Very Pistols

[madge]

It has been suggested that I purchase a second hand Very Pistol to augment hand held flares & etc for offshore sailing. I have been in situations where faster, larger craft have obviously not seen me at night despite my attempts to inform them that they are about to destroy me. I have been able to get out of their way, but it is a worry. What do people think about Very Pistol flares as an option?

 

[ccscott49]

They are a good system, however you will need a firearms certificate to purchase one in UK. Not easy to get in this day and age. I would not be firing them at the ship either!!

 

[Salty John]

I carried one for ten years or so in the US and Caribbean and never had cause to use it, or any other flare for that matter. When I got to UK I was told it needed a firearms certificate so I handed it over to the police for destruction. A powerful light on your mainsail is a better option than firing flares in the circumstances you describe.

 

[TigaWave]

As you mentioned you're thinking of its use for offshore, in my experience when it looks like there may be a ship getting close I'll call them up and have a chat. Its very reassuring and passes the time. In every case they have said words to the effect of ...yep spotted you 2 miles ago, we've altered course by 5-10 degrees would you like us to give you more room? then they go on to say... what are you doing out here in this sort of horrible weather in such a small boat? they've even sent an e-mails back home to say we're still on our way

Not in shipping lanes of course, but it works when there are just the two of you.

I've never come near to thinking about using a light or flare.

 

[cliff]

Despite popular folklore, a permit for a flare gun is straightforward to obtain in the U.K. so the issue of a fac is not an issue although to obtain one for your vessel you need to have a firearms cabinet fitted where the gun must be locked while in port, moored or at anchor. The gun must NEVER be taken off the vessel for any reason, the exception being if you abandon ship you may take it in the liferaft with you.
The main problem in the U.K. is obtaining the shells for it and the cost of them. There are only a handful of places where you can buy the cartridges.
Consider also the burn time between a flare gun shell and a "normal" flare. The flare gun shells burn for around 10 seconds whereas "normal" flares generally burn for a minute or more.
Add to that the hassle going into say France or Spain and having to declare the "firearms".

Better to stick with non-restricted flares and if sailing at night switch oon your deck lights or use a spotlight to illuminate youe sails or signal the other vessel.

Fitting a good radar reflector is also a good idea.
----------

“Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity”
Skype id:cliffillupo

 

[ccscott49]

You mean you do not need a FAC? Or you do and it's straight forward? because getting a firearms certificate is anything but straight forward.

 

[bobgosling]

I think you will find you need a Shotgun certificate rather than a Firearms certificate. Very pistols are smoothbore, not rifled, so are designated as shotguns. Shotgun certificates are currently treated slightly differently than Firearms certificates. You have a legal right to own a shotgun and the police must prove you to be unsuitable before denying one whereas it is the other way around for firearms - you must prove need and suitability before they will grant a license. In the case of shotguns you "should" store them in a steel box but with firearms you "must". Not sure what they do about the barrel length being less than 21" though !

A moot point anyway as flares are much better for the job.

Regarding going foreign with one - most EU countries have much more liberal firearms regulations than the UK. If you are legal in the UK you will undoubtably be legal in the rest of the EU. There is a EU shotgun certificate which you are automatically entitled to if you possess a UK certificate.

 

[Mirelle]

Hand held white flares

I have used these (to the dismay of other forumites, when this last came up)

The burn time is much longer than a Very shell. I would certainly expect a ship to see one - at least, I am here to tell the tale!

Have someone else below, if not singlehanded, as they do wreck your night vision!

 

[ccscott49]

It's a firearm I think, barrel shorter than 26" also I think, because I had to get a firearm certificate for my pair of 25" barreled shotguns. Also the right to have a shotgun? Not sure about that either, may be true, but especially if you live in an inner city and with nowhere to show you are going shooting, ie a farm or somesuch.

 

[snowleopard]

It's a long time since I owned a Verey pistol but at the time I believe it was a 'normal' certificate but the fee was waived as it was classified as a 'distress weapon'. I had to show a locked box fixed to the fabric of the house but they didn't inspect security on the boat.

To buy ammo you have to take the certificate to the supplier and have the rounds entered on it.

There are (or were) 3 calibres: 1.5", 1" and 12-bore. The large calibres were hard to find but 12 bore are common in the US though might be tricky to get over here.

 

[Jae]

I wouldn't go down the route of Very pistol because of the hassle you will get compared to white flares or white rockets.
Having spent 27 years as deck officer aboard ships all over the world but mainly in the Channel, the best way of getting noticed is to have a good radar reflector, most ships rely on the radar these days. A powerful torch is a very good option. White boats and white sails are a nighmare to see in the daytime, especially when it is slightly misty.

 

[meows]

You definitely need a Firearm Cert. - I had to get one for a Very Pistol I was given a few years ago. My first certificate was not too hard - just as has been said a locked metal box - but my last certificate was much harder to get. You need a 'reponsible' person to verify they consider you are a safe person etc. etc. I doubt if I will bother to renew it next time, far too much trouble. It's obvious the police don't want us to have them and are making it more and more difficult to renew the certificates.
I also agree with every thing else that has bee said about them - too quick, too expensive etc. etc. But they are signal guns and I suppose were never really intended just for emergencies.

 

[Jeannius]

I was in a chandlers in Sint Maarten last year and noticed cheap Very pistols were available. Looked plastic! Interestingly, they also sold 'practice' shells that only burned for 2 seconds. I suspect the real purpose of 'practice' shells are to discourage unwelcome guests.

 

[snowleopard]

I saw them there too. They are 12-guage so very much smaller than the British 1 1/2" ones. I suspect that it would be possible to load other 12 guage ammo if you were that crazy. I imagine US-style gun laws apply over there.

 

[Paragon]

See them, I bought them!

Currently on board in unopened package still in cellophane in grab bag. I guess I really need to sort this little matter out now back in the UK!

 

[Jeannius]

I presume you haven't transported them by air? I'm in Sint Maarten a couple of days week after next on the way to my boat in the BVI. I'd like to get a set but I presume LIAT won't be that happy about transporting them. Any idea?

 

[Plum]

You definitely need a Firearms Certificate in the UK

You definitely need a Firearms Certificate in the UK to purchase/own a Very pistol. An FAC is getting more and more difficult to obtain but if you can fill in a few forms and get a few people to write references for you and supply umpteen signed photographs and are willing to have a policeman/woman visit you at home then you can certainly get one. You have to go through this every five years. Despite what your local police station may say at first, the FAC for safety quipment is free of charge. You can bring the pistol home, but then you need to have an approved gun cabinet in your house. You need to present yourt FAC in order to buy the cartrides in the UK.

 

[Paragon]

No returned with boat back to the UK, wouldn't even consider taking on an aircraft (even if they allowed it!) but will have to have a chat with local police as to what's required.

 

[freeman]

You can buy Very pistols over the counter in France
In the Uk plod will view it as a pistol and you as a potential terrorist and require you to jump through the hoop before issuing a certificate.
Plod has not thought out the practicalities of using it.
non restricted flares are probably less hasstle.

 

[charliespan]

If anyone has got a "recently puchased abroad" very pistol I suggest you lodge it with a registered firearms dealer until you get the fAC sorted out. You will save yourself a world of grief.
Most RFDs I know have a "don't ask, don't tell" agreement with local plod about mysterious late night deposits on their doorsteps. Then, provided you are prepared to go through the aforementioned hoops and limit yourself to just the one "signalling device" you shouldn't have too much trouble.