Westerly Oceanmaster 48 (1990) - ADVICE NEEDED

rodsuter

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It looks like I was sold a real pup - the engine now needs to be removed for a thorough overhaul following oil pressure failure.
It looks as if the boat was built around the engine - does anyone out there know if the engine can be removed without major surgery to the topsides on the cockpit floor ?
 

Tranona

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Suggest you post on the WOA site. It is a relatively rare boat and you are more likely to find somebody with experience there.
 

Talulah

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It looks like I was sold a real pup - the engine now needs to be removed for a thorough overhaul following oil pressure failure.
It looks as if the boat was built around the engine - does anyone out there know if the engine can be removed without major surgery to the topsides on the cockpit floor ?

I have a feeling it comes out through the saloon but be prepared to remove major components inc sump.
Personally I wouldn't spend any money on it but go straight for a replacement.
 

Heckler

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It looks like I was sold a real pup - the engine now needs to be removed for a thorough overhaul following oil pressure failure.
It looks as if the boat was built around the engine - does anyone out there know if the engine can be removed without major surgery to the topsides on the cockpit floor ?
MD22?
You dont have to take it out in one piece you know. Take the intercooler off for a start, makes the lump smaller, the gearbox is easy enough to take off. Take the head off if necessary. Then employ a big chap!
Stu
TAMD22 80hp? Basically the same size wise. Good engine, rebuild kits available for £400, pistons, big end shells etc.
http://www.parts4engines.com/perkins-prima-m50-m60-m80t/
 
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Talulah

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I'm guessing Perkins Prima M80T
Rebadged by Volvo as TMD22
You could before you do anything else get an oil analysis done.
 
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laika

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As Tranona said, there's not so many oceanmasters. 24 built but I note only 3 "OM" sail numbers in the 2015 WOA yearbook so I wouldn't guarantee replies on the WOA forum from people who have been hands-on with re-engineing one.

I've personally not seen inside one. On the (also Dubois designed) oceanlord the engine comes out by removing the surround from the access under the companionway steps, i.e. through the saloon (as Talulah noted) then out the companionway.

If the fuel tank is in a similar position on the Oceanmaster to what it is on the Oceanlord, take the opportunity to replace it if there's any crud in the bottom. Much more practical with the engine out than with it in.
 

rodsuter

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Thanks for the inputs from everyone at YBW. No inputs received from WOA.

It appears as if the least-hassle option is to remove the fridge plant and bulkhead, partially dissemble the engine and take it out through the saloon - but still a painful exersize.

Currently negotiating with the marina workshop to try and do it in place. There is an existing lifting arrangement, with an access hole in the cockpit floor, to allow the engine to attach to the boom or a crane, and then lifting it up by about 18". The engine room is "relatively" big, so might just be possible.
 

Bobc

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Just make absolutely sure that it's necessary before you let them start taking your boat apart. Those engines are pretty bullet-proof and run for 10,000 hours+
 

Mrnotming

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It looks like I was sold a real pup - the engine now needs to be removed for a thorough overhaul following oil pressure failure.
It looks as if the boat was built around the engine - does anyone out there know if the engine can be removed without major surgery to the topsides on the cockpit floor ?

how is the oil pressure measured?
Has the sender been checked or the gauge?
What are the symptoms?
Was the boat lying up for any length of time ?
Like health,get a second opinion esp when the boat is new to you!
 

ganter

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Just make absolutely sure that it's necessary before you let them start taking your boat apart. Those engines are pretty bullet-proof and run for 10,000 hours+

I'll second that.

Oil pressure problems rarely require engine removal to fix. I'd get a second opinion and get that second opinion from someone ABSOLUTELY unconnected with the yard, marina, situation you are in.
And if you can start it up and it's not blowing smoke like a convoy Destroyer then your oil pressure problems are probably quite minor and to do with hoses and plugs - neither of which would require engine removal.
Good luck.
 
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Iliade

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Oil pressure relief valve failed - often a trivial repair
Oil pump failed - fairly catastrophic, but may be accessible without engine removal.
Big end bearing failed - may be possible to repair in-situ.
Secondary damage could be catastrophic if pressure fell much too low - do not run motor unnecessarily


Definitely get a second opinion.
 

Bobc

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You can do the oil pump on Primas with the engine in situ.
 

Heckler

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y
how is the oil pressure measured?
Has the sender been checked or the gauge?
What are the symptoms?
Was the boat lying up for any length of time ?
Like health,get a second opinion esp when the boat is new to you!
Second that, we dont know enough at the mo. First principles, check the data! Is it really lo oil pressure? Then why is it? Is the engine knocking? If not, cheaper to fix.
S
 

rodsuter

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To close this one :

Thanks for all the inputs and advice, was really worthwhile.

With a newly stiffened backbone, confronted the Marina techs and insisted on a proper in-place review/test before embarking on anything radical.

And ...... we found that the small (4mm?) pipe between the oil pump and the turbocharger had previously not been secured properly, had been vibrating with the engine, and had now cracked, leaking a lot of oil under pressure. Unfortunately the turbocharger had been starved of oil, and had seized. The pipe is almost impossible to access or even see, and is at the rear of the engine against the bulkhead - luckily the Marina tech department had a small skinny apprentice whose arm could fit between the engine and the bulkhead:) .

With this reprieve, hopefully we will be on the move again soon.
 

KAL

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Brilliant to hear Rod. You have a magnificent yacht. Enjoy her. I would strongly advocate joining WOA as well. For £15/year the benefits are certainly worthwhile.

K
 

Heckler

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l
To close this one :

Thanks for all the inputs and advice, was really worthwhile.

With a newly stiffened backbone, confronted the Marina techs and insisted on a proper in-place review/test before embarking on anything radical.

And ...... we found that the small (4mm?) pipe between the oil pump and the turbocharger had previously not been secured properly, had been vibrating with the engine, and had now cracked, leaking a lot of oil under pressure. Unfortunately the turbocharger had been starved of oil, and had seized. The pipe is almost impossible to access or even see, and is at the rear of the engine against the bulkhead - luckily the Marina tech department had a small skinny apprentice whose arm could fit between the engine and the bulkhead:) .

With this reprieve, hopefully we will be on the move again soon.
Before you bin the turbo, they seize from carbon build up, so not necessarily seized from lack of oil. The engine still runs, albeit putting out less power and using a lot more fuel.
Take the turbo off, its quite simple, only a few bolts, take the outlet bit off and you can get at the impellor.
Carefully!! scrape off the old carbon and squirt freeing oil in to the oil gallery etc. Wiggle and turn until its free. Use a brass wire wheel in a Dremel if necessary. The turbos are quite robust.
S
 

Stemar

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l
Before you bin the turbo, they seize from carbon build up, so not necessarily seized from lack of oil. The engine still runs, albeit putting out less power and using a lot more fuel.
Take the turbo off, its quite simple, only a few bolts, take the outlet bit off and you can get at the impellor.
Carefully!! scrape off the old carbon and squirt freeing oil in to the oil gallery etc. Wiggle and turn until its free. Use a brass wire wheel in a Dremel if necessary. The turbos are quite robust.
S

Even if bearings have seized, a refurb may well be possible. It's only really a bin job if the turbine has taken lumps out of the casing or vice-versa. Even then, talk to rebuild specialists. A few years ago I was able to get a recon turbo for a Golf diesel for about £300 (be more now :( ) rather than the myowalletal infarction of the new VW part
 

rodsuter

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I have a spare turbo if required.

Thanks anyway Bob - I had to sort it with a new one - couldn't wait around, my cruising time was disappearing and the Admiral was getting impatient.

All the best.
 
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