ashtead
Well-Known Member
When you reach such senior years you might be tempted by a Sirius or a Southerly.
What boat now?
- Thread starter boatmike
- Start date
boatmike
Well-Known Member
Thanks T ! Fed up with people writing me off at 78. I think being sensible one has to be aware of limitations but i am tremendously lucky to be fit and healthy still and not overweight which helps. I have always lived by the maxim "If you don't use it you loose it" but wifey has had several back operations so we need to be careful we don't ask too much of her. The only reservation I really have about boats like the Moody 346 or Westerly Oceanquest is getting on and off them which is not as easy as the Mobo. I can also park the Aquastar on a sixpence on my own with twin screw and bowthruster which does not leave crew much to do. I would LOVE to get back to sailing but need to recognise that I am effectively single handed most of the time is all..........
Kinsale373
Well-Known Member
Ease of Boarding is generally not high on the prioity list, I think that this is a mistake. As we move on and if you want to keep your partner on board its becomes more important ! A club member had a nasty fall recently trying to disembark on a pontoon. I'm delighted with the opening rear transom gate on our Bene 373. I'm not suggesting the Bene 373 although I think they hit the spot as a safe comfortable crusing boat, but its probably bigger that what you want. If you can moor, stern too, on a Pontoon , I think that an opening stern gate is a big advantage and often overlooked. Other than that , decent winches, a Good Autopilot , A reefing system that works well. I'd love a self tacking Jib!
Kinsale 373
Kinsale 373
Wansworth
Well-Known Member
The nature of modern boat interiors having to look like in town flats creates high topsides.The traditional deck house with high bulwarks and a gate would allow almost walk on facility
Snowgoose-1
Well-Known Member
We now have new knees, new hips etc .rejoice halayoula! Just buy whatever you need I.e bow thrusters, remote control powered winch .the children will agree and still love you.
ryanroberts
Well-Known Member
I saw a guy come into Brixham solo in a Vancouver from Famouth in his mid 80s and have a mobility scooter delivered to the pontoon, rather impressive.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
He calls me "young man" because I am "only" 75! and my hair is not as white as his.
I bought my current boat when I was coming up to 70 with a view to keeping it at least 10 years and expecting to sail largely on my own. I found with my previous boat the biggest constraints to using it was getting in and out of the berth and handling the rig - big genoa, winches too far forward from the wheel and mainsheet on the coachroof. It did have in mast which helped. OK once out at sea, but a bit of a handful sailing in Poole Harbour so mostly motored until outside, which is OK for longer passages, but not for the odd day sail.
I was fortunate in that I could afford a new boat and I found 3 in the +/- 10m range, Jeanneau 32i, Hanse 325 and Bavaria 33. All have fractional rigs with small headsails and big mains, could be had with in mast, and for the Hanse a self tacking jib. The Bavaria won because it ticked more boxes, particularly being able to move easily around the cockpit and the mainsheet and winches are easily reached from behind the wheel. Accommodation was better, both space and finish. Bow thruster and electric windlass aid berthing and anchoring. Only real negative from the boat handling point of view is the lower shrouds cut across the side decks. I reverse into my berth and although the topsides are high, there is a guard wire gate alongside the cockpit. It has a drop down transom platform for easy boarding over the stern.
You can find many of these features on late 90s early 2000s AWBs in the 32-36' range. This was the golden age of new boat sales so in theory lots of them to choose from, although as you will find there is a huge shortage of boats at the moment except for dogs - and even some of them seem to sell. Being 20 or so years younger than the two boats you mentioned you stand a better chance of getting modern kit and systems that have not been "improved" by previous owners. The old centre cockpit boats have their place, but for 2 people looking for relaxed coastal cruising and good on board living facilities AWBs are in my view much better suited.
WoodyP
Well-Known Member
In 2007 Azab one competitor in his 70's arrived on crutches and still managed to complete, he did sail two handed, unlike another boat, a Rival, that had a crew member with only one hand.
Do what you want until you can't then do what you can. Not time for the zip up slippers yet ?
Do what you want until you can't then do what you can. Not time for the zip up slippers yet ?
boatmike
Well-Known Member
Yes indeed T. I have started to look at boats of this ilk too since this thread started. My plan is to tart up the Aquastar and take advantage of the sellers market if I can this year. If she sells as she should I will look seriously. Ideally I want to find a shoal draft version which is easier with smaller boats too. In terms of availability the present situation is caused by lots of "new" buyers with loadsa money who can't have a holiday abroad and think boat owning is a doddle. Next year we might find a lot of these have either frightened themselves or found out how much work is involved in owning a boat so things may change, especially as they can now go abroad again. we will see...................
boatmike
Well-Known Member
Lots of interesting info on here and its all food for thought. Obviously I take on board the comments about moving around the boat and the jenneau 32 and bavaria 33 have a nice cockpit and getting on and off will be easier and they are modern in style but the Moody 35 and 346 are probably heavier displacement and stiffer (??) Looking for sea kindliness rather than outright performance and would think the jen-bav boats would be lighter and more tender??? Really don't know so comments welcome. Elsewhere there are less than flattering comments regarding the westerly Oceanquest etc and particularly the Riviera in terms of performance. Possibly in terms of the latter cos it's a motorsailer after all.... Possibly the fact that the cockpit is so high would make the mainsail boom higher and account for a little loss of performance when heeled??
