What is the safe way to use a bosun’s chair on a mast with a single part halyard?

[Graham_Wright]

The nappy style bosun's chair is better but only as something to sit in passively.

Would you care to elucidate? My chair is ok to sit on but, if I stand, it slides up my backside and the crutch straps - er - clutch.. I've been thinking about designing (and maybe producing - no too old for that) something that could wear your description.

 

[Graham_Wright]

Moral of the story -- Yup- you do need a spare halyard

If you only have one and it is a good'un, you can use it to hoist a block with a becket. Run one line from the becket (in my case the static line) and run another over the sheave. Two for the price of one. There is an obvious lack of redundancy and safety implications.

 

[Graham_Wright]

because ascenders are too viscious on yachty ropes.

I agree but climbers and Petzl do not. I found a less aggressive device on ebay (after a steer from here), Very clever, very safe and kinder on the rope. I've forgotten the name but will report back. Cheaper than an ascender too.

 

[Graham_Wright]

Just free climb the bugger

We knew a French guy JP who did work on a few yacht in Ragusa some years back and wouldn't use a chain , he just climbed up the mast


Too many justs!

 

[jimi]

I use a climbing harness , shunt & Jumar. If you get the toothless jumar which are smooth amd lock via a camming action then there is no issue with rope wear

 

[capnsensible]

I dont like heights, so the worlds worst boaty job for me is changing standing rigging. No matter how safe you make it, being at the top of the mast and undoing a wire that holds it up does my pulse rate no good whatsoever.......:nonchalance:

 

[KAL]

I'm with Zoidberg and use a full climbing harness. I'm not so keen on a bosuns chain, by itself - you could slip out. I too have a sling that can be put round the mast to secure me to the mast when I work. I have another sling that I use to secure me to something a bit higher, (spreaders, crane) so my weight is not on the halyard.

But I am intrigued - the whole basis of the exercise is that the halyard is considered intrinsically unsafe, hence the safety line. Are there such copious numbers of accidents with halyards, or the attachment of the halyard to the chair, or securement of the halyard at the deck to demand this second halyard - which as the OP implies complicates the whole issue. Climbers use single ropes for climbing, usually, and simply would not consider a second rope. They assume the mate below knows what the procedures are (and often those procedures do not involve any mechanical aids). What is the background to the extra safety on yacht (except that the extra safety is available).

The idea is to provide some redundancy in case of a failure. Depending on one line is fine, as long as it doesn’t fail! Climbers tend to use not one thick rope but two smaller gauge ropes, putting in independent protection for each (using cams or nuts for instance) as they go.

Because, as an ex-climber, I know what it is like to experience a fall, I always have someone on deck tailing an independent safety line while i climb on a taut rope (using one of Graham’s excellent Masta-climbas. I also carry at least one jumar so I can secure myself if needed, and often have a Petzl stop descendeur so I can lower myself if I have to. That said, I don’t enjoy heights and so I’m quite anal about my safety and always wear a proper climbing harness.

 

[lw395]

Would you care to elucidate? My chair is ok to sit on but, if I stand, it slides up my backside and the crutch straps - er - clutch.. I've been thinking about designing (and maybe producing - no too old for that) something that could wear your description.

I was just referring to the normal fabric 'sit in' chair. It's not really like a 'nappy' trapeze harness.
I'd say get a climbing harness.

 

[Neeves]

My comment on safety lines was a serious one -

How many have had an all cordage halyard fail? Of the thousands who are up masts how many are actually injured, or killed, because of a failure of the halyard and-or how many have been saved by the safety line? and then compare these numbers with other causes of accidents up masts

But the one lesson that is rammed home is

Use a safety line

Halyards are contained in the mast, and therefore unseen - but only unseen if you never raise the sails - most of the halyard is seen every time the sails are used - and surely people notice if they are worn. Halyards are grossly over strength, on most yachts - why would they fail, more frequently than other causes of injury from mast work.

Yet as far as I can ascertain, even from the responses here - most accidents have other causes, not the halyard. Historically halyards may have been questionable (I have had wire halyards fail (and would never use them again) - but today its poor practice by the person up the mast or the person managing the lift.

