Jaguar 25
Well-Known Member
So, I'm intrigued as to why are Leisure 17's are towed backwards, i.e. bow at the back of the trailer? Just doesn't seem right.
Why are Leisure 17's towed backwards?
- Thread starter Jaguar 25
- Start date
sailorman
Well-Known Member
weight distribution / balance ??????
Lon nan Gruagach
Well-Known Member
Equivalent of a Le Mans start when launching...
Lon nan Gruagach
Well-Known Member
But seriously...
some are:
some arent:
Looks like you need a much shorter trailer if you have the skeg at the front.
some are:
some arent:
Looks like you need a much shorter trailer if you have the skeg at the front.
wallacebob
Well-Known Member
They idea was to tip the L17 prow down, run trailer under her keels, then walk it onto the trailer. I think the owners website has illustrations? They balance very nicely on leading edge of keels (without o/board), so a/fouling is a doddle. You have to chock the prow to stop tipping on the hard; I found this out!
Capt. Clueless
Well-Known Member
Y'know, I built the bloody things and just cannot remember which way round they left the yard towed by the Land rover. (Mind you it wasn't something a 17 yr old immersed himself in).
William_H
Well-Known Member
I can't see very much difference or reason to tow backwards. Many trailers have a post (sometimes with winch) to attach the prow to when towing. Certainly desirable if you winch the boat on to the trailer. If you float it on it might not make much difference except that the bow usually has less draft so you can more easily pull it into shallows then onto the trailer by the nose.
The comments about balance are interesting. Shallow draft keels are rare around here due to small tides and deepwater.
So when you do haul a fin keel out of the water on a cradle (most common) or Tammy Lift the weight is all on the keel.
Balance can be very critical and a new owner pulling out for the first time needs to be very careful or know how the boat is balanced. (fore and aft) It is common for designers to fit a keel with aft sweep ie sloping leading edge. This means that the keel bottom can be well aft of the centre of lateral resistance so supporting the stern of the boat when the keel bulk for sailing balance needs to be much further forward.
The aft slope of the keel might make it look like a jet wing so very fast actually does nothing for sailing except that perhaps weed might be deflected off more easily.
Obviously long shallow bilge keels can keep the boat upright regardless of fore and aft weight distribution much more easily than a fin keel. Never the less any new boat owner needs to be very careful when first putting the weight of the boat on the keels. olewill
The comments about balance are interesting. Shallow draft keels are rare around here due to small tides and deepwater.
So when you do haul a fin keel out of the water on a cradle (most common) or Tammy Lift the weight is all on the keel.
Balance can be very critical and a new owner pulling out for the first time needs to be very careful or know how the boat is balanced. (fore and aft) It is common for designers to fit a keel with aft sweep ie sloping leading edge. This means that the keel bottom can be well aft of the centre of lateral resistance so supporting the stern of the boat when the keel bulk for sailing balance needs to be much further forward.
The aft slope of the keel might make it look like a jet wing so very fast actually does nothing for sailing except that perhaps weed might be deflected off more easily.
Obviously long shallow bilge keels can keep the boat upright regardless of fore and aft weight distribution much more easily than a fin keel. Never the less any new boat owner needs to be very careful when first putting the weight of the boat on the keels. olewill
jwilson
Well-Known Member
Note in the photos the considerably shorter trailer bed length needed when towed backwards. Less steel, less weight ... might make it towable with a smaller vehicle.
Spirit (of Glenans)
Well-Known Member
I used to own one and towed it with a Fiat Scudo van. It was obvious that if it had been towed bow forward, the pulpit, with the overhanging, unstepped mast tied to it, would have prevented hitching up.
It could probably have been towed this way, though, by a pickup or a hatchback/coupe style car, although speed bumps might cause the mast to hit the car.
It could probably have been towed this way, though, by a pickup or a hatchback/coupe style car, although speed bumps might cause the mast to hit the car.
Kylora
Well-Known Member
My understanding is that this is how they were loaded at the factory, it meant that lifting equipment wasn't required.
It did make recovery from a sloping beach or ramp more difficult as the skeg would ground on the trailer before the keels were located.
Some people added vertical arms to the trailer to locate the hull.
I didn't have arms and would sometimes " lose " the black painted trailer in the dark waters of Loch Lomond.
Ash
John the kiwi
Well-Known Member
Its immediately obvious to me, but then, i am an engineer and have also built a number of trailers for boats.
if the weight is supported on the tripod of rudder and twin keels, then having the rudder weight close to the tow hitch means that the keels are over the axle more or less and little else is required.
If the boat is "right way round" then to maintain balance and downforce on the tow hitch the keels must be forward of the axle but the rudder must be supported a long way aft of the axle. This necessitates building a trailer with a longer load bearing span which must be stronger and heavier than the backwards alternative.
At risk of offending besotted owners, i do wonder why one would want to tow one of these anywhere?
if the weight is supported on the tripod of rudder and twin keels, then having the rudder weight close to the tow hitch means that the keels are over the axle more or less and little else is required.
If the boat is "right way round" then to maintain balance and downforce on the tow hitch the keels must be forward of the axle but the rudder must be supported a long way aft of the axle. This necessitates building a trailer with a longer load bearing span which must be stronger and heavier than the backwards alternative.
At risk of offending besotted owners, i do wonder why one would want to tow one of these anywhere?
Capt. Clueless
Well-Known Member
Boat snob alert......
Iliade
Well-Known Member
What John said. Plus, with the rudder at the front, there would be no tipping tendency under braking. Also may be easier to board and is prettier than a caravan when used as such.
If you left out the washboards it would keep the inside cooler ;0)
If you left out the washboards it would keep the inside cooler ;0)
ghostlymoron
Well-Known Member
I had one with a bow at front trailer. Lovely wee boat. As said, the backwards trailer was so that boats could be loaded at the works without a crane. Retrieving on a slipway is much easier bow first though.
Kylora
Well-Known Member
To get it launched into water, where it will sail quite well.
Leeward keel vertical when heeled.
Toe in and asymmetric keels to provide lift to windward.
What is not to like?
Ash
mdonnelly
Well-Known Member
My first ever boat was a fin keel Leisure 17. Loved it. Still have a soft spot for them. Obviously John the Kiwi has no taste!
Seajet
...
Agreed, the Leisure 17 is a cracking boat, a real achievement by designer Arthur Howard; they sail very well, and have done so across the Atlantic; just because they don't have three double aft cabins requiring godawful stowing the fenders on the pushpit doesn't go against them - for younger newcomers to cruisers who have a bit of spirit I'd say they're the bargain of a lifetime at the moment.
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
I've never had a sail in one, but I think they look very cute and from what I can see the are much more spacious than my wee Hunter 490 - just a foot shorter - is. A squillion were sold, which suggests that the design was good.
Giblets
Well-Known Member
ghostlymoron
Well-Known Member
Mine was quite stable when balanced on the keels dried out.