Supertramp
Well-Known Member
I can't comment on all the boat's you mention. I think the term "motorsailer" is misleading - it can mean a very slow lump or a yacht with a large engine or wheelhouse etc. With respect to displacement (and associated hull forms) heavier displacement gives a more comfortable ride making moving around and doing jobs easier. I agree that modern rigs and systems make sail handling easier and combined with decent displacement and a sea-kindly hull form makes singlehanding much easier.
I think the other big factor is deck layout. Singlehanding usually means much running around deck and cabin so looking carefully at cockpit layout (can I get out from behind the wheel easily?), can I get below and up quickly and easily, can I get on deck from the cockpit without awkward steps? How will I drop the main or berth in a marina single-handed? What worked well on a racing yacht when I was 30 is not what I look for now!
I chose to sacrifice boat speed for easy, secure handling and a deck layout with few steps and obstructions. The result is a boat which doesn't scare the family, sails fine in F3+ and is fun to singlehand. If it rains I can go below. And as others point out involves maintaining and updating 30yr old kit.... Quite hard to find modern, affordable designs which fit the bill.
But the point is to look at possible boats from the point of view of what is most important to you and your wife.
dunedin
Well-Known Member
I wonder if heavy weather “sea kindliness“ should be a priority? To my mind, with modern weather forecasts and particulalry for somebody who is retired and can choose when to go coastal sailing, you may be more likely to want a boat which can sail enjoyably in F1-F4 (when likely to want to go sailing) rather than ability to bash to windward in a F7 (when will choose to stay in harbour, go golfing or whatever).
PS. Perhaps very different for a younger person restricted to sailing on fixed weekends or prebooked holidays, or planning ocean voyages, but suspect the OP is not in these categories
Tranona
Well-Known Member
The Seahawk is heavier that most other boats of its size because there is a lot of it particularly high up. The Moody sits in the same displacement range as many modern boats of similar size. However displacement is misleading - just because it is heavier does not mean it is "stiffer". The key difference with older designs is that they rely on heavy (and shallow) keels for stability rather than hull form and deeper lighter keels, usually with ballast much lower down. As it happens the design displacement of my Bav 33 is only 200kgs less than the Seahawk (5560 against 5760) and draft the same (1.5m - mine is shallow draft option), but keel at 1550kgs is over 1000kgs less. However my keel is similar chord but has most of the weight in bottom bulb whereas the Seahawk has a keel that is wide at the top and tapered down with most of the weight at the top.
So, modern boats are designed to different principles, but what does that mean for users? Older designs placed more emphasis on weight to provide better performance in heavy weather - they are from an age where sailing was more of a challenging pastime and people sailed in expectation of meeting heavy weather. This is particularly true of British designs because it reflects the more challenging sailing environment around our coasts. The environment has not changed - except that there are more marinas and better forecasts - so why have no boats of that type been built in any volume the last 30 years? Simple. The boats that are built and sold in numbers that dwarf the number of old style boats are very suitable for the job. Generally better built, better equipped, better performers in lighter airs, easier to sail and overall just more easy to live with. As Dunedin says, there is no reason for coastal cruisers to get caught out in bad weather - and even if you do you will never get anywhere near the limit of the boat, even though it may be a bit more uncomfortable than older designs.
When I first got into larger cruising boats over 20 years ago, my dream was just the sort of boat you are considering. However after I had chartered one (a Moody 37) I cooled a bit so the next year I tried a Bavaria 42. What a revelation. I can understand the appeal of the Moody and similar boats if you are a liveaboard or long distance cruiser - but for weekend and holiday coastal cruising not a patch on the Bavaria. 20 years on and the difference is even more stark, because I simply could not do what I now do sailingwise in a boat like a Seahawk or a 346. They are just mis matched to the requirements of the job.
With your budget of £50k you should be able to get an early 2000s 34-36 boat fully equipped in tip top condition. Most boats of that era when bought new came with factory fitted gear to a much higher level than older boats, partly because the basic boat cost was low and lots of extras boxes to tick. Most of this gear will be still functional and come from major suppliers such as Raymarine, Lewmar Selden etc. In my experience few have needed owner "improvements" whereas as 30 year old boats will have had rewires, engine replacements, upgrades etc of variable quality.
The obvious way of finding out whether a modern boat would suit is to do what I did - charter one for a week. Probably this is the last boat you will buy so important to get it right!
