Would you let refugees drown ... a skippers dilema

[Nostrodamus]

We will shortly be leaving from Sicily to Greece which crosses the route used by many of the small boats carrying excessive amounts of refugees.
Obviously maritime law as far as I understand it dictates that you should help anyone in or on the sea in distress provided it is not going to put you or your boat in danger.
So, should you be crossing and you came across a heavily laden boat of refugees which was in distress or sinking what would you do?
My initial thoughts at this time are to deploy the life raft and other items that can float in the vicinity, stand off to save your own boat being over burdened and call the coast guard or any other ships in the area.
What are your thoughts?

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

I would do the same. Depending on sea state, I would throw out any spare floating jackets/fenders to help them. I would try to save a few provided I would not put my boat in any danger. Standing by, waiting for the coastguard while watching people drowning, must be difficult.

 

[J Neeves]

+1

An overabundance of desperate individuals, refugees or not, who might not speak English (you will not know) and even if they do might misunderstand you will not engender safety on your own vessel.

Whether the refugees are in distress or not (again you might not know) you should still alert whichever maritime authorities are within communication range

Some years ago, like 20, on a return passage from a RORC/RHKYC race to the Philippines a HK yacht came across the flotsam from a sunken Chinese fishing boat. Crew were hanging onto a fridge and motorbike (fuel tank kept it afloat). One of the rescued crew was so desperate or panicked he clung to the yacht's wheel and had to be beaten on the fingers to allow the crew to continue the rescue.

Jonathan

 

[duncan99210]

This is a tricky question and not as clear cut to answer as it first appears.

There are two main scenarios involved. In the first, you come across a debris field with survivors. That's pretty much a no brainier, you're going to help in any way you can. Depending on numbers, raise the alarm, launch dinghy and liferaft, help some to board but don't overload your boat. You'll need to work out a strategy to avoid too many on board: you may need to be quite ruthless in denying boarding to some folks to prevent this, sailing away once you have as many on board as is safe.

The other scenario involves a still functioning boat full of people. The advice of the Cruising Association and others is to note the position, inform the authorities if at all possible but to stand well off. If the crew are still on board, they will often be looking for another boat to get away in and your yacht provides a good escape route. By all means remain in the vicinity, calling for help on the radio but don't get close enough to allow them to stand any chance of boarding you. There have been reported cases of yachts being pursued by migrant boats either to stop them reporting what they've seen or for the reasons outlined above.

Not an easy set of circumstances and it brings closer to home the possibility of nasty things happening to yachties.

 

[BrianH]

For any who have not seen - and retained - a copy, here is a thought provoking thread ...

"This document is concerned with evaluating some of the lessons learned as a result of an incident directly involving two yachts, ‘Tallulah’ and ‘If Only’, together with a ‘migrant’ vessel some 300 miles off the coast of Mauritania, Africa. Other vessels were involved, most notably and directly ‘MV Loren L’Oritzen’, and less directly, ‘Salt Whistle’ and ‘Flute’."​

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?153281-Atlantic-Rally-for-Cruisers-Immigrant-Rescue-Report

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?152763-Atlantic-Rally-for-Cruisers-Immigrant-Rescue-Discussion-Document

 

[mjcoon]

... You'll need to work out a strategy to avoid too many on board: you may need to be quite ruthless in denying boarding to some folks to prevent this, sailing away once you have as many on board as is safe.

Although if it is possible to remain within sight as a rescue marker and reporter then this would be considerate.

Mike.

 

[duncan99210]

Although if it is possible to remain within sight as a rescue marker and reporter then this would be considerate.

Mike.

Of course. I didn't mean to imply leaving altogether, rather standing off to ensure my own safety.

 

[macd]

Although if it is possible to remain within sight as a rescue marker and reporter then this would be considerate.

Of course. I didn't mean to imply leaving altogether, rather standing off to ensure my own safety.

One of the major problems in the 2007/8 incident was that you may not have the luxury of standing off. The refugee boat could do 8.5kn.

 

[duncan99210]

Indeed, reading the report reinforces the reports in the CA recent Med section newsletter, where you may not be able to move fast enough to avoid trouble from someone trying to board. However, I've been confining my thoughts and comments to being able to keep away when required, the thought of being boarded frankly doesn't help me sleep at nights.

 

[capnsensible]

I think one must be realistic. If the numbers are small, of course a rescue should be attempted. But the numbers will always win. You wouldn't rescue everyone from a ferry, obviously, but a swimmer, foundering boat with 3 or 4 on board, different story.

Unfortunately, we are confronted with missing vessels crossing the Straits of Gibraltar on almost a daily basis. DSC alerts repeated constantly, normally something like ' Small pneumatic boat adrift with 30 (or more) people on board'.

With those numbers of frightened and desperate people and your responsibilities to your own crew, standing off and a Mayday Relay seems to me the best of a bad scenario.

The Spanish Guardia Civil here maintain constant patrolling. It is not very nice to enter Ceuta Marina and see them offloading the body bags, makes one think a bit.

Heading for the Canaries has also been highlighted here as a problem area. A few years ago we witnessed a refugee boat being towed in to Puerto Calero with upwards of 20 on board. It could only have been kept afloat by constant bailing as within an hour it sank alongside....