I'd suggest the focus is wrong (not knocking a safety line - they are there so use them) simply there are maybe, much, greater risks. Some of which have surfaced here - but how many of them are known to 'all and sundry'.

If you use a height safety harness - it is made to a defined specification (and bosuns chairs?? - used in exactly the same way - in fact possibly used in a much less safe environment, the yacht might be afloat subject to wash etc (or swell). How many retire their bosuns chair through age, or exposure to UV - you would retire a safety tether. How many wear a safety helmet up a mast? How many have a safety helmet on their yacht (The Clipper Fleet have 2 helmets - they use them for someone who goes into he sea to aid an MOB - and for mast work).

Jonathan

 

[sailaboutvic]

I have to hold my hand up , I don't have an hard hat , it would come on very handy when walking into our. Berth , I for ever hitting my head . What working lately is a mossy net , now I remember to bend my head as I move the net ,

 

[rogerthebodger]

2 thoughts.

I have considered getting a cyclist helmet for when I dive under my boat to clean the prop or check a fitting.

Also I have also consider getting a hard hat / cyclist helmet for the winch wench at the bottom of my mast incase I drop an ithe from height. I keep and telling my winch wench to move away when I an using tools but she prefers to hug the mast to keep it upright !!!.

I have never considered using one up the mast.

 

[Kukri]

I have to hold my hand up , I don't have an hard hat , it would come on very handy when walking into our. Berth , I for ever hitting my head . What working lately is a mossy net , now I remember to bend my head as I move the net ,

I keep a hard hat, safety boots, boiler suit, 270N lifejacket and high vis jacket in the boot of my car - the standard ship jumper's kit, as my job involves going on board merchant ships at short notice. I've never thought of using any of them on a boat.

 

[zoidberg]

Just to throw another ball in the air....

Conventional wisdom has it that one should NOT use a snapshackle, or even a captive pin halyard shackle, in any 'going up the mast' evolutions. In fact, manufacturers specifically warn against using their products for such, unless specifically manufactured/tested/certificated for 'fall arrest'. I buy into that.

That leaves us with tying on using knots.

Like others here, I've been doing that a very long time, and my flabby li'l pink bod trusts my knot-tying to keep it intact. Further - and again, others here will have done the same. Think climbing, parachuting sport and pro, caving, diving, flying, S&R helos - I was part of a culture ( er, more than one ) where we watched like a hawk what our buddies were doing with knots, ropes, attachment devices.... we MONITORED intensely, 'cos once in a blue moon there is a mistake, a problem, a 'something overlooked'. It's the 'buddy-buddy' system, which is intended to catch the 'once in a blue moon mishtook'.....

Now I have a sailing buddy who can't tie knots for toffee. He simply can't get his head around what goes where, and what it looks like when it's right. I've watched him, time and again, tying a bowline. Every attempt is different, and not one of the efforts results in a knot ( or 'bend') that is secure. He simply cannot see it. But.... he thinks it's sorted.

We've all met people who are 'word-blind'/dyslexic, or even 'numbers-confused'/dyscalculia - and many of those have strongly-structured coping mechanisms which hide the fact from the world at large and, after a while, from themselves. There's a known issue in flight, and other, safety regimes where a subject 'sees what his brain expects to see'..... 'Three green lights' when there isn't.

So I would modestly suggest that, aware of these difficulties we adopt a 'skeptical' approach to inspections of our own and our buddy's arrangements.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I keep a hard hat, safety boots, boiler suit, 270N lifejacket and high vis jacket in the boot of my car - the standard ship jumper's kit, as my job involves going on board merchant ships at short notice. 've never thought of using any of them on a boat.

That's a bit silly , the hard hat for going up the mast , boiler suite to wear incase you spell fuel on your nice posh sailing clothes while filling up , the boots would come in handy when you gone aground and having to walk to the pub while waiting for the next tide, the vis jacket you could wear while swimming at night so you can been seen in the dark . ok maybe I have gone over the top . Just on my third beer .

 

[sailaboutvic]

Just to throw another ball in the air....

