people off when I sold some stuff on eBay. So although I donated to you about a year or two ago, I have been meaning to post you a cheque for about the last 18months to cover viewing some of the films. Have I done it? No. I have to did out my cheque book, write it, put in envelope, look up your address on KTL. Find a stamp. All at the time when I'm thinking about it.

Had I been able to set up a standing order every month I wouldn't even have had to move from my seat. Just log-on to online banking, bang in some details. All done in 5 minutes.

How many more are like me?
 
jac said:
Fair point but two factors for you to consider.

1) do you want feedback or cash to enable you to continue. And if you want feedback, what's wrong with the YouTube thumbs up or thumb down bit. Also no need to get rid of the PayPal tap.

2) you assume that people use PayPal. I don't since I found out how much they rip people off when I sold some stuff on eBay. So although I donated to you about a year or two ago, I have been meaning to post you a cheque for about the last 18months to cover viewing some of the films. Have I done it? No. I have to did out my cheque book, write it, put in envelope, look up your address on KTL. Find a stamp. All at the time when I'm thinking about it.

Had I been able to set up a standing order every month I wouldn't even have had to move from my seat. Just log-on to online banking, bang in some details. All done in 5 minutes.

How many more are like me?
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So the threshold for you is much higher than for some-one with paypal

you have to get an envelope, write a cheque etc etc

So far the experiment is producing interesting results.

How many more are there without paypal - dunno but making micro-payments without it is jolly hard

D
 
jac said:
How many more are like me?
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Quite a lot probably, especially among MOBs.

I'm a newbie here, and have only been sailing for 4 years. Previously cycling was my main thing, and specifically long distance cycling as I got older (& slower but with more stamina). Anyway, that's beside the point.

In 2015 a fellow long distance cyclist (Steve Abraham of Milton Keynes) decided to attempt to break a record set by Tommy Godwin in 1939 for the highest annual mileage. Tommy's record was 75,065 miles. It was not the sort of glamorous short term endeavour that attracted serious sponsorship, so although Steve had some money & sponsors gave enough bikes, tyres & chains to last the year he needed more. (http://oneyeartimetrial.org.uk/ if you are interested, although it's a bit out of date now)

His status in the long distance cycling community was (is) such that many donated by direct debit, which sustained the attempt. Some by as little as £1 per month, most by a fiver and a fair few £10 or more.

In the end he was unsuccessful by about 10,000 miles. He was knocked off his bike by a moped on the A38 in Devon in March 15 and had about 6 weeks off the bike. A parallel American attempt by Kurt Searvogel succeeded.

There are IMO parallels to KTL, insofar as it is a gargantuan effort that requires dedication and single mindedness. Steve's record attempt was very "British", as IMV is KTL.

KTL has had more than one boat. Reading this "the 61-year-old plans to buy a Fisher 25 to continue filming in Scotland in the winter as he “needs inside steering”." makes me believe that KTL will continue. (As a hack I hope you appreciate the selective quote Dylan!)

Direct debit subscription may well be a useful tool to enable it to continue.
 
Iminei said:
Quite a lot probably, especially among MOBs.

I'm a newbie here, and have only been sailing for 4 years. Previously cycling was my main thing, and specifically long distance cycling as I got older (& slower but with more stamina). Anyway, that's beside the point.

In 2015 a fellow long distance cyclist (Steve Abraham of Milton Keynes) decided to attempt to break a record set by Tommy Godwin in 1939 for the highest annual mileage. Tommy's record was 75,065 miles. It was not the sort of glamorous short term endeavour that attracted serious sponsorship, so although Steve had some money & sponsors gave enough bikes, tyres & chains to last the year he needed more. (http://oneyeartimetrial.org.uk/ if you are interested, although it's a bit out of date now)

His status in the long distance cycling community was (is) such that many donated by direct debit, which sustained the attempt. Some by as little as £1 per month, most by a fiver and a fair few £10 or more.

In the end he was unsuccessful by about 10,000 miles. He was knocked off his bike by a moped on the A38 in Devon in March 15 and had about 6 weeks off the bike. A parallel American attempt by Kurt Searvogel succeeded.

There are IMO parallels to KTL, insofar as it is a gargantuan effort that requires dedication and single mindedness. Steve's record attempt was very "British", as IMV is KTL.

KTL has had more than one boat. Reading this "the 61-year-old plans to buy a Fisher 25 to continue filming in Scotland in the winter as he “needs inside steering”." makes me believe that KTL will continue. (As a hack I hope you appreciate the selective quote Dylan!)

Direct debit subscription may well be a useful tool to enable it to continue.
Click to expand...

what you say makes sense

and I have not thrown in the towell yet on this thing

I am channeling my daughter here now

she would say that you guys who gave to the cyclist were doing it for the achievement

she says I am just one more old bloke sailing where everyone has been before

she says I have to train the old sailors (her words not mine) to chip in for the entertainment value of the films not for the costs of making them.

