XP ate my laptop!

[milltech]

Does anyone know how much space XP occupies? I've got an old Compaq Armada E500 PIII with an 11 Gig HD, I only had to touch it for it to crash and I wanted to load Adobe Audition which won't run under Windows 98....SO I bought an upgrade of XP Home Edition off eBay, loaded it, more or less fine. Went to Windows update and it loaded 22 updates, took about 2 hours.

Then it wanted SP2 and that took hours and hours, culminating in alarm bells clanging saying I was running short of resources. Having divested the thing of all the programes I probably won't want again I stopped it clanging at me.

Now it wants to load a further update to SP2, a dare not allow it, I've only got 984 mb left, already too low to properly defrag and not enough room to run the things I want it to run. It also takes 9 minutes to reboot!

I can't tell you how much of the HD I was using before, but less than half I'm sure, it's never been heavily loaded.

Any ideas? How to make XP light?

Thanks

 

[Freebee]

I just checked my file called windows and it says 2.17 gb have you deleted all the temporary installation files? run disc clean upyou will find it under accessories/system tools/disc clean up-if you run this it will show you where you can save space.

 

[sailorman]

then the usuall up-dates to make it actually work

 

[milltech]

My file called Windows has "size" 3.87 GB, contains 18,660 files in 932 folders. Size on disk 3.94 GB (4,235,812,864).

Programme files has a further 2.42 GB.

I haven't deleted, so far as I know, temporary installation files, can you tell me where I could find them. Doesn't seem to be anything of that name in or out of the Windows folder.

Disk Clean up has nothing to dispose of, I think I've run that several times before.

Can anyone say what components aren't needed for ordinary use, I know "ordinary" is a bit vague.

Thanks for the advice, I'm now up to 2 GB free after deleting all my music files, but it's not enough, I must find more space!!!

 

[TrueBlue]

If you find XP goes like a dog - and it does on older machines, consider going back to Windows 2000, does most of what XP does, but without the bloatware, and yet being Windows NT family is pretty stable.

OK it's obsolete and no longer supported, but when can you get any real support from Mr. Gates' mob.

Just a thought.

 

[Kendal]

You may want to check your Add remove programs control Panel after the upgrade as a typical upgrade will create an "image" of your old windows 98 system so that you can uninstall XP. If you want to keep XP and there is an uninstall XP option, you can remove it to recover some space.

Windows 2000 is less bloaty, I agree, but it certainly is not obsolete and is still fully supported by Microsoft.

 

[Freebee]

I thinks its a question of 8gb was quite a large hard disk at one time but now xp is memory hungry and so are a lot of programs you might want to run. If the laptop has a removeable hard drive and its worth it ,consider buying a bigger one say 30GB or more. Or else just resign your self to goning back to windows 2000.

 

[milltech]

There is a file called "Windows XP uninstall" with 490 MB. I can't imagine wanting to go back to 98 so is that all its for, just to reverse what I did yesterday?

I have looked at replacement HD and I suppose there might be some value in that for £50 or so, more than that and it's throwing good momey away. Perhaps I'll give to the wife who wants one and go spendin'.

Thanks

 

[gonfishing]

Hi John
fair to say that Xp will consume older machines!!! The only real answer is to go for a new laptop, but whatever you do, go for XP Professional not XP Home. The latter is really really crap /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

 

[BrendanS]

Roughly 3.5 to 4Gb for install of XP home and SP2 and updates (if system restore is enabled. You'll need more than this while the installation happens though, and will revert back to this size once it finishes cleaning up all the installation files and folders. Hard to be specific though. System restore takes up a heck of a lot of space, so turn it off if space is an issue, though I'd be reluctant to do that, as it's a very useful tool

 

[HeadMistress]

I suspect that hard drive capacity is only a small part of the problem...that the real problem is too little RAM (memory). XP requires at LEAST 512 megabytes RAM, which is twice or even more than most older computers have...for instance, my 6 yr old desktop only has 192...same age Toshiba laptop has only 96. Win98 runs just fine on both, but no way could XP be installed on either of 'em, even though both hard drives are 12 GIG.

The harddrive is just a storage cabinet for all the files...it's memory that determines how much can be taken out of any "file drawer" at the same time to use it--the number and size of the "balls that can be kept in the air" at once. "Running short of system resources" refers to the amount available RAM, not to the space left on a hard drive. So unless your laptop has at least 512 RAM, I don't think you'll be able to run XP...and maybe not even 2000 unless you have at least 256.

This doesn't mean that insufficient hard drive space doesn't also create problems...but if you still have at least 15% of your hard drive capacity left after installing XP, it's far more likely that insufficient memory is your real problem...and unfortunately, it's impossible to increase the memory enough in most older laptops to more than about 128 mgs--if that much.

 

[duncan]

we have happily run XP Pro on 256mb of ram, but with seperate sound and vision resources - and some laptops (and a few boxes) share ram so 256 would be a problem.
Also you are running Win98 and the XP upgrade rather than a clean XP install so that may well need a bit more HD.

Overall we had problems going this route with a similar processor (indicating the overall hardware rather than specifically the processor speed) and it was very unstable.
Warning though - if you upgrade the hardware you will probably find that you can't use that software route and many pieces of 'today's hardware' no longer run under Win98 so you never get booted!
As stated above I don;t think it's just a Hard drive problem.

 

[TrueBlue]

For Kendall: OK, OK Mebe I should have said WIN2000 is obsolescent, certainly there hasn't been a recent Service Pack.

For Gonfishing: What's so crap about XP home? The networking is a bit idiosyncratic, and the free backup doesn't save the system. the rest is down to the "skin" and using the classic interface removes some of the idiotware. I've had to work with several installations and for the money it's very good value.

