Where have all the dayboats gone?

That's true. Between a Hawk 20 sailing on the Itchen as SWMBO and I arrived in Southampton for the boat show at the weekend, and several more in close-up at Mayflower Park, I'd agree the design looks very practical. Big, too! I mean wide! Like...a Wayfarer's mother. :rolleyes:

Being able to sit happily on a drying mooring must be a critical step designers take towards the affordability of their boats...

...however exclusive or particular the use of a keelboat, if it needs a deep water mooring, or worse, if she needs rolling in/dragging out each time she's used, it must take a big chunk more effort and money to sail. No wonder the Olympic Tempest is so rare, now. It's a wonder to me that the Flying Fifteen endures.
 
Dan,

I was thinking about Flying Fifteens during the progress of this thread.

I haven't seen one on the water for years, but that may be a matter of timing; Hayling Island Sailing Club at the mouth of Chichester Harbour used to have a sizeable fleet, all dry-sailed on trolleys.

I haven't been around HISC on shore for years so don't know if they're still there.

Even long ago I can't think of another club anywhere around here which operated them.
 
I can onlt talk about the coasts of Suffolk and Essex.

The problem with the keelboat daysailer is moorings, of course. These boats flourish where a club operates a launch and moorings are close to the club house.

There are a handful of clubs which are located on narrow, deep, tidal rivers, so that deep water moorings are not too hard to come by and can be accessed quickly from the club house.

These clubs usually have active fleets of racing keelboats. One thinks of the Burnham clubs, Aldeburgh YC (Loch Longs, Dragons) and to some extent RHYC (Ajaxes) and WSC (Squibs)

Where these conditions are not met, we don't find fleets of racing keelboats.

We may find local one design centreboard dayboats, but with the notable exception of the Brightlingsea One Design fleet which has been rebuilt as a fleet, these are very scarce as they are generally lightly built and have come to the end of their lives, with perhaps one or two boats kept going by enthusiasts. Modern dinghies have replaced them.
 
Seajet said:
Dan,

I was thinking about Flying Fifteens during the progress of this thread.

I haven't seen one on the water for years, but that may be a matter of timing; Hayling Island Sailing Club at the mouth of Chichester Harbour used to have a sizeable fleet, all dry-sailed on trolleys.

I haven't been around HISC on shore for years so don't know if they're still there.

Even long ago I can't think of another club anywhere around here which operated them.
Click to expand...

The are still quite a few 'effing fifteens' at HISC.
Cowes Week has got very expensive for dayboats, so might be giving a bit of a false picture.
In Squibs, the entry fee for Cowes and the Nationals were about the same, but the Nationals included lift in/out, mooring for the week and a couple of socials. Plus the accommodation was a lot cheaper.
I noticed a fair chunk of the Lymington X Fleet was still at home during Cowes Week.
Fleets of X's, Squibs, Victories etc seem to be about the usual in many places.
Possibly the fragmentation effect of a lot of new classes does not help.
Possibly the higher performance 'sportsboats' have had their few years of being in fashion, people are drawn to the tactical fleet racing in the older classes, or stick with dinghies.
Obviously the financial situation won't be helping, there used to be a lot more sponsorship sloshing around the SB3's etc. It's partly critical mass, some people are drawn to the class with the best competition, once a class goes off the boil, it can sink very quickly.

I used to sail dayboats a lot, but I'm back with dinghies mostly now.
Racing small dayboats (a 12 metre is a big dayboat!) is not that expensive, but you need to live on the coast and commit time to it to get value for money. It's easier for a lot of people to race dinghies or cruise their yacht once or twice a year.
 
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Going on from the Hawk 20 being sensible in having a lift keel, another boat I've always fancied is the Kinsman, lift keel sister of the Yeoman.

Looks a helluva lot more boaty than the Hawk !

There are a couple recently joined at my club which sit happily on the mud when the tide is out, but I haven't seen them sailing or had a chance to chat with their owners.

Might represent good value dayboat sailing I suspect...

HK1.jpg


images
 
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Sybarite said:
http://yachtandsail.blogo.it/galleria/ciao-gianni/7


The owner is Jackie Setton who imports Pioneer radios to France. He had the largest boat registered in France (La Belle France) and then the Lone Ranger (78m), several helicopters, a fleet of Ferraris and a château in the Paris region.
Click to expand...

