Volvo Penta 2000 series owners take a note.

[Billba]

It is well known by long term owners, and as has been discussed here recently the warning lights and horn on these models are slightly unusual in that on switch on the 3 lights should be illuminated and the horn stays silent unless the test button is depressed. On a recent cruise (I would guess probably for 10 or more starts) I was aware that on switch on I could just hear the faintest of horn sounds before a press of the starter and all became normal. Then annoyingly prior to the last leg home it all changed. On switch on the horn sounded at full volume the oil light was brightly on and the engine would not crank. I thought I had checked all the connections both behind the control panel and all around the engine when I resorted to a trip to the engineers but unsurprisingly Bastille day celebrations meant no one was available. I then resorted to this forum convinced I had read of a similar situation but could not for the life of me find it or remember the solution. I attempted to post a request for help but apparently after the recent upgrade Internet Explorer 8 refuses to allow posts so I resorted to Vyv Cox's site and e-mailed him for help on the off chance he was on line. Imagine my surprise and relief when almost immediately a response with the suggestion of at least a jump start direct from the battery to the starter relay (it's the bottom nut with a rubber cover on it that your aiming for). This concurred with the advice from a friend with whom I had been discussing as well so a trip to the chandler a metre and a bit of thinnish battery cable and the engine was running. I could then immediately see that the tacho was still at zero and with the engine switched off found the culprit. There is a 5mm earthing cable around 20cm long connecting the rear of the alternator to the top bolt of the forward starboard engine mount where it is bolted to the engine block and it was hanging loose. Mine was black with some overspray of Volvo green on it which explains why I had not noticed it in my search for a fault. Not long afterwards I was back fully commissioned ready for the next day departure. So all I am saying is after 20 odd years of engine vibrations on your 5mm multi-strand cable it could like mine be about to break and most likely do it at the most inconvenient time. Have a quick check and if ever you hear that faint beep prior to start have a closer look. If you ever get a full horn and the middle oil light bright with no cranking you can do straight to it to replace it or reconnect. A big thank you again to Vyv Cox and happy sailing to one and all. Cheers Billba

 

[Mark Turner]

It is well known by long term owners, and as has been discussed here recently the warning lights and horn on these models are slightly unusual in that on switch on the 3 lights should be illuminated and the horn stays silent unless the test button is depressed. On a recent cruise (I would guess probably for 10 or more starts) I was aware that on switch on I could just hear the faintest of horn sounds before a press of the starter and all became normal. Then annoyingly prior to the last leg home it all changed. On switch on the horn sounded at full volume the oil light was brightly on and the engine would not crank. I thought I had checked all the connections both behind the control panel and all around the engine when I resorted to a trip to the engineers but unsurprisingly Bastille day celebrations meant no one was available. I then resorted to this forum convinced I had read of a similar situation but could not for the life of me find it or remember the solution. I attempted to post a request for help but apparently after the recent upgrade Internet Explorer 8 refuses to allow posts so I resorted to Vyv Cox's site and e-mailed him for help on the off chance he was on line. Imagine my surprise and relief when almost immediately a response with the suggestion of at least a jump start direct from the battery to the starter relay (it's the bottom nut with a rubber cover on it that your aiming for). This concurred with the advice from a friend with whom I had been discussing as well so a trip to the chandler a metre and a bit of thinnish battery cable and the engine was running. I could then immediately see that the tacho was still at zero and with the engine switched off found the culprit. There is a 5mm earthing cable around 20cm long connecting the rear of the alternator to the top bolt of the forward starboard engine mount where it is bolted to the engine block and it was hanging loose. Mine was black with some overspray of Volvo green on it which explains why I had not noticed it in my search for a fault. Not long afterwards I was back fully commissioned ready for the next day departure. So all I am saying is after 20 odd years of engine vibrations on your 5mm multi-strand cable it could like mine be about to break and most likely do it at the most inconvenient time. Have a quick check and if ever you hear that faint beep prior to start have a closer look. If you ever get a full horn and the middle oil light bright with no cranking you can do straight to it to replace it or reconnect. A big thank you again to Vyv Cox and happy sailing to one and all. Cheers Billba

Billba

Thanks for taking the trouble to post this - its worth me printing it out and putting with my engine manual on board, because if not, if it happens to me all I'll have at best is a vague recollection that I once read something about it somewhere....

 

[DJE]

Must have a close look at mine this weekend. I've been getting the faint beep on switching on since I've had the boat. And on the one occasion when I needed the alarms (a broken belt) they didn't sound. Luckily SHMBO noticed the change in engine note!

Thanks for the post.

 

[RIBW]

On switch on the horn sounded at full volume the oil light was brightly on and the engine would not crank.