Back to the reply:
I tried to put XP on an aged laptop 330Mhz that I upgraded to 20Gb disk. Couldn't upgrade the memory (64Mb). Ran OK but oh sooooooooooo slow...
Chucked it out and put WIN2000 on. Very respectable performance and loads of space for backups / images.

Minimum specification should be 600-800 Mhz processor, 40Gb disk, 256 Mb memory. Otherwise more cost effective to but a new / refurbished laptop.

Your current machine must be very ancient if it's only got an 11Gb disk; have you considered how you can upgrade, given that there is not enough room for two disks at once... Better to do a clean install and copy across the files that you need, even reinstalling whatever applications that must have.

To that end cpc.co.uk do a super USB external disk drive case for £9.99!!! Pop your 11Gb disk in after the upgrade and copy whatever files to th new installation. You can then use the disk for backups.

Before I go, your old hardware may not recognise a bigger disk; there was a 20Gb limit on older BIOS's. DON'T WORRY Win2000, XP will - but only for empty disks.

 

[milltech]

[ QUOTE ]

Minimum specification should be 600-800 Mhz processor, 40Gb disk, 256 Mb memory. Otherwise more cost effective to but a new / refurbished laptop.

Your current machine must be very ancient if it's only got an 11Gb disk; have you considered how you can upgrade, given that there is not enough room for two disks at once... Better to do a clean install and copy across the files that you need, even reinstalling whatever applications that must have.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess it's quite ancient, I have old desk tops and laptops sitting around, they all work but just became out of date. I think this one's 650 mhz, 128 mb ram, and is probably five to seven years old. The thing is, I only wanted to run adobe audition. maybe some navigation software and an email facility. I couldn't justify a new one just for hobby use. There are some cheapish memory and HD offers on eBay, but really they have to be SOOO cheap or it's just a waste of money.

It would be nice if someone published a list of files that 99% of all users could comfortably discard!

 

[Kendal]

There is little difference in XP home and XP pro for the home user. They are both built on exactly the same platform except XP pro has a few corporate features that the average home user would not need. I run chartplotter on a laptop with 500mhz P3 processor, 192MB ram, 12G hard disk, XP Pro. Its a bit sluggish but does the job intended. I agree with Headmistress, memory is the thing for XP. Less than 256MB and your system will struggle when running comple or multiple apps.

 

[BrendanS]

Agree, XP pro features above and beyond XP home are unnecessary for home users, and waste drive space for features that will never be used. Platform itself is just as stable.

Headmistress is correct in that RAM is one of denominators as to how XP will run on any PC, laptop or not, as after RAM is used, 'swap space' on hard drive will be used to make up deficiency. Lots of tweaking you can do, but only for the knowledgeable or brave. I'd rather have a smaller hard drive, slower processor, and loads of RAM, than any other combination of bottleneck. Big processor, big hard drive and loads of RAM is nice, but some PC's have to operate under constraints

 

[milltech]

Thanks Brendan. eBay have a couple like this, and the money is probably worth it, would it be as simple as swapping them over, or would I require techy help if I was to bid?


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?V...me=STRK:MEWA:IT

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?V...me=STRK:MEWA:IT

 

[milltech]

[ QUOTE ]
To that end cpc.co.uk do a super USB external disk drive case for £9.99!!! Pop your 11Gb disk in after the upgrade and copy whatever files to th new installation. You can then use the disk for backups.

Before I go, your old hardware may not recognise a bigger disk; there was a 20Gb limit on older BIOS's. DON'T WORRY Win2000, XP will - but only for empty disks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course every solution produces another problem with older machines, in this case the fact that the e500 only has one usb port seriously inhibits me already!

I was going to give an old P2 laptop to my wife who wants to learn computing, Internet and email, (see what I'm getting up to probably), but that doesn't have a usb at all, nor does a very respectable P2 desktop with a 19" monitor that I still use for midi stuff.

 

[TrueBlue]

I wouldn't go for memory on eBay (particularly) as the price from these people are cheap next day post included in the price; more importantly you can key in the make of your machine and not only will it tell you the type but the maximum installable for that machine. If it looks like standard memory then goto eBay if you must..

Do you know for a fact that WIN2000 won't run your Adobe product?? I'd be surprised if it doesn't.

Suggestions
(1) Your box as it stands will run WIN2000 very well.
(2) remove unwanted applications Control Panel / add remove programs. While there remove windows components that you don't need. See how much space you have left
(3) get 256k memory and see what it does to the performance
(4) disks are still cheaper than buying a copy of WIN2000. 20Gb will do but 40GB is only about a fiver more at www.ebuyer.com or www.savastore.com


Only attributes required to replace disk and memory is ability to handle a small (instrument) screwdriver, be gentle, and no nylon knickers (static).

Memory is usually under a large flap (3.5" X 2) on the underside of the box. You should have two slots; one empty Crucial memory comes with instructions.

Disk is usually on a slide out panel on the side of the machine, secured by a screw. Disk is held in place on the assembly by four small screws and a cable at the back. Undo screws, lift drive, gently prise cable off, keep it PARALLEL (else pins get bent). Re- assemble and you're done. You'll have to reinstall whatever operating system as disk is empty.

Cost WIN2000 £70, Disk £40, Memory £30 - all 'ish plus VAT and carriage. So it's up to you. I'd go for the hardware, unless you can blag a copy of WIN2000, plus essential service packs.

 

[milltech]

[ QUOTE ]

Do you know for a fact that WIN2000 won't run your Adobe product?? I'd be surprised if it doesn't.


[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for all the helpful advice, I'll act on most of it! I don't know that W2000 wouldn't suit, only that having paid for XP and successfully run the upgrade it would be piling more money into older software that will date sooner. If I can avoid doing that I feel it would be sensible.