Why are Bavarias so unloved??

Bav34 said:
You're really unbelievable. You don't know the story so you have to introduce a total fantasy.

It was Portsmouth Harbour entrance.

The boat was motoring along the small ships channel.

The engine stopped.

The wind was f 6/7 onshore.

Approx 15 seconds after the failure the boat hit the hard shingle beach and was lifted up and down until the tide receded.

It survived.

What exactly is your problem?
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It seems you know more than that that was posted on this thread. I do not.

I have no problem dealing with facts as they are presented to me. Do you?

It seems from the photo that no attempt was made to lay out a kedge or an anchor..... but then this may have been beyond the competence of the crew. If a boat goes agound do you just leave it to fend for itself?

Why did the engine stop? Out of fuel? Dirty filter? Dirty tanks? Diesels can take a lot of **** before they come to a dead stop. Why didn't they try sailing? .... if this is a lee shore then they would have had beam winds and the genoa would have worked to give them more sea room.

You're right ..... I am not in possession of all the facts ..... but aren't I permitted to make comments on the facts as presented to me?
 
TradewindSailor said:
You're right ..... I am not in possession of all the facts ..... but aren't I permitted to make comments on the facts as presented to me?
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Ah FACTS !!! The magic word. Not often popular on threads such as this.

The fact that I have yet to meet a Bavaria owner who is unhappy with his boat.

The fact that 3 couples have bought Bavarias after spending time on mine.

The fact (which is something that seems to annoy people) that you see Bavarias EVERYWHERE viz. they seem pretty fit for purpose.

The fact that I have tied up alongside literally hundreds of other yachts and spent many pleasant hours talking to owners of other marques and at no stage has anyone said ''I think your boat is cr*p ... but behind the safety of your keyboard you seem to think it's ok to criticise what you don't know.

You don't need to ask me if you are permitted to make comments, you can and do say what you like BUT you have now criticised keels, anchors AND crew ... all without knowing the facts.

I just wonder why.
 
capnsensible said:
I get to spend quite a bit of time on various Bavarias and really don't have a problem with them.

Some of the stuff fitted to them are a bit naff, like Lewmar bits, but thats British so its expected to be a tad shoddy.

Otherwise, I reckon you get good value. Was on a 42 all last week, handled nicely in harbour, sailed in winds of up to 30 odd knots, occaisional lumpy seas, no worries.

We sailed it alongside, onto moorings, did MOB under sail and engine in those stronger winds all with a furling main too (horror!). It didn't make the tea or scrub itself but I dunno what else you can expect from a boat?

Did it for me.
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To answer your original question?

Why the snide remark about Lewmar gear? I assume that you are just trolling with this remark.

I don't have a big problem with Bavarias - I have sailed a few as well and they do what they say they will - more or less.

The one problem I do have is with some Bavarias habit of broaching when hard pressed. I don't mind a boat protesting when you are over canvassed sailing down wind and it all goes wrong, but when you are sailing upwind and there's a bit of a gust and you have to dump the main to stop the thing broaching, my feeling is that its a sad inditement of the hull design and size of rudder etc etc. If you have never sailed a more moderate design or traditional design in blowy conditions, you have no idea what a pain in the backside sailing a Bav 32, 34, or 36 is. It doesn't help that the main sheet is on the cabin roof and isn't easy to dump from the helm. This isn't a problem reserved just for Bav's - some other modern fat back-sided boats have the same problem, but Bav's do it in spades.

Notwithstanding this moan, there are lots of happy families sailing Bav's and they are comfortable boats when you are alongside.
 
Bav34 said:
Ah FACTS !!! The magic word. Not often popular on threads such as this.

The fact that I have yet to meet a Bavaria owner who is unhappy with his boat.

The fact that 3 couples have bought Bavarias after spending time on mine.

The fact (which is something that seems to annoy people) that you see Bavarias EVERYWHERE viz. they seem pretty fit for purpose.

The fact that I have tied up alongside literally hundreds of other yachts and spent many pleasant hours talking to owners of other marques and at no stage has anyone said ''I think your boat is cr*p ... but behind the safety of your keyboard you seem to think it's ok to criticise what you don't know.

You don't need to ask me if you are permitted to make comments, you can and do say what you like BUT you have now criticised keels, anchors AND crew ... all without knowing the facts.

I just wonder why.
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You seem to be getting a little heated. Review the original post. Review my response to the post.

I'll let others reading this thread to condemn me or support me ...... but let's face it, this post was a TROLL and it's getting what was required of it, even if you don't like the replies.
 
If you have never sailed a more moderate design or traditional design in blowy conditions, you have no idea what a pain in the backside sailing a Bav 32, 34, or 36 is. It doesn't help that the main sheet is on the cabin roof and isn't easy to dump from the helm.



But that is not a problem unique to Bavarias.... in fact I would suggest that virtually all modern AWB's preform exactly the same way... some more than others....

Any beamy moderate draft fin keeled yacht with a spade rudder is going to potentially do this when overpressed.

My experience is that the Bav's you mentioned... and I have sailed all three for extensive periods... are less inclined to this behaviour than most of the other AWB's I have had time on... The worst ones in my experience for this were the Gibsea 33, SO 45 (with in mast) and the Bene 362..

I dont see anything unusual in this trait... though for peeps more used to sailing a long keel boat it must be disconcerting...

You just need to get your sail plan right.
 
john_morris_uk said:
I don't have a big problem with Bavarias - I have sailed a few as well and they do what they say they will - more or less.
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From what I have read, Bavaria seem to make perfectly adequate boats at the cheap end of the market. Sure, they aren't Hallberg-Rassy, but then Fiat aren't Mercedes either.

