What's the flaw in my plan?

[V1701]

It's not a trick question, I really hope there isn't one! The plan is:

1. Take a year off work this year from June, sail to Portugal & park boat somewhere on a 12 month berthing contract.
2. Use berthing contract as address with which to obtain 5 year residency permit.
3. Return to UK after year off & work another 2 years using boat in Portugal for hols.
4. When no longer have to work go to live in Portugal.

It's unlikely I'd ever work in Portugal, it would be purely living off savings until my first occupational pension kicks in @60 and I'm 54 this year. No property in UK.

I hope nobody minds that I started another Portugal thread but I want to make sure I haven't missed anything glaring and would welcome any advice or suggestions because if I don't get someting sorted before the end of this year I don't think I'll be able to do it until I reach 67 when I'd have enough of a pension income to satisfy the conditions for a D7...

Thanks,
David.

 

[srm]

It will possibly work. I take it you have read the recent EU/Portugal post Brexit threads.

The only snag that may occur is proving that you are resident in Portugal when you come to convert your five year EU registration to Permanent Residence status. There have been varying requirements reported in the other threads. I do know that one guy who keeps his boat here and lives aboard for much of each summer was unable to demonstrate he was in fact resident at the end of his five year registration.

 

[Tony Cross]

The flaw is your healthcare I suspect.

If you are resident in Portugal you will loose your NHS entitlement in the UK. (I'm assuming you're not receiving a state pension yet).
If you register with a GP in the UK you might lose any Portuguese healthcare you have.

Countries with reciprocal healthcare arrangements do talk to each other and they make sure you only get healthcare in one of the countries. As an example I know of a couple who have Greek healthcare under the S1 system (because they're receiving a UK state pension). They went back to the UK to stay with their daughter for a month and although they knew that the S1 system entitles them to NHS healthcare when visiting the UK they thought it would be useful to register with a GP whilst in the UK. When they returned to Greece and needed to use their Greek healthcare they found it had been cancelled because the Greeks learned they'd since registered with a UK GP and were thus using NHS healthcare instead.

 

[PlanB]

The heatlthcare conundrum is a valid one.
Others with direct Portugal experience can comment on the residence issues (and tax, as well).
If you do decide to come back to the UK to live at some point (health or other reasons), do you know where you will live and if you can afford it?

 

[nortada]

It's not a trick question, I really hope there isn't one! The plan is:

1. Take a year off work this year from June, sail to Portugal & park boat somewhere on a 12 month berthing contract.
2. Use berthing contract as address with which to obtain 5 year residency permit.
3. Return to UK after year off & work another 2 years using boat in Portugal for hols.
4. When no longer have to work go to live in Portugal.

It's unlikely I'd ever work in Portugal, it would be purely living off savings until my first occupational pension kicks in @60 and I'm 54 this year. No property in UK.

I hope nobody minds that I started another Portugal thread but I want to make sure I haven't missed anything glaring and would welcome any advice or suggestions because if I don't get something sorted before the end of this year I don't think I'll be able to do it until I reach 67 when I'd have enough of a pension income to satisfy the conditions for a D7...

Thanks,
David.

Your plan will work fine.

Have a look at:- NHS entitlement during and after slow circumnavivation, which covers most of your questions.

As every EU country has a very different approach to Brit visitors be aware of advice from Brits in other EU countries

 

[Stingo]

Just do it. If you don't, I'm willing to bet that on your death bed, you'll regret not breaking free.

 

[Star-Lord]

Private healthcare in Portugal is remarkably cheap and incredibly good. It's all relative I know but same day appointments with at a private doctor in a clinic or hospital is about €50 (outside of Lisbon) and may be even cheaper in the north. I have heard a few stories that would deter me from ever visiting a public hospital in Portugal. I also heard, when I was there, that medical insurance for ex pats was cheap as chips... but that may have been a tall story!

 

[nortada]

Private healthcare in Portugal is remarkably cheap and incredibly good. It's all relative I know but same day appointments with at a private doctor in a clinic or hospital is about €50 (outside of Lisbon) and may be even cheaper in the north. I have heard a few stories that would deter me from ever visiting a public hospital in Portugal. I also heard, when I was there, that medical insurance for ex pats was cheap as chips... but that may have been a tall story!