Hmm...if I could afford all that, I doubt I'd buy myself a boat that looks like a long narrow kiddies' sand-box!

View attachment 20818

Where on earth did they source those seats? They're like Ikea conservatory furniture! :rolleyes:
 
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Seajet said:
Going on from the Hawk 20 being sensible in having a lift keel, another boat I've always fancied is the Kinsman, lift keel sister of the Yeoman.

Looks a helluva lot more boaty than the Hawk !

There are a couple recently joined at my club which sit happily on the mud when the tide is out, but I haven't seen them sailing or had a chance to chat with their owners.

Might represent good value dayboat sailing I suspect...

......
Click to expand...

I seem to see a Hawk 20 in every UK harbour I visit.
Never seen one raced, rarely see them leave the mooring.
In terms of hours spent sailing, I suspect many of them are poor value compared to the x-boats that get raced twice a week, or the small cruiser that goes places.
But they are not alone in that.
 
lw395 said:
I seem to see a Hawk 20 in every UK harbour I visit.
Never seen one raced, rarely see them leave the mooring.
In terms of hours spent sailing, I suspect many of them are poor value compared to the x-boats that get raced twice a week, or the small cruiser that goes places.
But they are not alone in that.
Click to expand...

lw395,

I don't think you can blame the design for that; I know a couple of Contessa 32's which never seem to go anywhere, it's operator not designer error !
 
lots of flying fifteens up here, loch tummel, loch earn, loch lomond, Royal forth etc. all had fleets of them at various times

They have a travellers still and they are popular because they are good value now
 
At risk of boring those who've heard this before, I read an account in the early 'nineties of a Flying Fifteen owner who had abandoned competition and done a pretty good job of replacing that wacky rakish FF keel with a pair of bilge stubs, allowing her to dry out upright...

...though how he dealt with the equally vulnerable rudder, I don't know.

Anybody remember the article? Yachting Monthly I expect, about twenty years ago. It's mad, that old articles are £8 to re-read... :mad:
 
dancrane said:
a Flying Fifteen owner who had abandoned competition and done a pretty good job of replacing that wacky rakish FF keel with a pair of bilge stubs, allowing her to dry out upright
Click to expand...

Is he the one still hanging from a sailing club flagpole while the ghost of Uffa Fox circles hitting him with a cricket bat ? :eek:
 
One of my favourite Uffa Fox stories;

At this time he had a decent house with fields, one had a footpath across it.

A chap routinely cycled along this footpath; thinking about it the poor sod was probably going to and from work at one of the various boatbuilders, aircraft manufacturers etc...

Uffa was outraged, quite happy this bod should walk on the footpath but cycling on it was apparently undermining all decent society.

Being a Huntin' Shootin' type, Uffa had a dead rabbit to hand, so he put it to the far side of the footpath and lay with his shotgun...

As the demon cyclist went past and lined up with the rabbit, Uffa shot his front wheel off.

It went to Court but he got off; contacts never do any harm in those circles.
 
Seajet said:
Dan,

I was thinking about Flying Fifteens during the progress of this thread.

I haven't seen one on the water for years, but that may be a matter of timing; Hayling Island Sailing Club at the mouth of Chichester Harbour used to have a sizeable fleet, all dry-sailed on trolleys.

I haven't been around HISC on shore for years so don't know if they're still there.

Even long ago I can't think of another club anywhere around here which operated them.
Click to expand...


There is still a good sized fleet of Fifteens racing regularly on Windermere - they're all dry-sailed. The Mersey has a small fleet of Squibs, an even smaller fleet of Etchells 22's and a few Royal Mersey One Designs designed by Milne and generally referred to as Milne's.

With regard to the lift keelers the Kinsman is a very interesting looking boat and is reputed to do as well as the Yeoman.
There used to be a Dutch day-sailer called a Centaur 20 which looked very attractive but I cannot find any details apart from on possibly Dutch web sites which I cannot read.
 
I wonder if the floating-dock idea, suggested lately hereabouts, might enable elderly Flying Fifteens to dry out upright, undamaged?

Attractive idea, to me...an old FF on a half-tide mooring, with a soft 'pontoon' of jerrycans or buoyancy bags, holding the boat 24" above her intended waterline. It would take a lot of pumping each time, but not impossible. :rolleyes: Or, would it become dangerously unstable?
 
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