It's the astonishing touchiness of Bavaria owners, though, which makes tickling them up so tempting. Perhaps, deep down, they would all really rather have the Mercedes...
 
john_morris_uk said:
but when you are sailing upwind and there's a bit of a gust and you have to dump the main to stop the thing broaching, my feeling is that its a sad inditement of the hull design and size of rudder etc etc.
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One of the great things about my 1989 Westerly Tempest was that the mainsheet was on a track behind the tiller.

In a gybe it took your head off.

In the circumstances you describe it made it easy to physically JUMP on the sheet to free it from the jammer ... but by then it had rounded up anyway.

Or you could just reef to the conditions of course.
 
reddragon44 said:
IMO they will stand up against any british made boat. Like for like.

red
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Thats easily said because there arent any British made boats in that category. Just old and tired ones from a different era.

Must admit I always thought the wicker cupboard doors were a good idea giving excellent ventialtion.

I reckon it's time the Bav baiting stopped. It might be fun to wind up the owners but we all know that Bavs are every bit as good a boat as Bennies and Hanses and Jeanneaux. And comparisons with old British boats made in a different era really are as valid as trying to compare a Rover 90 with a VW Golf. Pointless - you pays your money and makes your personal choice.
 
TradewindSailor said:
You seem to be getting a little heated.
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No, not heated, I just like facts ... whether I am asking for advice, giving it or merely commenting on something.

I don't think it's a bad trait.

In case you think that is a bit anal I have some friends threatening to post (on Facebook) a picture of me wearing a lettuce on my head, in Val D'Isere last week :eek:

The picture of the lettuce is already posted.:)
 
Bosun Higgs said:
I reckon it's time the Bav baiting stopped. It might be fun to wind up the owners but we all know that Bavs are every bit as good a boat as Bennies and Hanses and Jeanneaux. And comparisons with old British boats made in a different era really are as valid as trying to compare a Rover 90 with a VW Golf. Pointless - you pays your money and makes your personal choice.
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Can't agree with you here, the subject is entertaining and you can't say that the Bavvies don't thrive on the attention. A troll like this would'nt get a response if it referred to Hanses or Legends.
Bavaria have recruited Frers in an attempt to address some of the perception so they are responding to the issues, they can't be blamed for trying to do it cheaper than anyone else, it is has been their main marketing stategy in recent times. Beneteau build competitive racers and use performance as as major part of their strategy, they have consequently to equip their boats better, horses for courses.
A bet if 'Bavaria bashing' was banned on here, all the Bavvies would be aghast, they sail reasonably simple boats so are less interested in other things like deck gear, sail controls or pointing ability.
 
Quandary said:
so are less interested in other things like deck gear, sail controls or pointing ability.
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Another FACT?

My two-speed winches are sited where either I or the crew can get to them.
Even when fully loaded I can wind them without physical effort.

I can and do put mast bend in.

I can and do let the main down the track.

I can and do use the rod-kicker.

I can and do use the main outhaul ... accessible from the cockpit.

I can and do adjust halyard tension ... again from the cockpit.

My boats optimum pointing angle is 35 app. where it regularly sits in a groove exceeding 6 knots.

More facts.

My apologies.
 
Quandary said:
What, TWO speed winches?
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Yes, why do you ask?

Winch2.jpg


Winch1.jpg
 
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Bav34 said:
Another FACT?

My two-speed winches are sited where either I or the crew can get to them.
Even when fully loaded I can wind them without physical effort.

I can and do put mast bend in.

I can and do let the main down the track.

I can and do use the rod-kicker.

I can and do use the main outhaul ... accessible from the cockpit.

I can and do adjust halyard tension ... again from the cockpit.

My boats optimum pointing angle is 35 app. where it regularly sits in a groove exceeding 6 knots.

More facts.

My apologies.
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Yes, my Mondeo is boringly adequate too.
My Peugeot is much more interesting. Bits dropping off, random things not working, the excitement of not knowing whether the radio will work....
I don't really talk about AWB's I've sailed, more about the places I've sailed them etc.
 
reddragon44 said:
Bosun Higgs said:
Thats easily said because there arent any British made boats in that category. Just old and tired ones from a different era.

The reason that its easily said .Is that BEN JenS and Bavs have destroyed the market for British built boats. As they are better.
No sensible person would buy a British boat, with all these continental boat around
Please remember Ben Jens and Bavs are not dark ,dank ,and smelly.

red
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No sensible person would buy any boat.
I'm not here to be sensible!
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Bosun Higgs said:
Thats easily said because there arent any British made boats in that category. Just old and tired ones from a different era.

The reason that its easily said .Is that BEN JenS and Bavs have destroyed the market for British built boats. As they are better.
No sensible person would buy a British boat, with all these continental boat around
Please remember Ben Jens and Bavs are not dark ,dank ,and smelly.

red
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Bav34 said:
Another FACT?

My two-speed winches are sited where either I or the crew can get to them.
Even when fully loaded I can wind them without physical effort.

I can and do put mast bend in.

I can and do let the main down the track.

I can and do use the rod-kicker.

I can and do use the main outhaul ... accessible from the cockpit.

I can and do adjust halyard tension ... again from the cockpit.

My boats optimum pointing angle is 35 app. where it regularly sits in a groove exceeding 6 knots.

More facts.

My apologies.
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Our Mab only manages 27deg app :mad:
 
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