Vetus engines

[Bellacruiser]

Any thoughts on these (good/bad/indifferent)?

We are in the midst of our search for a boat, identified our preferred model which all rolled out of production with Volvos or Yanmars (all sail drive as we understand). Then we hit a curveball, where we have found one of this model that has had its engine replaced with a 42hp Vetus (direct drive) with 1400 hours on it, that was fitted in 2014 (awaiting confirmation on model number from the broker). This is in a 38ft AWB. The boat is well equipped and well priced but now all of a sudden we aren't comparing apples with apples (rather, apples with lemons given the bright yellow of a Vetus!)

Read some bits online re starboard access, availability of parts etc but wondered if anyone has any views here?

 

[DownWest]

Any thoughts on these (good/bad/indifferent)?

We are in the midst of our search for a boat, identified our preferred model which all rolled out of production with Volvos or Yanmars (all sail drive as we understand). Then we hit a curveball, where we have found one of this model that has had its engine replaced with a 42hp Vetus (direct drive) with 1400 hours on it, that was fitted in 2014 (awaiting confirmation on model number from the broker). This is in a 38ft AWB. The boat is well equipped and well priced but now all of a sudden we aren't comparing apples with apples (rather, apples with lemons given the bright yellow of a Vetus!)

Read some bits online re starboard access, availability of parts etc but wondered if anyone has any views here?

Mitsubishi based, pretty reliable and you can find the routine spares anywhere from tractor sources.
These engines are used in plant machinery and last for thousends of hours if looked after.

 

[Bellacruiser]

Thanks, that's helpful. I had read that they try obfuscate part numbers to make it hard(er) to crossmatch with the Mitsubishi parts, but presenting said part in a tractor parts supplier would usually get a match!

We'd likely be keeping the boat where it is (Croatia) for two seasons then a sabbatical covering the Eastern med...compared to Volvo etc I'm sure parts are not as freely sourced so we'd just carry a good bank of the most likely to be needed (as for mail order to the UK they are easy enough to get)

 

[JumbleDuck]

Any thoughts on these (good/bad/indifferent)?

I would have liked to fit one, but they were too wide for my engine space. Craftsman, also in the Netherlands, marinise the same Mitsubishi engines.

 

[Graham376]

Thanks, that's helpful. I had read that they try obfuscate part numbers to make it hard(er) to crossmatch with the Mitsubishi parts, but presenting said part in a tractor parts supplier would usually get a match!

Our 43hp is based on a Mitsubishi S4L, the previous 35hp was a K4D. Diamond Diesels are the UK Mitsubshi engine importers with spares (including some second hand) readily available. Engine type no's are in the steel castings.

 

[Moonbeam]

Check this thread out (we had the same problem on a Vetus M3.09)

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?356470-Vetus-Starting-problem

We also had a failed heat exchanger that needed the entire assembly replacing. The engine was 8 years old and 500 hours. That cost nearly £700 for the part alone.

The Mitsubishi block seemed good, but not convinced of Vetus marinization.... the impeller was a pain to get at... they might have improved the designs since then (our model was from 2003)

 

[chubby]

I have a vetus 42 hp M1.7 in a heavy 32 ft motorsailor , had it for about 15 years, 2500 hours and all pleased, it was a reengine for a mercedees OM636 and happened to fit in the space well. No issues and access depends on installation.

 

[Richard10002]

I've got a 4.14 on my narrowboat. Fitted in 2000 approx.. Done about 3000 hours. Starts easy, runs fine. No issues whatsoever!!

 

[Bellacruiser]

Thanks to all for comments, much appreciated. We’re still awaiting the model number but know it was new in 2013/14. All in all we’re not put off viewing the boat if it’s still on the market when we head to Croatia in 4 weeks

 

[Baggywrinkle]

We'd likely be keeping the boat where it is (Croatia) for two seasons then a sabbatical covering the Eastern med...

Not engine related, but it might be worth holding off on a Croatian purchase until Brexit has happened ... then you might well be able to buy VAT free as a non-EU citizen. Keeping the boat in Croatia VAT free under temprary import is also pretty straightforward - I did it before Croatia joined the EU - saves quite a bit of cash.

On the sabatical .... if you are a non-EU citizen you may need to vacate the EU for 90 days in every 180 (depending on what any Brexit deal eventually looks like - who knows but something to think about). It's easier in the eastern Med (Turkey/Greece). Get on some of the US/Australian forums to find out details of how to cruise the EU as a "foreigner".

Met some Australians in Croatia who ended up racing against the clock to get out of the EU - they had a cracked mast and it took longer to fix than anticipated.

Have fun.

 

[Bellacruiser]

Not engine related, but it might be worth holding off on a Croatian purchase until Brexit has happened ... then you might well be able to buy VAT free as a non-EU citizen. Keeping the boat in Croatia VAT free under temprary import is also pretty straightforward - I did it before Croatia joined the EU - saves quite a bit of cash.

On the sabatical .... if you are a non-EU citizen you may need to vacate the EU for 90 days in every 180 (depending on what any Brexit deal eventually looks like - who knows but something to think about). It's easier in the eastern Med (Turkey/Greece). Get on some of the US/Australian forums to find out details of how to cruise the EU as a "foreigner".

