Would You encourage somebody to sail across the North Sea...

[jpcarter30]

Who has never crossed the channel before or would you think it a voyage of folly?

Skipper on 10m boat with not too much sea crossing experience but a lot of confidence. Would it be right to say 'no, you shouldn't do it. Think of what might happen' or give wind to his dreams and say ' give it a go but take somebody with you who has a bit of experience'.

What should I do?

 

[shmoo]

I would neither encourage nor put off. Offer advice if asked. Offer the advice to go in good weather even if not asked. If they take someone experienced it wouldn't be "their" trip.


"If duffers, will drown..."

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

I would neither encourage nor put off. Offer advice if asked.

That's my take on it. If he asks the OP should tell him what he thinks. If he doesn't he need say nothing.

Having said that my brother and I were setting off on a breezy day last year and a bloke stopped by us in the marina and said "You can't go out in that, you're mad.". It actually kept us grinning all the way and was a real morale booster on a cold (but exciting) night on the water. So maybe telling people not to do something has a positive side.

For what it's worth I think they'll have a great time - I did my first cross channel with zero big boat experience and 3 mates who also had no big boat experience. To us it felt like a real achievment and, in fact, wasn't difficult at all. If we'd taken someone who'd done it before it would have meant nothing.

 

[john_morris_uk]

We all start somewhere. One of my first passages as skipper was from Gloucester (via the canal to Sharpness) and then down the Bristol Channel and round Lands End to Plymouth. When we got to Penzance, the crew announced that they wanted to go to France so we went to Plymouth via L'Aberach and Roscoff.

Young and foolish or bold and wise? We didn't have a GPS or Decca either...

On a more serious note, I wouldn't say go or stay. I might ask some gentle and non threatening questions about how long he thought the passage would take? What watch keeping he has thought of organising? etc etc - just out of interest don't you know?

 

[jpcarter30]

- just out of interest don't you know?

I really appreciate the breadth of advice I get from this board. It's served me well so far and as I have few sailing mates to call upon this is the closest it gets!

 

[Koeketiene]

Who has never crossed the channel before or would you think it a voyage of folly?

Crossed the North Sea on my first trip as skipper.
Bit 'in at the deep end' feeling, but we've all got to start somewhere.

Years down the road I like to think that I know what I'm doing. Others would argue I know just enough to be dangerous

 

[sailorman]

Who has never crossed the channel before or would you think it a voyage of folly?

Skipper on 10m boat with not too much sea crossing experience but a lot of confidence. Would it be right to say 'no, you shouldn't do it. Think of what might happen' or give wind to his dreams and say ' give it a go but take somebody with you who has a bit of experience'.

What should I do?

best to sail over as crew first to see what your up against. its not "All bier & Skittles" out there

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

Who has never crossed the channel before or would you think it a voyage of folly?

Skipper on 10m boat with not too much sea crossing experience but a lot of confidence. Would it be right to say 'no, you shouldn't do it. Think of what might happen' or give wind to his dreams and say ' give it a go but take somebody with you who has a bit of experience'.

What should I do?

Would suggest the most important advice is to look for a suitable weather window of sufficient duration with a fair wind; and take notice of forecast sea state for a first crossing. A fresh breeze or stronger forward of the beam with a rough sea for 20 hours could put you and your crew off for life!
But as the others have said, " youv'e got to start some time"! And taking a more experienced person along is not the same.

 

[Black Sheep]

Well I crossed the North Sea before ever I'd crossed the channel. But then I didn't have crew to worry about. And the boat wasn't anything like as big.

Which bit of the North Sea is he thinking of crossing?

 

[KenMcCulloch]

Which bit of the North Sea is he thinking of crossing?

Tha's a very sensible question. For us up here 'crossing the North Sea' suggests >72 hours on a passage to Esbjerg or Thyboron, straightforward with few hazards but a bit of an endurance test. I understand that people on what the southern English call 'the East Coast' describe as a North Sea Crossing is going to Zeebrugge or somewhere like that. Passage planning is probably more of a challenge with all those ships and sandbanks but it's not such a distance.

 

[Fascadale]

Ken makes a good point.