Good luck to the crew of HMS Bulwark, I reckon they are in for some unpleasantness.

 

[Tony Cross]

This very subject has been discussed on one of the CA forums recently. Some members sought advice from the RN and other organisations, the advice to small boats was to keep well away. These boats are run by criminal gangs trafficking people and you likely put yourself at risk trying to help. A Mayday relay is appropriate of course but stay well clear. One CA member was chased by a migrant boat, they only just outran it.

 

[Nostrodamus]

This very subject has been discussed on one of the CA forums recently. Some members sought advice from the RN and other organisations, the advice to small boats was to keep well away. These boats are run by criminal gangs trafficking people and you likely put yourself at risk trying to help. A Mayday relay is appropriate of course but stay well clear. One CA member was chased by a migrant boat, they only just outran it.

Easier said than done Tony. At night a radar will only identify a target, not who is aboard and a lot of these fishing boats will go faster than us.
(look forward to seeing you soon)

 

[sailaboutvic]

You know guys , your first responsibly has a skipper in case you have forgotten is to the safety of your vessel and crew , and not sounding heartless to approach a boat full of despaired people who will almost do anything to get to Europe I would say is very stupid and risking the safety on everyone on board your boat , the advise of stand off and radio in would be he best advise any one can do , to pluck one person who alone in the water who is at risk of drowning is one thing , but two or three , I am not sure I would , I most lightly let them life jackets , rings dinghy .
if your just two on board , it very easy to be over powered , then who's going to help you .

 

[prv]

to approach a boat full of despaired people who will almost do anything to get to Europe I would say is very stupid and risking the safety on everyone on board your boat , the advise of stand off and radio in would be he best advise any one can do

You miss the point. It's not about you approaching them, it's about them approaching and boarding you. Closer to piracy than rescue. In the event linked above, they chased down, rammed, and forcibly boarded a 70-foot steel ketch.

Pete

 

[sailaboutvic]

You miss the point. It's not about you approaching them, it's about them approaching and boarding you. Closer to piracy than rescue. In the event linked above, they chased down, rammed, and forcibly boarded a 70-foot steel ketch.

Pete

I don't think I missed the point at all Pete , I was answering the question asked , nothing to do with the link above , the question ask was , if you came across refugees , and my answer is as above , first and Formost your responbabliy is the safety of you boat and crew , over the last few years we have sailed many times off the North African Coast , lucky we not been put in that position but if I was i have no doubts I would stand off at a safe distain and inform who needed to be inform ,CG .

 

[SamanthaTabs]

I don't think I missed the point at all Pete , I was answering the question asked , nothing to do with the link above , the question ask was , if you came across refugees , and my answer is as above , first and Formost your responbabliy is the safety of you boat and crew , over the last few years we have sailed many times off the North African Coast , lucky we not been put in that position but if I was i have no doubts I would stand off at a safe distain and inform who needed to be inform ,CG .

Agree wholeheartedly with both this and your previous comment Vic!

 

[Tony Cross]

You know guys , your first responsibly has a skipper in case you have forgotten is to the safety of your vessel and crew , and not sounding heartless to approach a boat full of despaired people who will almost do anything to get to Europe I would say is very stupid and risking the safety on everyone on board your boat , the advise of stand off and radio in would be he best advise any one can do , to pluck one person who alone in the water who is at risk of drowning is one thing , but two or three , I am not sure I would , I most lightly let them life jackets , rings dinghy .
if your just two on board , it very easy to be over powered , then who's going to help you .

Absolutely. The other point that was raised on the CA forum was that if you have not been trained to rescue that number of people, and especially if you don't have the resources to assist that number of people, you could end up making the situation worse.

Speaking personally, and those that know me know that I'm a heartless bastard, if I saw one of these migrant boats I'd head as fast as possible in the other direction....

 

[Tony Cross]

Easier said than done Tony. At night a radar will only identify a target, not who is aboard and a lot of these fishing boats will go faster than us.
(look forward to seeing you soon)

Looking forward to it as well Nostro. The Two Brothers already know that a very important person is arriving in the marina. To be honest I'm sure they think it's Prince Charles. So if you could do the hand in the pocket, the big ears, and the plummy voice, that would really help my street cred.

 

[Robin]

Discussions on cruisers being armed on another, mainly American, forum recently cited scenarios such as suggested here as a reason why so many of them believe in having guns on board and being prepared to use them, so that is the American solution in general terms, not specifically related to the Mediterranean goings on. My own thoughts would be stay well away from any areas where this is a possibility, just as I would avoid areas noted for hijacks and piracy, the world is a big place with plenty of nice places to choose,so why dive into trouble spots if you can avoid them.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Discussions on cruisers being armed on another, mainly American, forum recently cited scenarios such as suggested here as a reason why so many of them believe in having guns on board and being prepared to use them, so that is the American solution in general terms, not specifically related to the Mediterranean goings on. My own thoughts would be stay well away from any areas where this is a possibility, just as I would avoid areas noted for hijacks and piracy, the world is a big place with plenty of nice places to choose,so why dive into trouble spots if you can avoid them.

THe problem with your suggestion Robin is , this boat problem is happen right across the Med , which mean to avoid it would means having to keeping away from the Med .