Centro de Saudis provide a good walk in service for minor ailments and there is good A&E coverage.

Because private hospitals can lack the resources, in complicated and serious cases, private patients are regularly transferred to public hospitals, who also do a good job.

Rather than rumour control, I speak from personal experience.

Of course, provided you have retained your residency in the U.K. if you are ‘walking wounded’ you can always return to the NHS.

 

[Tony Cross]

Your plan will work fine.

Have a look at:- NHS entitlement during and after slow circumnavivation, which covers most of your questions.

As every EU country has a very different approach to Brit visitors be aware of advice from Brits in other EU countries

Your advice in that thread is to basically cross your fingers and hope. My information may only be based on the situation in Greece, but it's based on both real experience and actual facts. Healthcare is the one thing you want to be absolutely certain you have nailed down.

 

[nortada]

Your advice in that thread is to basically cross your fingers and hope. My information may only be based on the situation in Greece, but it's based on both real experience and actual facts. Healthcare is the one thing you want to be absolutely certain you have nailed down.

Rather than hope - much in that thread is based on fact and personal circumstance.

Can’t comment on Greece as I am not there but after 20 years have a reasonable handle on Portugal, where, at present, healthcare is not an issue but who knows what the future may bring

 

[Star-Lord]

Centro de Saudis provide a good walk in service for minor ailments and there is good A&E coverage.

Because private hospitals can lack the resources, in complicated and serious cases, private patients are regularly transferred to public hospitals, who also do a good job.

Rather than rumour control, I speak from personal experience.

Of course, provided you have retained your residency in the U.K. if you are ‘walking wounded’ you can always return to the NHS.

There is a Kiwi mechanic working on yacht engines in the Algarve... (lifts them out and put them back as good as new imo - he did mine) and he told me he took his Portuguese wife to a public hospital and she was sent home mis-diagnosed. In the middle of the night he drove her to Lisbon to a hospital near where her parents lived and walked her in. This strategy saved her life! I know there's always exceptions and stories like this but this was not the only story like this I heard about Algarve hospitals. Well-heeled Portuguese in Villamoura go to Lisbon. but to compare public hospitals in Portugal to the service back home is not really fair. When I was in Lagos one of the Faro doctors had caused a fuss because he said he would never recommend a public hospital in Portugal. If there is something like emergency surgery for a loved one, or myself, I would go to Lisbon. I thought I may have had a small heart problem (it was just bad sleeping posture!) so I sailed from Cascais to Expo Marina and walked to the private hospital NW of Marina Parque de Naciose. I checked myself in at about 2000 hours and was seen immediately and within ten minutes I was hooked up to an ECG (I think that's the name) and given all these tests. For a walk in at a Private Hospital you have to give them €500 cash or they debit a CC and refund you later (they always obviously ask if you have insurance). This particular trip cost €450. I am quite sure in saying the hospitals in the Algarve are in several leagues further down than the hospitals in Lisbon. I did see a private doctor in Algarve for €50 same day, or day or two later if you choose, for minor stuff and prescriptions were written and European health card produced and that knocks off some cost on prescription (which always seemed cheap anyways). If you can afford the very reasonable health insurance go private and for consultations go to Lisbon because its not far. Portugal is not a wealthy country and the average wage is low. Health insurance is cheap.

 

[Tony Cross]

at present, healthcare is not an issue but who knows what the future may bring

And that's my point. IMO the OP needs to be quite certain that their healthcare is well sorted simply because you don't know what the future may bring.

 

[Graham376]

What you propose should work O.K. if you sort your UK base. Many years ago I took out the 5 year residence in Portugal, using a residential address (sister in law) but many have used marina contracts or boat yard which is cheaper if dumping the boat for long periods. I later converted to permanent residence using address of the apartment we later purchased.

