Who has been over to Holland recently

wingdiver

wingdiver

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Hi
Looking for some help/advice about the approaches having not been over since 2009.
In particular, do the usually excellent Dutch 1800 series charts cover the wind farms on that side of the North Sea? I'm thinking of getting hold of the latest 1801 which covers the coastal stuff with an Admiralty or Imray whole North Sea area chart.
Our usual path has been Orwell - Blankenberge although we have previously crossed directly to Hellevoetsluis or Den Helder.
This time we are considering going to Vlissingen as the Sail de Ruiter event is on the weekend at the start of our hols. Maybe we will have to go to Breskens as there will be space over there!!! (and we can take the ferry across to Vlissingen)
 
Hi Duncan. We were there in June. I never use the 1800 for the coast and mine is way out of date anyway. I went Ostend - Flushing and came back Rotterdam - Hook of Holland - Bradwell (28 hours with Full Circle and more ships than you can shake a stick at).

I have a new Imray C30 but it will not include the changes to the TSS tracks that came into effect last week. Going via Blankenberge keeps you clear of most of the new tracks I think. No windfarms on that route. Chart does include Bligh Bank and Thornton Bank farms.

I also have 2007 editions of 1807 and 1809 (good enough) a 2011 1805 and a 2012 1810 and a latest StandeMast Route. If you want to borrow any then PM and will get them to you.
 
wingdiver said:
Hi
Looking for some help/advice about the approaches having not been over since 2009.
In particular, do the usually excellent Dutch 1800 series charts cover the wind farms on that side of the North Sea? I'm thinking of getting hold of the latest 1801 which covers the coastal stuff with an Admiralty or Imray whole North Sea area chart.
Our usual path has been Orwell - Blankenberge although we have previously crossed directly to Hellevoetsluis or Den Helder.
This time we are considering going to Vlissingen as the Sail de Ruiter event is on the weekend at the start of our hols. Maybe we will have to go to Breskens as there will be space over there!!! (and we can take the ferry across to Vlissingen)
Click to expand...

Beware that the 1800-series charts are no longer updated annually (navy cost-cutting).

I have a detailed chart of the Dutch coast (with the new TSS lay-out).
PM me your e-mail address and I'll forward it to you.
 
We were lucky enough to get two of the best weeks 2nd/3rd weeks of July in Holland......... absolutely stunning.

Going to the Westerschelde from Long Sand Head I take a line of 110/115 degrees (don't have charts in front of me) and pick up the port hand channel marker at 051 degrees 25.0 N, 003 degrees 02.85 and then just follow the main channel in. Instead of Breskens I would recommend the VVW Schelde marina http://vvwschelde.nl/ . If you haven't been before, friendly haven meester, good food at a reasonable price and berths are cheaper than Breskens.

Paul.
 
wingdiver said:
Hi
Looking for some help/advice about the approaches having not been over since 2009.
In particular, do the usually excellent Dutch 1800 series charts cover the wind farms on that side of the North Sea? I'm thinking of getting hold of the latest 1801 which covers the coastal stuff with an Admiralty or Imray whole North Sea area chart.
Our usual path has been Orwell - Blankenberge although we have previously crossed directly to Hellevoetsluis or Den Helder.
This time we are considering going to Vlissingen as the Sail de Ruiter event is on the weekend at the start of our hols. Maybe we will have to go to Breskens as there will be space over there!!! (and we can take the ferry across to Vlissingen)
Click to expand...

The Thornton Bank wind farm is particularly annoying - my preferred route to the Deurloo Channel to go into Vlissingen passes through it. We've been across twice this year (May & June), with three of the four passages taking that route. The first time a guard ship made us change course by 3nm. The second time I went for the great big gap in the middle. A guard ship approached but seemed to happy to let us through. Possibly they took pity on us as it was blowing SW7 and pretty rough. The third time I went for the same gap, and was told by a windcat that buzzed over that we were not allowed through the Thornton windfarm. He was too late to make me take an alternative route, so bade me a good watch and buzzed away again.

It seems that annual updates on the chartplotter at £150 a pop no longer provide up to date enough information to plot a passage across to the Netherlands.
 
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Go to Terneuzen, almost same difference and quieter. Easier to find a space outside. Do not bother with the lock, takes up a lot of time. Look for a pontoon mooring with a green board. May have a date written on it.
Means the owner has gone for an extended period, at least the coming night, and the place can be used. You will be expected to pay the marina.
Then again, you may already know this.

Have a log of engine hours, diesel bought and receipts. Do not have red diesel in cans!
Unless you have a holding tank have the Blakes closed on the jakes. Not allowed to discharge black water anywhere in Netherlands territorial limits.
 
We were in the north of the Netherlands in late May and again in early July (in Germany in between). We crossed Lowestoft to IJmuiden and back, which is easy and relatively free of ships (relative to Rotterdam and Hook of Holland, anyway) although the traffic is greater on the Dutch side. We were there before the new TSS off IJmuiden came into force, but it looks straightforward and our usual course would cross it at right angles anyway. We have only ever used the Imray planning chart for that crossing and the crossing to Den Helder, although we have more detailed charts for the Waddensea and IJsselmeer. The 2013 charts have now been issued - they are usually issued in the early spring, but this year they delayed till late May.