If I can get five per cent of them to think in terms of chipping in a dollar per hour of KTL then I can go back to scotland in a warm dry well funded safe boat that will keep me, the camera gear and the bedding from rotting.

If I can't get 5 per cent to pay $1 an hour for their KTL entertainment videos then the thing falls apart and it back to bikinis again.
 
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dylanwinter said:
what you say makes sense

and I have not thrown in the towell yet on this thing

I am channeling my daughter here now

she would say that you guys who gave to the cyclist were doing it for the achievement

she says I am just one more old bloke sailing where everyone has been before

she says I have to train the old sailors (her words not mine) to chip in for the entertainment value of the films not for the costs of making them.

If I can get five per cent of them to think in terms of chipping in a dollar per hour of KTL then I can go back to scotland in a warm dry well funded safe boat that will keep me, the camera gear and the bedding from rotting.

If I can't get 5 per cent to pay $1 an hour for their KTL entertainment videos then the thing falls apart and it back to bikinis again.
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Ok but why make it hard for people to give you money.

Slight tangent here but bare with me.

One of the most accurate ways of determining whether or not someone will buy again is some research that measures how much effort someone has to put in to complete the transaction. Surprisingly where it is easy, people are much more likely to buy.

What I'm saying in a roundabout way, is that by restricting donations to either post you a cheque or go to your website, click on a button then fill in a shed load of info makes it a real pain. And all that for $1 , of which 40c goes to PayPal. The remaining 60c which is worth 50p gets to you.

No disrespect to your daughter, but I do wonder what insight she can provide. She doesn't strike me as 50+ year old bloke!!

As for your dollar an hour for KTL. Assuming you do produce maybe 8 films a year the you want $8 a year from me. More than happy to pay that. Happy to do that in £ and even round up. But if I had the choice of spending 2 minutes online, filling out a standing order instruction, 10 minutes finding cheque book, filling in, posting off or going to KTL then clinking on PayPal button and filling in a load of detail, knowing that they will cream off loads of it then in order of priority, I will go SO, cheque and then miles behind the PayPal option. The fact that in 18 months I still haven't got round to sending the cheque says something.

Make it easy for us, accept payments by Standing Order.
 
jac said:
Ok but why make it hard for people to give you money.

Slight tangent here but bare with me.

One of the most accurate ways of determining whether or not someone will buy again is some research that measures how much effort someone has to put in to complete the transaction. Surprisingly where it is easy, people are much more likely to buy.

What I'm saying in a roundabout way, is that by restricting donations to either post you a cheque or go to your website, click on a button then fill in a shed load of info makes it a real pain. And all that for $1 , of which 40c goes to PayPal. The remaining 60c which is worth 50p gets to you.

No disrespect to your daughter, but I do wonder what insight she can provide. She doesn't strike me as 50+ year old bloke!!

As for your dollar an hour for KTL. Assuming you do produce maybe 8 films a year the you want $8 a year from me. More than happy to pay that. Happy to do that in £ and even round up. But if I had the choice of spending 2 minutes online, filling out a standing order instruction, 10 minutes finding cheque book, filling in, posting off or going to KTL then clinking on PayPal button and filling in a load of detail, knowing that they will cream off loads of it then in order of priority, I will go SO, cheque and then miles behind the PayPal option. The fact that in 18 months I still haven't got round to sending the cheque says something.

Make it easy for us, accept payments by Standing Order.
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Paypal is just two taps - it is so easy. Most people have it. I don't know how a man would buy chandlery and yacht unguents without paypal

it is clean it is safe.

the figure of a dollar an hour was pulled out of the air

I just got this as a comment


Steven Yates
Steven Yates14 minutes agoHighlighted comment
I can't remember now which ones of this series that i bunged a little tap on, so here is one. Of all the films its the ones from here and the wash that i most enjoyed and i didn't see them when they first came out as that was before i discovered the channel. It might be years before i get there myself on my own journey.
KeepTurningLeft
KeepTurningLeft2 seconds ago
thanks Steve - you are blowing life into the fabled long tail. The purity of your altruism overwhelms me. You have just paid purely for the entertainment of the films not for the running costs of a boat - although I will put your money into the warm boat fund

I like the simplicty of paypal - please watch the films guilt free until I fold and do patreon or standing orders or recurring paypal taps at some time in the future

Dylan
 
dylanwinter said:
Paypal is just two taps - it is so easy. Most people have it. I don't know how a man would buy chandlery and yacht unguents without paypal

it is clean it is safe.

the figure of a dollar an hour was pulled out of the air

I just got this as a comment


Steven Yates
Steven Yates14 minutes agoHighlighted comment
I can't remember now which ones of this series that i bunged a little tap on, so here is one. Of all the films its the ones from here and the wash that i most enjoyed and i didn't see them when they first came out as that was before i discovered the channel. It might be years before i get there myself on my own journey.
KeepTurningLeft
KeepTurningLeft2 seconds ago
thanks Steve - you are blowing life into the fabled long tail. The purity of your altruism overwhelms me. You have just paid purely for the entertainment of the films not for the running costs of a boat - although I will put your money into the warm boat fund

I like the simplicty of paypal - please watch the films guilt free until I fold and do patreon or standing orders or recurring paypal taps at some time in the futures

Dylan
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Personally I don't use it.

