Why MoBoing is dying on its feet. ?

ari said:
yet Princess has just announced record sales and are apparently all but sold out for 2018 and most of 2019
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Have no idea of how many boats Princess complete per annum, suspect you could count them on the fingers and toes of two people.
Our hobby needs to engage possible converts at the earliest opportunity and that means appealing to those outside our closed world.
The topic of conversation in organised boating groups,both mobo and sailing, really is the number of boats lying idle and unused by owners, who have simply come to end their boaty lives or simply unable to use their boat any longer.A somewhat tendentious topic is what the hell to with boats that have not moved for years.
All these boats will be appearing on the market at some point, unfortunately most of them will have been lying idle some for years and most are big heavy old beasts , out of sync with todays market or customer demands.


Nobody being encouraged to take their place.
 
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BruceK said:
I think you may be missing my point Ari, probably because I am not explaining it well. The current 50 plus population of motor boat owners from what I have experienced have grown up with boats and there has been a natural progression in size etc as they climbed the ladder. However there are not an equivalent size of new blood replacing the old blood as they leave the hobby.
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I'd be interested to see the figures that back that up, so far I've seen no evidence that this is true (which is my point, this strange blanket assumption that the hobby of boating is doomed, irrespective of any facts).

Likewise this theory that boats are too expensive and no one can possibly be buying them. Again, it's this suggestion that all manufacturers are wrong, they're all building the wrong boats and charging far too much for them, one of them have a clue. Well, someone is buying them.

You can go motorboating from £3K for a small secondhand speedboat up to £300,000,000 for the biggest superyacht, and literally anywhere in between. No one has to buy new, no one has to buy a forty footer if they don't want to or can't afford to (I certainly can't, but good luck to anyone that can).

I think the thing I find most ironic is that this forum seems to be full of people with 40ft, 50ft and bigger planing boats all saying 'no one wants planing boats, no one can afford 50ft boats'. Err...

Ever was it thus though, I remember Guldy (Gludy? Something like that) absolutely adamant that the loss of tax concessions on red diesel was the absolute bitter end, no one would ever buy a big boat ever again, all the while whilst having a 60ft Trader on order! :D

It just seems to be a forum theme, perhaps those that seem to want to believe it feed off each other, I don't know.
 
oldgit said:
Have no idea of how many boats Princess complete per annum, suspect you could count them on the fingers and toes of two people.
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Forty boats? They can't have been that far off forty with the number they had simultaneously at Dusseldorf and London in January! I can't imagine they then said 'that's it lads, take the rest of the year off'.

Suspect it's more like 250 boats a year, and that's a pretty niche builder compared to Jenneau, Bayliner, Beneteau etc etc.
 
Ari you cant pick out points of what I said and place them outside of context from what I was trying to say to promote yours. :D
 
Well, here are a few observations from our last month of cruising from Chichester to Padstow:

1. We have seen very few leisure motor boats at sea on passage. I haven't been counting but I would be surprised if we have encountered more than half dozen although it is still early season.

2. One of our stopping points was at Mayflower Marina, Plymouth adjacent to the Princess factory. There were in excess of eight boats of fifty foot or more in the water all close to completion. Certainly no sign of the death of motor boating there although the ultimate destination of most of them was probably outside UK waters.

3. We are currently in Padstow and arrived here in time for the celebration of Padstow May Day. This attracts visiting boats most of which seem to come from South Wales ports. The weather reduced the number of visitors but there have still been eighteen boats in harbour. Of these six are motor boats. All are relatively old boats whether sail or motor and are crewed by members of the silver surfer brigade. Of the motor boats, five are around the 35 foot mark.

So far I don't think experience suggests the death of motor boating. More likely that the early season weather hasn't been conducive to cruising.

We are hoping for more congenial passages ahead.
 
ari said:
Forty boats? They can't have been that far off forty with the number they had simultaneously at Dusseldorf and London in January!.
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Seem to remember half a dozen boats at EXCEL and suspect most were all pre sold customers boats about to be shipped.

Ari,am a member of both the largest Mobo club in our area and probably 50 miles in any direction, also involved with the MSBA an organisation encompassing all the clubs in the area,including hovercraft, ski clubs and jetskis.
It is the mobo and yachting folks who are seriously expressing concern regards the decline in numbers coming into the hobby.
 
I am in a similar position OG. Of a 250 plus membership only 100 own boats and of that 6 motorboats and of that 1 that actually cruises.
 
BruceK said:
Ari you cant pick out points of what I said and place them outside of context from what I was trying to say to promote yours. :D
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I have no context beyond being unconvinced by the doom mongering.

You say (for instance) 'there's no new blood replacing the old blood leaving the hobby'. I'm asking where the evidence for that is? How is that 'out of context'? :)
 
oldgit said:
Seem to remember half a dozen boats at EXCEL and suspect most were all pre sold customers boats about to be shipped.