Met some Australians in Croatia who ended up racing against the clock to get out of the EU - they had a cracked mast and it took longer to fix than anticipated.

Have fun.

Thanks Baggy. This is something we are aware of, but in two minds how to handle. The boat with the Vetus is actually VAT paid (and priced well, even including the VAT ) which would make it moot.

For other boats, we're a little concerned if we have it in Northern Dalmatia, we might be limited in our opportunities to get to Montenegro to "reset" the clock for VAT - hubby's job means we can have plenty of time using the boat but often unpredictable hence every time we got to 12m in EU we'd probably be needing to check out "just in case" and then do TIL again. I wish they would just decide what's happening with Brexit then we would have more certainty! We're also really keen to buy sooner rather than later, for various reasons, including that our time to boat shop next off-season (when boats aren't all on charter) will be very limited and we run the risk of being boat-less for a sabbatical. If we do pay VAT, we're hoping that over the course of ~10-yr ownership we won't feel it so keenly and/or can recover a little of it when we come to sell (to an EU resident!) :ambivalence:

Re Schengen etc, we're happy to do 3m in Turkey/some time in Montenegro and also hopeful by the time that our sabbatical rolls around we may have bilateral agreements with Greece and/or Croatia (or Croatia still won't have joined Schengen; much mooted but Slovenia aren't keen to vote for their joining if I've understand correctly).

What a minefield! If only we could win the lottery

ETA that said, if we leave with a no deal (or no customs union) on 31/10, we could buy (a non-VAT paid) boat in Croatia and stick the cash in an account we don't touch...should the 18m become a problem we could pay VAT then but conversely may never need to...

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Thanks Baggy. This is something we are aware of, but in two minds how to handle. The boat with the Vetus is actually VAT paid (and priced well, even including the VAT ) which would make it moot.

For other boats, we're a little concerned if we have it in Northern Dalmatia, we might be limited in our opportunities to get to Montenegro to "reset" the clock for VAT - hubby's job means we can have plenty of time using the boat but often unpredictable hence every time we got to 12m in EU we'd probably be needing to check out "just in case" and then do TIL again. I wish they would just decide what's happening with Brexit then we would have more certainty! We're also really keen to buy sooner rather than later, for various reasons, including that our time to boat shop next off-season (when boats aren't all on charter) will be very limited and we run the risk of being boat-less for a sabbatical. If we do pay VAT, we're hoping that over the course of ~10-yr ownership we won't feel it so keenly and/or can recover a little of it when we come to sell (to an EU resident!) :ambivalence:

Re Schengen etc, we're happy to do 3m in Turkey/some time in Montenegro and also hopeful by the time that our sabbatical rolls around we may have bilateral agreements with Greece and/or Croatia (or Croatia still won't have joined Schengen; much mooted but Slovenia aren't keen to vote for their joining if I've understand correctly).

What a minefield! If only we could win the lottery

ETA that said, if we leave with a no deal (or no customs union) on 31/10, we could buy (a non-VAT paid) boat in Croatia and stick the cash in an account we don't touch...should the 18m become a problem we could pay VAT then but conversely may never need to...

Don't worry about resetting the 18 month temporary import clock - you don't actually need to visit another country to do it. Checking out through customs and then coming back again after sailing into international waters is all that is technically needed, but in practice we used to just go for a long day-sail out of sight of the customs station - just don't take the p**s and hang around in full view of customs. It is common practice for all non-EU boats in Croatia to do a check out/check in in a 24 hour period and customs are used to it - the reason they don't mind is that a foreign boat berthed in Croatia generates revenue for Croatia with or without VAT and import duty paid. If Croatia started abusing foreign boats, they'd just go to Italy or Greece and Croatia would lose the revenue.

On Croatia and Schengen ...

The European Commission may soon officially announce that Croatia has met all technical criteria for accession to the Schengen Area. According to the Croatian online newspaper vecernji.hr, diplomatic sources have confirmed that the EU Commission will most likely issue an official statement in the second half of September, giving the green light to Croatia to join the Schengen area.

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/croatia-has-met-all-technical-conditions-to-join-schengen/

 

[Bellacruiser]

So we could we get far enough offshore between Italy and Croatia as long as we're not in the narrow top bit of the Adriatic...? e.g. check out at Vis and point offshore/disappear for a few hours and 12NM+?! I've read mixed views on whether harbour authorities want to see proof of entry elsewhere, perhaps varies by country but helpful to hear that the Croatians remain pragmatic about it when balanced with their interests!

Indeed they are pretty much greenlit to have met all technical criteria for Schengen but if I've understood it correctly their admittance then requires a unanimous vote by all other member states, and Slovenia may use it as leverage in a long running dispute concerning some of the Adriatic... https://www.total-slovenia-news.com...schengen-area-presents-a-dilemma-for-slovenia (Slovenia previously held up their bid to join the EU back in 2009 over the same dispute). In any event, over time I wouldn't be surprised to see Croatia grant Brits a 60 or 90 day tourist visa that does not count toward Schengen. Either way, plenty to see and do in Turkey, Montenegro and even perhaps Albania!