We crossed the North Sea last year, Stonehaven to the Bergen area, about 300nms, 50+ hours. No real worry about the tides, a few stationary oil rigs, next to no traffic and a very good weather window.

I have not sailed the channel but I think I would find it much more intimidating; tides, so many ships, separation zones, men in black, worries about whether or not my flares are in date, do I have a motoring cone. It all sounds a bit intense.

 

[Black Sheep]

For us up here 'crossing the North Sea' suggests >72 hours on a passage to Esbjerg or Thyboron, ... I understand (others) describe as a North Sea Crossing is going to Zeebrugge or somewhere like that.

Indeed - that's the point I was hinting at. And for some, "crossing the channel" is a hop from Dover to Calais, while for others it's a 24 hour passage from Solent to Cherbourg. Or Penzance to L'Aberach!

My first "North Sea crossing" was Ramsgate to Dunkirk, which is not much different from Dover to Calais/Boulogne (and barely counts as North Sea). As OP is in Medway, that's probably closer to the choice. Or is the other skipper planning on crossing to Denmark or Norway?

 

[AliM]

Our first proper passage in our own boat was Harwich to Den Helder (with virtually no experience except a channel crossing as crew) - so we took an experienced couple along. Just outside Harwich, the bloke retired to his bunk, horribly sea-sick. So we ended up taking all the decisions/responsibility ourselves - best thing that could have happened!

Actually, from my wide(!) experience of about a dozen North Sea crossings and 2 channel crossings, I'd rather do the North Sea any day. The ships are few and far between, so you can worry just about one at a time. Crossing the channel, you have several in sight and always the worry that your change of course to avoid one could put you into the path of the next one.

Why not talk through routes, tides, weather, equipment (AIS is invaluable, for example) with him. He is grown-up and can take his own decisions. It's not inherently dangerous, if he has all the information to make a proper decision on when and where to go.

 

[FullCircle]

With all the aids we have nowadays, it is relatively easy. Also, you have to do it sometime, and a 40 mile trip up the coast seemed pretty similar to a 40 mile trip across the Channel.
I could see both sides most of the time on my first one, Ramsgate to Calais, back in 1989.

I had a chart, almanac,a compass, depth sounder and trailing log. No VHF, but did have a French courtesy flag and a Q flag.
I was frightened and exhilarated, especially when encountering shipping, particularly ferries from CA8 inwards.

It involved risk. I analysed those risks, pondered for hours over tides and winds, the weather, the equipment, and me little Corribee. Worked out potential exit points if it all went TU, and decided to tow my inflatable rather than store it on the coach roof.

What a thrill to arrive in Calais, my first foreign port.

It also seemed a whole lot easier than crossing the Thames estuary banks.

I think the chap is to be encouraged. Fit more gizmos, but remember that seacock technology hasn't changed a bit.

 

[Twister_Ken]

"If not duffers, won't drown"

 

[Pye_End]

One of my first trips on my first boat (Sonata) was Harwich to Ijmuiden, tale end of a gale (started trip as a F6). Pre-GPS days. No Decca, just traditional navigation.

Good learning curve.

If you require rescuing (not that this is a good mindset to be in) then there are enough ships around in the Southern North Sea so getting hold of somebody out of range of the coastguard is not really a problem.

10m with GPS - luxury.

A second experienced hand is useful as the biggest lesson from a 24 - 48 hour trip is get plenty of sleep.

 

[brianhumber]

Weather wind of course but I would say

Knowledge of and understanding of rules of the road plus exprience of using them in big ship congested waters very essential in southern part of N Sea.

Brian

 

[alant]

Tha's a very sensible question. For us up here 'crossing the North Sea' suggests >72 hours on a passage to Esbjerg or Thyboron, straightforward with few hazards but a bit of an endurance test. I understand that people on what the southern English call 'the East Coast' describe as a North Sea Crossing is going to Zeebrugge or somewhere like that. Passage planning is probably more of a challenge with all those ships and sandbanks but it's not such a distance.

Why would anyone want to go to Thyboron?

 

[nathanlee]

What should I do?

Help him if he wants it. Offer advice without telling, and control that jealously as he sets off out the harbour wall.

 

[Fascadale]

Why would anyone want to go to Thyboron?

They might be wishing to pass through the Limfjord to the Baltic