Ari,am a member of both the largest Mobo club in our area and probably 50 miles in any direction, also involved with the MSBA an organisation encompassing all the clubs in the area,including hovercraft, ski clubs and jetskis.
It is the mobo and yachting folks who are seriously expressing concern regards the decline in numbers coming into the hobby.
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And 30 seconds on Google suggests a further 10 at Dusseldorf, so that's sixteen brand new boats by mid January! Yes agreed, probably pre sold - yet more evidence that big new motorboats are selling. :)

https://www.boat-duesseldorf.com/vis/v1/en/exhibitors/boot2018.2541613

Just looked at the club in your link (presumably that's the one you're talking about) and it seems to be in the Medway. With the greatest of respect, it's not exactly the epicentre of British motorboating.

Anyway, just trying to provide a balanced view that, to paraphrase Mark Twain, the death of motorboating may be greatly exaggerated, but if anyone can provide any statistics to the contrary I'd certainly be curious to see them. :)
 
When I was a child growing up in the 70s we had various boats in the 32'-36' bracket. We spent nearly every weekend on the boat and there were lots of other similar families - parents late twenties - late thirties with kids - 4 - 10 years old. Since I have been boating as an adult, (and with a young family for the past 8 years) I just don't get the feeling that this age group with young families are doing that type of motor boating. Sure, they may be trailering smaller boats, or getting out on the water in one way or another, but I think the days of marinas havings lots of young families on motor boats are long gone. I think cost of housing has made it harder for young families to have a decent sized boat early on, but at the other end made it easier for older people to afford them - and they are comparatively much more expensive than in the olden days. Perhaps someone who knows how much a Princess 37 cost in 1975 could do a present day value comparison?
 
I know a Fairline Sedan 36 in 1988 was £80k...in current money £200k according to a website I found.

Anyone doing a 40ft flybridge for £200k new?
 
ari said:
Just looked at the club in your link (presumably that's the one you're talking about) and it seems to be in the Medway. With the greatest of respect, it's not exactly the epicentre of British motorboating:)
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Around 5000 leisure vessels registered with either the EA (Non Tidal) or PEEL Ports (Tidal) in the Medway and Swale area,add the 8000 boats on the nearbye Thames, and you do have, with the greatest respect;) an epicentre. :)

Economic migrants from more expensive areas have, over the years, added to the range of boats kept locally especially in the posher marinas.
On the whole a pretty good reflection of the boating world in general perhaps ?

Boats registered on the The Thames and Medway 2016 excluding Tidal waters.
https://ea.sharefile.com/share/view/s09796200c244a75a
 
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I think the death of red diesel could have other benefits. Before, nobody wanted petrol and petrol wasn’t even available. But it is possible a shift to petrol could happen and combined with the now unlimited range (in money and size) of outboard powered boats being offered. It could get people off in inexpensive sporty versatile outboard boats that can be pulling skiers fishing and cruising. And with that new wave of people some will be hooked for life.
 
I don't think motor boating is dying.
Used boats seem to sell for about the same money or a bit less than they did ten years ago - which means they have reduced in price in real terms and are more affordable in theory . The same with diesel - the price is not far off the same as it was ten year ago.
Used boat sales at the marina where I keep my boat seem lively with only a very few boats hanging around unsold.
The marina seems pretty full.
However new boat sales have always been rare in our area - there are still plenty of good used boats available at considerably less cost.
 
oldgit said:
Around 5000 leisure vessels registered with either the EA (Non Tidal) or PEEL Ports (Tidal) in the Medway and Swale area,add the 8000 boats on the nearbye Thames, and you do have, with the greatest respect;) an epicentre. :)

Economic migrants from more expensive areas have, over the years, added to the range of boats kept locally especially in the posher marinas.
On the whole a pretty good reflection of the boating world in general perhaps ?

Boats registered on the The Thames and Medway 2016 excluding Tidal waters.
https://ea.sharefile.com/share/view/s09796200c244a75a
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How many of those are houseboats, rowing skiffs and other non motorboat vessels?

And (in terms of motorboats) how do the numbers compare with, say, Poole to Chichester? :)
 
ari said:
You know that's 2012/13 right..? I don't think that anyone's arguing sales (of everything!) weren't down a little back then! :D

I think I'll 'bug out' now, it's starting to feel like arguing about religion - people clearly just want to believe what they want to believe.

Fair enough, but I still find it a little odd...
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+1
 
ari said:
How many of those are houseboats, rowing skiffs and other non motorboat vessels?

And (in terms of motorboats) how do the numbers compare with, say, Poole to Chichester? :)
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I am not sure that the non tidal Thames ( 135 miles ) and Medway ( 70) mile so 295 miles of river can really be called an epicentre under any possible definition !
 
jrudge said:
I am not sure that the non tidal Thames ( 135 miles ) and Medway ( 70) mile so 295 miles of river can really be called an epicentre under any possible definition !
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I think the other factor is the "flight to the Med".

There are several motorboaters that have started out bouncing around in less-than-ideal UK conditions, and rather than trading up and staying in their local marina, have bailed out to "Insert Spanish or Balearic Marina here". These boaters totally disappear off the radar from the point of view of someone based on the Thames or the Medway.

The Solent / Hamble and the West Country seem just as busy as ever to me.
Less popular locations off the beaten track could well be suffering.

Maybe people are just becoming more picky once they have enough funds to make a choice?
 
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