I think that the Dutch school holidays finish in the middle of August, and you notice a vast decrease in queues for locks etc as soon as the kids are back at school. Last year, in an IJsselmeer lock on the last Friday of holidays we were in a scrum in a lock which was totally packed. The following Monday, we passed through several equivalent locks by ourselves.

We were checked by a police launch, but they only wanted to see our passports and make sure we had sent in the Schengen form when we arrived. No questions or checks on diesel ( ours is a white diesel boat anyway, since we spend so much time in Europe) or on holding tanks, or on the radio ATIS etc.
 
Thanks for all the replies and thanks to Will for the email.
To the suggestions of moorings, we have been in most areas of southern Holland so know of the alternatives and would obviously prefer Vlissingen as the Sail de Ruiter festival is on but, as this also means Vlissingen will be extremely busy so we need an alternative if there is no room. Breskens is the obvious choice as there is a ferry back across to Vlissingen from there.
Shame about the lack of updates on the 1800 series. We have always found them to be excellent in the past. We have some 2007 to 2009 versions of most areas.
Electronic charts are generally woefully out of date and cost a fortune to update. Seems wrong that they are sometimes a year out of date and you get charged over £100 for what is effectively innaccurate information.
Presumably a paper chart bought from a 'proper' agent should still have the latest updates on it.
 
Just spoken to Charity & Taylor over near Woodbridge (formerly SCD) and they have the recently reprinted Admiralty Standard Chart 1406 - Dover and Calais to Orford Ness and Scheveningen - which has all the relevant wind farm positions and the new TSS on it. They also update to the latest NtM before sending out (or collection in my case). They also advised that the Dutch charts have been reprinted for the coastal areas recently (I think 1801, 1811 and 1812) and they will be arriving any day.
 
tillergirl said:
Feedback request please. Given Barbican Bill's experience, is the guide to the Belgium Wind Farms at week 17 of the 3013 list of NtMs on http://www.crossingthethamesestuary.com/page9.html any use? If not, how could it be improved please?

There is an update regarding the Thornton Bank from yesterday but I could make this available as a straight download.
Click to expand...

Absolutely great Roger. The info required is all there. Could you improve it? Realistically not really. If I had applied the time and diligence I should do to trawling through the Admiralty notices you have made readily and easily available I would have known that the obvious looking huge gap in the Thornton Bank windfarm was in fact restricted, and not there for me.

Trouble is I have become over-reliant on the whizzo Garmin plotter at the helm, and, changes to East Coast rivers aside, rely on annual updates to the chartplotter, and replacing the charts periodically. Most of my leisure time in the summer is spent sailing, whereas I guess a chunk of it should be spent updating charts and checking there are no recent changes affecting the routes in my plotter.

I remain confused as to why I can't sail through a huge gap in the middle of a windfarm where nothing seems to be happening
 
AliM said:
We were in the north of the Netherlands in late May and again in early July (in Germany in between). We crossed Lowestoft to IJmuiden and back, which is easy and relatively free of ships (relative to Rotterdam and Hook of Holland, anyway) although the traffic is greater on the Dutch side. We were there before the new TSS off IJmuiden came into force, but it looks straightforward and our usual course would cross it at right angles anyway. We have only ever used the Imray planning chart for that crossing and the crossing to Den Helder, although we have more detailed charts for the Waddensea and IJsselmeer. The 2013 charts have now been issued - they are usually issued in the early spring, but this year they delayed till late May.

I think that the Dutch school holidays finish in the middle of August, and you notice a vast decrease in queues for locks etc as soon as the kids are back at school. Last year, in an IJsselmeer lock on the last Friday of holidays we were in a scrum in a lock which was totally packed. The following Monday, we passed through several equivalent locks by ourselves.

We were checked by a police launch, but they only wanted to see our passports and make sure we had sent in the Schengen form when we arrived. No questions or checks on diesel ( ours is a white diesel boat anyway, since we spend so much time in Europe) or on holding tanks, or on the radio ATIS etc.
Click to expand...

This raises a point for me - Marmalade doesn't have holding tanks nor an ATIS radio. I've not been to Holland for a few years - should I be worried and / or not go there? We've previously locked in at vlissingen and gone through walcheren to middleberg, veere, goes, zeerikzee etc...
 
Marmalade said:
This raises a point for me - Marmalade doesn't have holding tanks nor an ATIS radio. I've not been to Holland for a few years - should I be worried and / or not go there? We've previously locked in at vlissingen and gone through walcheren to middleberg, veere, goes, zeerikzee etc...
Click to expand...