Happy to buy unguents online via whichever supplier is cheapest. Most of them just want you to plug your credit card details etc in.

No issue. They turn up the next day.

Your choice of course.

All I'm saying that the more sources of receiving money you cut off, the less money you will receive.
 
dylanwinter said:
So the threshold for you is much higher than for some-one with paypal

you have to get an envelope, write a cheque etc etc

So far the experiment is producing interesting results.

How many more are there without paypal - dunno but making micro-payments without it is jolly hard

D
Click to expand...

I wont use PayPal and have no pay Pal I would do a faster bank transfer though if
there was ACC details for an account to transfer to .It takes 2 mins to set up
 
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I find Pay Pal surprisingly convenient. Supposedly safe and secure. At least nobody has robbed me yet.
If I down load a film I click the button.
I only started watching relatively recently. haven't seen all the early ones yet.
I was looking forward to the West Scottish series as its my home turf. Oh well.

My wife was impressed by the tea light heater.
Now she just says Oh are watching that funny little man again.
If it ends.

I suppose I will just have to wait for what's his name to finish Game of Thrones instead:)
 
dylanwinter said:
Paypal is just two taps - it is so easy. Most people have it. I don't know how a man would buy chandlery and yacht unguents without paypal

it is clean it is safe.

the figure of a dollar an hour was pulled out of the air

I just got this as a comment


Steven Yates
Steven Yates14 minutes agoHighlighted comment
I can't remember now which ones of this series that i bunged a little tap on, so here is one. Of all the films its the ones from here and the wash that i most enjoyed and i didn't see them when they first came out as that was before i discovered the channel. It might be years before i get there myself on my own journey.
KeepTurningLeft
KeepTurningLeft2 seconds ago
thanks Steve - you are blowing life into the fabled long tail. The purity of your altruism overwhelms me. You have just paid purely for the entertainment of the films not for the running costs of a boat - although I will put your money into the warm boat fund

I like the simplicty of paypal - please watch the films guilt free until I fold and do patreon or standing orders or recurring paypal taps at some time in the future

Dylan
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Just as a by the way Dylan, that Steven yates was not me! I have a PayPal acct for my business, but not personally. I don't really like PayPal. I also have to confess I haven't actually watched your films, except one the other day going up the Thames and about a third of the Shetland one ( got interrupted) and the dutch auction one to get a good look at your centaur )I have the site bookmarked, but I'm not a great video watcher, I never seem to have the time.
If I did start watching them, I would feel happy to contribute, but to be perfectly honest, the chances of me getting round to doing it at slim, too much hassle in the way. I wouldn't want to use my business PayPal, too much accounting hassle at year end.
I really really think you are missing a trick by not adding some kind of subscription service to your site, which makes it much easier. Then directing folk there from the vids and Facebook and you tube. Simple to set up and give folk an option, £5 a month or an annual £45 recurring fee of £45 say.
Now that I would easily take the time to do.
You could have selected ones available, put the rest behind a wall for subscribers only, do 3 min hilight trailers of your hour long films on you tube, but the whole thing is only available to subscribers.

Also check out www.solwaysailing.co.uk , this guy Dave used to charge people to come along for a day out. It wasn't official training or anything, just basically a contribution and they got a days sailing. He used it to help fund his marina fees.
That might be an option? Plus if someone else was in it their family and friends might subscribe just to watchthat episode :)
 
How do you set up those pay-by-text-message systems? Many might find that easier than messing about with credit card details for small amounts.
 
I'm probably in a minority of one here, and you can call me a miserable b if you like, but here's my tuppence worth.

The Internet is full of people's blogs. Some are text, some have photos, and some include video footage. They are mostly put on-line by folk who think that all the world need and want to know what they've been doing. Nothing wrong with that if you are so inclined. There must be only a tiny proportion of these posters who hope to make any money from doing so. Dylan is trying to make a living out of it!
Well, to my mind, that's not a business plan, and as the Dragons in the Den say, "I'm out".
 
NormanS said:
I'm probably in a minority of one here, and you can call me a miserable b if you like, but here's my tuppence worth.

The Internet is full of people's blogs. Some are text, some have photos, and some include video footage. They are mostly put on-line by folk who think that all the world need and want to know what they've been doing. Nothing wrong with that if you are so inclined. There must be only a tiny proportion of these posters who hope to make any money from doing so. Dylan is trying to make a living out of it!
Well, to my mind, that's not a business plan, and as the Dragons in the Den say, "I'm out".
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I think you are entirely rational
 
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