Why gybe when tacking?

[bbg]

Re: Language?

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Can anyone think of a better way of describing it?

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Yes - gybing downwind. It describes the action (gybing) and the direction (downwind).

 

[Lakesailor]

Re: Language?

But that only describes the action of changing direction.

Tacking downwind or beating downwind describes the method of making progress in a general direction.

Let's agree to differ. But don't tell me I'm a know-nowt because I don't agree with you.

 

[Guest]

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With that background - I find it frustrating to hear people say they tack downwind when they really mean they are gybing downwind.

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If you wish to murder the English language then I for one will fight for your right to do it. The expression "gybing downwind" IS however murder, for several reasons:

First, it is tautologous: of course you are gybing downwind - you're not going to gybe upwind, or gybe sort of half way across the wind, are you? It's therefore a bit like saying "to murder a language until it is dead".

Secondly, "to gybe" describes a single gybe, not a series of them.

Thirdly, as "to gybe" is the opposite of "to go about", you can no more use the expression ""to gybe downwind" than you can "to go about upwind".

Fourthly, the expression "to gybe downwind" is not in common use in English, thank goodness.

Fifthly, there is a perfectly good expression already in common use to describe a series of alterations of course from one tack to the other: that is, the very logical verb "to tack", which is really an abbreviation of the concept of "to change tack".

 

[peterb]

Re: Language?

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Yes - gybing downwind. It describes the action (gybing) and the direction (downwind).

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But I thought all gybing was downwind. Is there any other way?

 

[bbg]

Not all gybing involves a boat making progress downwind - one could gybe from beam reach to beam reach, or indeed while making progress to windward (as the original poster was doing). Therefore it is not tautologous.

Second, gybing can describe a series of gybes - in the same way tacking can describe a series of tacks.

Third, the phrases we are talking about are being used to describe a maneouvre and a direction of travel - so yes, one could tack upwind (although I agree with you that "going about upwind" is not a very happy phrase).

Tacking is usually used to mean putting the bow of the boat through the eye of the wind - indeed it is my understanding that that is its only meaning:

From Wikipedia: "A tack or coming about is the maneuvre by which a sailing boat or yacht turns its bow through the wind so that the wind changes from one side to the other. This is contradictory to a jibe which is turning the stern of the boat through the wind."

Other online definitions I have found support this:

Definition NZ
Tacking
Tacking 2
Tacking 3
Tacking 4


Although some on this forum seem to understand that tacking means changing tacks regardless of whether the bow or stern of the boat passes through the eye of the wind, that has never been my understanding.

Consequently "tacking downwind" is a contradictory phrase (except if one puts the bow of the boat through the eye of the wind while making progress downwind). Gybing is a single change of tack, and gybing downwind (at least to me and many people I have sailed with and against) describes making progress downwind using a series of gybes. With people that I know and sail with, the phrase is known and understood. Even if you don't think that there is anything wrong with the phrase "tacking downwind" (and on this Lakesailor is right, I will have to agree to disagree with several people), I don't see how the phrase "gybing downwind" could be objectionable.

If anyone wants to disagree with me - that is fine. I don't think I can make it any clearer so I am inclined to leave it at that.

 

[fireball]

As has already been said - "tacking downwind" is a common phrase in use today. It describes the similar action of "tacking upwind" in reverse.

If you have a problem with this I suggest you close your ears....

 

[bbg]

I suppose I will have to just close my ears when I hear it - which I know I will. But I will still use the phrase used by North Sails (see VMG Spinnaker) and by Ellen Macarthur (see last paragraph of story).

 

[DaveS]

Just back from an extended weekend sailing /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif- then windlass repairing /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif. I was right - it did start a no bad rammy, if a bit one sided. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Now if a few more joined in would a record thread be possible?

 

[26ft_bathtub]

If you zigzag back and forth in a RIB at high speed through an anchorage trying to see whether Bugels are more poular than Rocnas, is that tacking?

 

[sighmoon]

We used to have a triple keel hurley with an A5 sized rudder that tended to carry on going in circles after a tack. So in confined waters, we'd gybe round.