Would you consider the standing rigging replacement finished if...

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firstascent2002

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So new standing rigging this year.

I'm going sailing next weekend weather permitting. The rig is up but none of the bottle screws are moused with wire or taped.

Is it the norm to leave the rig mike this for the owner to sort?

Either which way...what pressure should I be after (on a looes guage) for 6 mm standing rigging?

J
 
"The rig is up but none of the bottle screws are moused with wire or taped." - I would be cross if it WAS wired and taped - rigging always stretches at first and you can't check the tuning of the rig until you start sailing.

"Is it the norm to leave the rig like this for the owner to sort?" - Did you contract them to replace and tune the rig? If you asked for it to be replaced, they have done what you asked. What's the problem?

"Either which way...what pressure should I be after (on a looes guage) for 6 mm standing rigging?" - Impossible to say. What sort of rig? What sort of boat? An answer might be 'tighter than most people think is necessary most of the time'? Some people like slack rigging but personally I thinks its abhorrent and almost always makes for inefficient sail trim and sailing!
 
firstascent2002 said:
So new standing rigging this year.

I'm going sailing next weekend weather permitting. The rig is up but none of the bottle screws are moused with wire or taped.

Is it the norm to leave the rig mike this for the owner to sort?

Either which way...what pressure should I be after (on a looes guage) for 6 mm standing rigging?

J
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we had the mast stepped after replacing standing rig & boat re=launched thursday the riggers set-up the mast friday & locked-off & taped.
not a loose in sight.
of course the rig will stretch & i will adjust.
dont imho go sailing with the locking pins missing - explain that to the Ins man
 
On my re-rig the riggers put split pins in, but after the first sail I had to do some adjustments, which meant that I had to take all the pins out. The riggers did not tape things up, because they said it was certain I would need to take it off. I actually went to the end of the season relying on the lock nuts for everything except the cap shrouds and back stay, and will only put new pins in the others after after I have checked tension on the first sail this season.

I am having some work done this winter which will involve slackening off the shrouds. The best investment I made was a Loos tension gauge. I have the tensions which worked last season written down, and they will provide the starting point for correct adjustment this season.
 
I once sailed 8 miles downwind immediately after mast being re-rigged, the bottlescrews did not have lock-nuts, they were the type where they are locked off with split pins. I had however tightened the rig to about the right settings.
I had not put the split pins in, thinking I would need to re-tighten the rig when I came back.
After 8 miles, I turned round and came hard onto the wind. I was shocked to realise that the entire rig had slackened off to the point where the mast was actually flopping around.
I have always assumed that some or all of the bottlescrews had quietly been undoing themselves during that first 8 miles.
So there's a moral in there!
 
I would be very annoyed with a rigger that left a mast with no split-pins or mousing in place, even if further tensioning and tuning is required that may not be done (because the owner is away/unwell) for some weeks or even longer.

Vibration from strong winds can make bottlescrews come undone if not secured in some way - I have seen it happen.

I guess it depents on what agreement you had with the rigger but split pins cost pennies in the grand scheme...
 
Several years ago I lost my mast about 2 weeks after she went up because I hadn't double checked the locking nuts and I hadn't moused the bottle screws. I hadn't even sailed her, we just had high winds and we reckon the oscillation was enough to undo the nuts and down she came !!
 
Thanks for the responses guys,

I thought reading the first (fairly disagreeable) response I had asked a stupid series of questions but seems most people don't think so. I think perhaps there should be an unwritten rule that people don't post if they got out of bed the wrong side that day. It would be a shame if people were intimidated into not asking questions just in case someone decided to jump down their throat...anyway...

So the general advice is not to sail her un moused / taped and adjust early. Thanks salty jon for the tension guide...I bought the guage from you last year for just this purpose!

kind regards

J
 
Georgio said:
I would be very annoyed with a rigger that left a mast with no split-pins or mousing in place, even if further tensioning and tuning is required that may not be done (because the owner is away/unwell) for some weeks or even longer.

Vibration from strong winds can make bottlescrews come undone if not secured in some way - I have seen it happen..........
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i would second that. do NOT leave your boat on a swinging mooring unless the bottle screws have been secured in some way.
 
john_morris_uk;2459335 What sort of rig? What sort of boat? An answer might be 'tighter than most people think is necessary most of the time'? Some people like slack rigging but personally I thinks its abhorrent and almost always makes for inefficient sail trim and sailing![/QUOTE said:
What's more, loose rigging accelerates wear at the terminals - see earlier post Fulmar with swept out and erroded anchor points.

PWG
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firstascent2002 said:
So new standing rigging this year.

I'm going sailing next weekend weather permitting. The rig is up but none of the bottle screws are moused with wire or taped.

Is it the norm to leave the rig mike this for the owner to sort?
Click to expand...

If you paid the rigger to come back and tension the rig once it's up, that's one thing....if you just paid the yard to step your mast that's another. the two are not the same.

Most yards will step the mast and do the minimum to stop it falling back down again. But it's not tuned, and I wouldn't sail with it like that.

Where as the riggers, (if asked and agreed) will tune the rig ready for sailing

So which did you pay for?
 
Does it sound mad to say I don't know? I asked the yard owner to get the standing rigging changed this year. I did not specify for him to get the mast down...he presumed. I did not ask for him to get the mast back up...he presumed I did not ask for him to make the rig safe...All I wanted to know is what people felt was a completed job...
 
My yard puts the mast up, tightens and split pins the rigging and I check the tension "by hand" periodically during the season but have never felt the need to adjust it. The rigging is 6 years old and maybe it's done all the stretching and untwisting that it needs to.
 
firstascent2002 said:
Thanks for the responses guys,

I thought reading the first (fairly disagreeable) response I had asked a stupid series of questions but seems most people don't think so. I think perhaps there should be an unwritten rule that people don't post if they got out of bed the wrong side that day. It would be a shame if people were intimidated into not asking questions just in case someone decided to jump down their throat...anyway...

So the general advice is not to sail her un moused / taped and adjust early. Thanks salty jon for the tension guide...I bought the guage from you last year for just this purpose!

kind regards

J
Click to expand...

I just read all the replies again to see which one you thought was disagreeable and I don't see one so perhaps it is just a question of style? Not to say there aren't some disagreeable posts on occasions because there are and I agree it can put some potential contributors off.

Anyway most of the replies you got are helpful and if anything it shows how always we should specify what we want and expect when booking work by others.

IMO a yard is not qualified to set up a rig, only to step or unstep a mast. A rigger (if asked to be present) should do more than that and set a basic static tune but that will still need to be tweaked at sea after settling in and to get the mast really tuned. A tension gauge IMO doesn't really come into it's own until after that is done, as a means of repeating the ideal settings achieved.

We re-rigged our last boat and used Crusader Sails who also have a rigging service, they are our preferred sailmaker and are local. They serviced the roller reefing gear (replacing some parts damaged by another yard and unknown to me or the previous owner), checked the mast and it's fittings thoroughly and made up all new rigging. The yard re-stepped the mast in my presence and left the rigging fitted and tensioned basically, for me (or the rigger) to adjust later as required. Split pins were not fitted at deck level but the locking nuts were tightened on all bottle screws. I did the static tune of the rig myself a few days later to how I like it but then I feel competent to do that and later Crusader (actually the MD) also double checked it for me because I asked them to when they were around. Then after a few sails to allow the rigging to settle in and on a suitable day of moderate winds we did the final tune to get the mast set up under sail. Only then were the split pins added to the bottle screws and any final taping done, but remember there were lock nuts on all screws as well and I had put some tape over the locking nuts 'just in case'.
 
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