I have not emigrated from UK so haven't gone down the S1 route so, as far as they're concerned, I'm still there. Have house, pay taxes, health care etc. Residence in Portugal allows free health care and registration at a health centre (Centro de Saude) but don't be surprised if treatment is refused at Faro during summer busy season. The alternative is to go to emergency at Faro hospital or to the minor emergency clinic at Loule, where the wait is much shorter and treatment excellent. As already mentioned, there are lots of private clinics and costs are very reasonable. There are of course private hospitals with charges similar to UK. Residence also allows a Portuguese EHIC which can be used in the rest of Europe.

Appearing to have a UK resident base and being on the electoral role there is crucial if you want to keep GP/health care etc. It seems some health authorities don't follow national guidelines and are quick to kick people out of the system.

 

[V1701]

Thanks to everyone who's replied. The thread seems to have veered away from whether the plan will fundamentally work to a discussion around getting the healthcare aspect sorted which suggests that I should be OK as long as I do that which is encouraging. I have been following the long Portugal thread and will also have a look at the NHS one...

Thanks again,
David.

 

[srm]

Hi David,

You did say that when you retire you want to live in Portugal.

Just an idea, but during your initials stay try to get a Portuguese Social Security number. From previous threads this may be a case of simply asking for one. In my case I registered as self employed with finance and used that at Social Security. My wife was employed for a short while and automaticaly got one. Apparently, the SS number is valid for life and will give entry to Portuguese health care system when you return without need for the UK S1 which may or may not be in existence by then.

When you apply for permanent residence you may have to provide evidence of health insurance or enrolment in the Portuguese health care system (I did but others did not).

Best of luck.

 

[BigJoe]

Can you still get residency in an EU country now the UK, has left the EU ?

 

[greeny]

You can in Portugal. Friend did it this last week at Lagoa camara. Situation on the ground is that nothing has changed yet and we are told that nothing will until the negotiation period is complete.
And to the original poster, yes your proposal would work under the current application of the rules. Who knows what's coming after this year. If it was me, I'd just do it and adjust my actions as I go along. It may become appreciably more difficult to take this route after the end of transition.

 

[Chris_Robb]

There is a Kiwi mechanic working on yacht engines in the Algarve... (lifts them out and put them back as good as new imo - he did mine) and he told me he took his Portuguese wife to a public hospital and she was sent home mis-diagnosed. In the middle of the night he drove her to Lisbon to a hospital near where her parents lived and walked her in. This strategy saved her life! I know there's always exceptions and stories like this but this was not the only story like this I heard about Algarve hospitals. Well-heeled Portuguese in Villamoura go to Lisbon. but to compare public hospitals in Portugal to the service back home is not really fair. When I was in Lagos one of the Faro doctors had caused a fuss because he said he would never recommend a public hospital in Portugal. If there is something like emergency surgery for a loved one, or myself, I would go to Lisbon. I thought I may have had a small heart problem (it was just bad sleeping posture!) so I sailed from Cascais to Expo Marina and walked to the private hospital NW of Marina Parque de Naciose. I checked myself in at about 2000 hours and was seen immediately and within ten minutes I was hooked up to an ECG (I think that's the name) and given all these tests. For a walk in at a Private Hospital you have to give them €500 cash or they debit a CC and refund you later (they always obviously ask if you have insurance). This particular trip cost €450. I am quite sure in saying the hospitals in the Algarve are in several leagues further down than the hospitals in Lisbon. I did see a private doctor in Algarve for €50 same day, or day or two later if you choose, for minor stuff and prescriptions were written and European health card produced and that knocks off some cost on prescription (which always seemed cheap anyways). If you can afford the very reasonable health insurance go private and for consultations go to Lisbon because its not far. Portugal is not a wealthy country and the average wage is low. Health insurance is cheap.

No different from the UK then - Guildford Cardiac is probably worse than that Portugeese hospital - Go down the road to Frimley and you get the best service. However all are plagued with waiting times for opps........

 

[nortada]

You can in Portugal. Friend did it this last week at Lagoa camara.

Same true in Lagos.

 

[Beneteau381]

Same true in Lagos.

Albufeira still doing it