Vendee Globe and Alex Thomson / Hugo Boss

[Frogmogman]

Hardly surprising really seeing as she lives in France and her partner is French.

In France it is said you need to be a Breton to win this race. The main audience for the race are in France. Her sponsors are French. Hardly surprising that she does most of her content in French.

When you look at the pathways to competing in the Vendée Globe, the main ones are the Mini 650s and the Figaro class. Both very French events, as is the VG. Many of the serious non-French competitors base themselves here, which I believe she has done for quite a while.

Her partner, Romain Attanasio, also competing in this Vendée Globe on Pure - Best Western is a very charming guy.

 

[cherod]

Allez allez Le Cam ??

 

[newtothis]

It really upsets me that Samantha speaks in French in her videos. She has obviously gone native.
I withdraw my support and will slink away into the sunset.

I'd advise against taking up an interest in pro-cycling if you're scared of hearing people with UK passports speaking French.

 

[Wansworth]

Whilst brits where cooking three course Sunday dinners in their westerly centaurs,the French where piling into little plywood boxes and going places....

 

[Kukri]

These boats are in the early stages of development. It may well be that nobody really analysed the forces involved. In the big ship world nobody really calculated the forces on a big ferry’s bow visor before the loss of the “Estonia”; it was just “make it plenty strong”. It turned out that the wave slamming loads on the visor were four times what they had been assumed to be. A lot of people died - nobody has died here, fortunately. I’m assuming the rudder was abandoned fishing gear?

 

[Kukri]

It really upsets me that Samantha speaks in French in her videos. She has obviously gone native.
I withdraw my support and will slink away into the sunset.

If she had really gone native she would be chatting in Breton, and you would need a Welshwoman to translate.

 

[cherod]

These boats are in the early stages of development. It may well be that nobody really analysed the forces involved. In the big ship world nobody really calculated the forces on a big ferry’s bow door before the loss of the “Estonia”; it was just “make it plenty strong”. It turned out that the wave slamming loads on the door were four times what they had been assumed to be. A lot of people died - nobody has died here, fortunately. I’m assuming the rudder was abandoned fishing gear?

more bloody caring consiencous fishermen ,, obv another instance of caring about other people getting cought in their nets .

 

[SimonFa]

I’d be interested to know how many people on this forum have been in the Southern Ocean. I’ll put my hand up as one, but it was on HMS ENDURANCE!

Attached to RM for FI war. Went from Ascension (flew there on a Herc with a couple of members on NP8901 on the flight) to San Carlos on an LSL and back all the way on Fearless. It was long before I got an interest in sailing and all I remember is big waves and boredom . On the way down I had to cross deck by Wasp helicopter to look at some of our Electronic Warfare assets on another LSL. Getting back involved jumping off because it was so rough the pilot didn't want to land!

You should read his book...I don’t think he had any idea who was in the lead and by that point didn’t care.

IIRC he went round again to get to the Pacific Isles, his true love.

 

[Kukri]

more bloody caring consiencous fishermen ,, obv another instance of caring about other people getting cought in their nets .

There are literally thousands of miles of almost indestructible synthetic nets floating in the oceans of the world - and continuing to do what they were made to do, alas.

 

[Tomahawk]

These boats are in the early stages of development. It may well be that nobody really analysed the forces involved. In the big ship world nobody really calculated the forces on a big ferry’s bow door before the loss of the “Estonia”; it was just “make it plenty strong”. It turned out that the wave slamming loads on the door were four times what they had been assumed to be. A lot of people died - nobody has died here, fortunately. I’m assuming the rudder was abandoned fishing gear?

This is the second generation of foiling boats... although first to go for the Vendee.
In a long standing campaign for something like this, I would be specing strain guages in just about every component in the earlier developing generations so the stress engineers know what they are looking at.

This is a very interesting presentation on the stress calculations... Some of his comments suggest the design team got it very wrong...

 

[Kukri]

I found that fascinating. Thank you.

 

[Tomahawk]

So did I...
Methinks someone cocked up the stress calcs big time! As the chap showed, there wre w number of very nigh stress areas caused by the design. The short radius’s st the bottom of the vertical web.. The hard angles on the flanges.