Conventional wisdom has it that one should NOT use a snapshackle, or even a captive pin halyard shackle, in any 'going up the mast' evolutions. In fact, manufacturers specifically warn against using their products for such, unless specifically manufactured/tested/certificated for 'fall arrest'. I buy into that.

That leaves us with tying on using knots.

Like others here, I've been doing that a very long time, and my flabby li'l pink bod trusts my knot-tying to keep it intact. Further - and again, others here will have done the same. Think climbing, parachuting sport and pro, caving, diving, flying, S&R helos - I was part of a culture ( er, more than one ) where we watched like a hawk what our buddies were doing with knots, ropes, attachment devices.... we MONITORED intensely, 'cos once in a blue moon there is a mistake, a problem, a 'something overlooked'. It's the 'buddy-buddy' system, which is intended to catch the 'once in a blue moon mishtook'.....

Now I have a sailing buddy who can't tie knots for toffee. He simply can't get his head around what goes where, and what it looks like when it's right. I've watched him, time and again, tying a bowline. Every attempt is different, and not one of the efforts results in a knot ( or 'bend') that is secure. He simply cannot see it. But.... he thinks it's sorted.

We've all met people who are 'word-blind'/dyslexic, or even 'numbers-confused'/dyscalculia - and many of those have strongly-structured coping mechanisms which hide the fact from the world at large and, after a while, from themselves. There's a known issue in flight, and other, safety regimes where a subject 'sees what his brain expects to see'..... 'Three green lights' when there isn't.

So I would modestly suggest that, aware of these difficulties we adopt a 'skeptical' approach to inspections of our own and our buddy's arrangements.

I think the problem with your buddy is trying to work out what bloody hole does that rabbit go through

 

[rogerthebodger]

I think the problem with your buddy is trying to work out what bloody hole does that rabbit go through

More like which tree to go round or to relieve yourself up against after a few beers.

 

[Kukri]

This is not intended as a silly answer: Would he do better learning to tie a bowline behind his back?

Muscle memory can do the trick if his eyes are regularly deceiving him. Once he has it he won't forget it.

 

[Jamesuk]

Electric? Dodgy and frowned upon for obvious safety reasons. Too many accidents.

I disagree - Electric is awesome, it's like having a proper bow thruster when you go to park up.

"Electric?" ........ You could say the same thing about anything if used incorrectly. Count how many idiots driving south bound on the M5 today that were all so close they may as well have been a train pulling a bunch of carriages - oh four idiots crashed on M5 Southbound near Cribbs causeway today. Perhaps those drivers should be banned for obvious safety reasons - They all managed to crash into each other - with any luck they are all driving the latest cars and we hope they are all well and taking care of.

1206 today
"But traffic is 'very slow' after four vehicle crash
There is very slow traffic due to the crash, now on the hard shoulder on M5 from junction 18a (Cribbs Causeway) to junctions 18,18A M49
Four vehicles were involved."

Oh if you have perfect vision when driving at 60mph you should not be able to read the numberplate on the car in front. Top tip!

Moan of the month post.

 

[Neeves]

I keep a hard hat, safety boots, boiler suit, 270N lifejacket and high vis jacket in the boot of my car - the standard ship jumper's kit, as my job involves going on board merchant ships at short notice. I've never thought of using any of them on a boat.

And I've taken to wearing a high vis windproof when I transit from shore to yacht through the other moored yachts. I'm visible to all and sundry. I know most here will wear foul weather gear - but wearing a jacket designed for the Atlantic is plain daft here, where it neither seems to rain any more and in the summer temps are in the 30's.

I think a cycle helmet would be fine (and better than nothing) but being up a mast on a yacht at sea is a slightly different proposition to being up a mast in the relatively sheltered confines of 'smooth' water. Obviously if you think you will never need to climb the mast at sea...? but when up the mast at sea you DO need to secure your self to the mast to stop being flung hither and tither.

Jonathan

 

[sailaboutvic]

but when up the mast at sea you DO need to secure your self to the mast to stop being flung hither and tither.

Jonathan

now there a point that I don't think as been mentioned, good point Jonathan ,
yes best to put a strap round you and the mast to hold you in place unless your just going up to collect a halyard .