I spent a few weeks going through the canals this year. I just used an ordinary HH VHF on the couple of times I needed to ask when a lock would open. They don't expect tourists to have ATIS,and there is no reason to get it put in your radio.
You don't need holding tanks either,legally or in practice, and there aren't many places to empty them anyway. But there are plenty of places with free toilets,and you may find yourself getting used to planning to take advantage of tying up for a few minutes in places with a cafe. Also,Dutch cafe owners genuinely don't seem to mind you just running in to use their heads,unlike for example many English pubs.
Also nobody ever asked for the water almanak #1,the one with all the rules and regulations in Dutch,I wouldn't waste your money,but you are legal with a free download anyway.
The part two with the lock and marina details though is very useful. It saved me money because it gives the marina prices which vary a lot,although all substantially cheaper than the UK!
Try and take the time to stop at little towns and walk about,they all have very individual characters and quaint things to see.
Nobody ever asked me for any papers in Holland,and I never spoke to a customs man. A huge Police patrol boat helped me get off when I ran aground,with a blast from his bow thruster,then all the coppers came out of the cabin,stood in a line on deck,and SALUTED me!! Try getting that in England,I don't think. It is a friendly place for visiting yachtsmen and all these dire warnings about legal requirements will vanish in to thin air when you are actually over there,have a nice one Jerry.


ps download "The Alternative Dutch Dictionary" which had me weeping with laughter at the words and idioms which you will never find in a phrase book. It is safe to repeat them as well because nobody will understand your accent anyway...
 
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jerrytug said:
I spent a few weeks going through the canals this year. I just used an ordinary HH VHF on the couple of times I needed to ask when a lock would open. They don't expect tourists to have ATIS,and there is no reason to get it put in your radio.
You don't need holding tanks either,legally or in practice, and there aren't many places to empty them anyway. But there are plenty of places with free toilets,and you may find yourself getting used to planning to take advantage of tying up for a few minutes in places with a cafe. Also,Dutch cafe owners genuinely don't seem to mind you just running in to use their heads,unlike for example many English pubs.
Also nobody ever asked for the water almanak #1,the one with all the rules and regulations in Dutch,I wouldn't waste your money,but you are legal with a free download anyway.
The part two with the lock and marina details though is very useful. It saved me money because it gives the marina prices which vary a lot,although all substantially cheaper than the UK!
Try and take the time to stop at little towns and walk about,they all have very individual characters and quaint things to see.
Nobody ever asked me for any papers in Holland,and I never spoke to a customs man. A huge Police patrol boat helped me get off when I ran aground,with a blast from his bow thruster,then all the coppers came out of the cabin,stood in a line on deck,and SALUTED me!! Try getting that in England,I don't think. It is a friendly place for visiting yachtsmen and all these dire warnings about legal requirements will vanish in to thin air when you are actually over there,have a nice one Jerry.
Click to expand...

+1. Ijmuiden-Amsterdam-Ijmuiden-Stellendam-Willhelmstad-Middleberg-Vlissingen last month.
 
jerrytug said:
I spent a few weeks going through the canals this year. I just used an ordinary HH VHF on the couple of times I needed to ask when a lock would open. They don't expect tourists to have ATIS,and there is no reason to get it put in your radio.
You don't need holding tanks either,legally or in practice, and there aren't many places to empty them anyway. But there are plenty of places with free toilets,and you may find yourself getting used to planning to take advantage of tying up for a few minutes in places with a cafe. Also,Dutch cafe owners genuinely don't seem to mind you just running in to use their heads,unlike for example many English pubs.
Also nobody ever asked for the water almanak #1,the one with all the rules and regulations in Dutch,I wouldn't waste your money,but you are legal with a free download anyway.
The part two with the lock and marina details though is very useful. It saved me money because it gives the marina prices which vary a lot,although all substantially cheaper than the UK!
Try and take the time to stop at little towns and walk about,they all have very individual characters and quaint things to see.
Nobody ever asked me for any papers in Holland,and I never spoke to a customs man. A huge Police patrol boat helped me get off when I ran aground,with a blast from his bow thruster,then all the coppers came out of the cabin,stood in a line on deck,and SALUTED me!! Try getting that in England,I don't think. It is a friendly place for visiting yachtsmen and all these dire warnings about legal requirements will vanish in to thin air when you are actually over there,have a nice one Jerry.


ps download "The Alternative Dutch Dictionary" which had me weeping with laughter at the words and idioms which you will never find in a phrase book. It is safe to repeat them as well because nobody will understand your accent anyway...
Click to expand...


That a great post Jerry, i have saved it for future reference.
I had already down loaded the Almanak 1 onto the boat lappi. To date i have never been asked if i had a copy either
 
Can you put up the download link please? Googled it and found a lot of stuff about it being 140 pages long, but couldn't see a link. Presume having on a laptop would satisfy a fussy ossifer.
I agree with all Jerry's comments about cruising in the Netherlands, too, except for ungentlemanly queue-jumping at locks that seems to have developed these past few years.
 
We too have never had any real issues with officials in all the areas of the Netherlands we have visited (and we've covered most of it over the years). We nearly got stopped by customs in Ijmuiden (having arrived from the Amsterdam direction) but were 'saved' by the arrival of a German flagged yacht not long after we landed which seemed to be of more interest :rolleyes:
We have been visited by customs in Blankenberge and Boulogne in the past none of whom were really a problem. Just going through the motions really.
 
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