I suspect that may haev played a part in the decision to retire...

Very cheap Imoca for sale anyone?

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

I can't remember which Whitbread it was, but late 80s/early 90s several boats suffered bow delamination from slam loads, and a whole lot of number crunching happened thereafter. Pretty sure that's when the long-held assumptions on slamming got canned. Those were 20kt boats, but it's not hard to scale to 30kts once you know the mechanism.

I'd find it disappointing if that knowledge had been lost, so I'm still keeping an open mind until the boat is lifted and the skin examined for for object damage.

 

[Frogmogman]

This guy is good at presenting the problems in a way for the layman to understand, and as a non sailor maybe better placed to think outside the box than the guys at LPVP whose design in the nature of things will be developments of what has gone before.

I thought his point about the danger that the repairs risk just moving the point of stress concentration further along the structure was well made. Sad though I am for Alex, maybe the rudder damage did him a favour. His team can now have a really good look at these structural issues and work out how to avoid them next time.

I liked his comparison of Alex Thomson as the Colin McRae of yacht racing. The design should be made with that in mind.

 

[Frogmogman]

I can't remember which Whitbread it was, but late 80s/early 90s several boats suffered bow delamination from slam loads, and a whole lot of number crunching happened thereafter. Pretty sure that's when the long-held assumptions on slamming got canned. Those were 20kt boats, but it's not hard to scale to 30kts once you know the mechanism.

I'd find it disappointing if that knowledge had been lost, so I'm still keeping an open mind until the boat is lifted and the skin examined for for object damage.

In the very first Whitbread, Les Williams' Burton Cutter, having won the first leg down to cape town, had to abandon the race not long into the second leg, because the bow structure was breaking up.

Burton Cutter was, of course, an aluminium boat which had been built in a hurry by a company more accustomed to building fuel tanks, and in Les' usual style the boat was still being fitted out during much of the first leg.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

I can't remember which Whitbread it was, but late 80s/early 90s several boats suffered bow delamination from slam loads, and a whole lot of number crunching happened thereafter. Pretty sure that's when the long-held assumptions on slamming got canned. Those were 20kt boats, but it's not hard to scale to 30kts once you know the mechanism.

I'd find it disappointing if that knowledge had been lost, so I'm still keeping an open mind until the boat is lifted and the skin examined for for object damage.

I wonder if it’s been lost or that some one got it wrong or even that it is easily scalable.

This is leading edge design, materials and manufacturing. The bloke in the video stated that it is difficult to model, lots of assumptions required, variable forces in multiple directions.

There is also a case that the boat was good for sailing loads but not colliding with something. Collision damage then proceeds to distribute loads that were simply never allowed for. The video commentator noted, if I understand correctly, as much when he described the panel as statically indeterminate.

Hopefully time will tell and we can find out at some future point. Such a shame for Alex Thomson, I can’t imagine what it is like to be so driven and then have the opportunity taken out of your hands.

 

[Kukri]

Pip Hare interview on R4 Woman’s Hour just now. In fluent English, not Breton! One water generator (didn’t catch the make) out of three broken and wrapping carbon fibre and epoxy round one of the others.

 

[flaming]

So did I...
Methinks someone cocked up the stress calcs big time! As the chap showed, there wre w number of very nigh stress areas caused by the design. The short radius’s st the bottom of the vertical web.. The hard angles on the flanges.

I suspect that may haev played a part in the decision to retire...

Very cheap Imoca for sale anyone?

There were an awful lot of assumptions in that video that may, or may not, be accurate.

 

[Frogmogman]

There were an awful lot of assumptions in that video that may, or may not, be accurate.

True, but his observations about stress concentrations were pertinent.

 

[pyrojames]

There were an awful lot of assumptions in that video that may, or may not, be accurate.

Agreed. As his model didn't show any stress rise in one of the areas that fractured, I'd be high sceptical of the rest. He started off with, he is not a boat design/engineer etc, nor does he have the precise dimensions/radii or material composition. It look as like that there are extra carbon layers in some areas.

All that his modelling shows, is that it is extremely difficult to get a model to come close to what the actual loads and stresses might be!