Billba, Thanks for the informative posting. It has had me thinking for about an hour!

I understood the bit about the alarms - assuming that the power for the sounder was going to the sounder from the battery through the alternator (B+ to 63, I guess).
It took a while for the penny to drop on why the starter would not work though, until I realised the starter relay circuit is connected to 0V via the (missing) alternator connection, not idependently.

Finally, brain engaged and I remembered being shown how to jump start an engine by forcing a large Mole wrench across the starter terminals you mentioned - quite spectacular but effective!

Thanks again
Bob

 

[pvb]

I don't think this earthing cable is fitted to all 2000-series engines. Most alternators will earth through the mounting bracket.

 

[Billba]

PVB....... I assume you have good reason for your 'thoughts' on the existence of this cable and opinion on how most alternators find an earth. But if anyone have the symptoms I described it would be advisable to follow my recommendations.

DJE....... My early symptoms were specifically just on switch on prior to pressing start button. In normal operation my set up always gives a brief squeak after I've pressed start and the engine fires. There is the briefest of delays between the sensors becoming active and the oil pressure building above the minimum.

RIBW......The jump start I performed was between the positive terminal of my no 1 cranking battery and the lower terminal of the relay (above the starter motor) using the metre or so of cable. Perhaps I missed a trick by not using a mole wrench or similar across the relay itself.

Cheers Billba

 

[pvb]

PVB....... I assume you have good reason for your 'thoughts' on the existence of this cable and opinion on how most alternators find an earth.

Certainly have! The wire is shown in the workshop manual wiring diagram for the version with the de luxe instrument option, but isn't shown in the wiring diagram for the standard version. And I don't remember seeing the wire you describe on my old 2003T, but then I only had it for 19 years so may not have noticed it.

 

[vyv_cox]

......The jump start I performed was between the positive terminal of my no 1 cranking battery and the lower terminal of the relay (above the starter motor) using the metre or so of cable. Perhaps I missed a trick by not using a mole wrench or similar across the relay itself.

I first developed this technique as the owner of an air-cooled VW van. They are notorious for developing occasional starter faults due to the long wiring run, with several connectors, between the battery in the back, through to the switch in the cab, then back to the starter motor. On that vehicle it was possible to bridge the live heavy cable on the starter motor and the solenoid terminal, using a screwdriver, which would always start it. Unfortunately it was necessary to be lying on my back beneath the vehicle with legs out to the centre of the road, not always convenient(!). Later I ran a wire from the starter motor solenoid into the engine compartment, which I could touch on the battery positive when needed.

 

[RIBW]

View attachment 44688

I don't think this earthing cable is fitted to all 2000-series engines. Most alternators will earth through the mounting bracket.

I have a spare 2003 in the garage so I thought a photo of said wire might(?) help clarify the situation for anyone reading that does have the wire.

Cheers
Bob

 

[Billba]

Thanks RIBW that's the one that separated at the crimp which makes the join to the engine mount. With access to the forward end of the engine you will need to focus a torch from low down directed behind the fan belt where a judicious waggle of the connection should establish it's condition. I would expect one that has some of the multi strands already separated would have a crunchy feel to it.

PVB.....Yes I see your point regarding the two wiring diagrams in the workshop manual and also have a feeling that on one 2001 (I saw a picture of) the wire in question was connected to the block at the point where the larger battery earth is connected. I guess it may reflect different batches that left the factory or how the installers modified things to suit their situation. In my case it is exactly as shown in the photo RIBW has kindly taken and confirming I have the 'basic' control panel.

Cheers Billba

 

[the_branflake]

Thanks for the Info Billba will take a look on mine. I must say like pvb i've not noticed this cable so far - Could i ask if you have a sail drive or not?? I'm wondering if the earthing is different due to that.

I sometimes get a faint buzz/beep when stopping in the time it takes to pull the stop and then get inside to switch off at the panel.

 

[Billba]

Mine is a shaft drive the_branflake. Do let us know if you find the cable when you get to looking.

I'm pretty sure the buzz/beep you get on stopping is perfectly normal. My pull to stop is close to the switch panel so rarely has time to sound before I have switched off. I think it would be true to say that if ever you do NOT get a beep on shut down if left live for 4 or 5 seconds then you may wish to investigate your oil pressure sender. The press to test button will only be checking for continuity not simulating a low pressure condition (function check).

Cheers... Billba

 

[scottie]

From memory there were three versions of earthing on 2000 series
Earth return through the block
Totally isolated return
(******ised )semi isolated that used solenoids to earth the starter when an isolated starter is used on an earth return engine
Throw in at least 2 totally different stater motors
So nothing is straight forward
Best to check which form you have first

There is a lot of discussion on the forums regarding insulation and stray currents regarding this series of engines