UKBA 35% increase in boardings!!!!

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Keen_Ed

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So I put in a FOI request about the UKBA

My questions were:

1) How many times last year did UKBA staff board and search private yachts?
2) How many boardings were made in 2008 and 2007?
3) Do these figures include boardings made as the result of intelligence received?
4) How many boardings were made as the result of intelligence received?
5) How many boardings of private yachts resulted in the discovery of contraband?
6) How many boardings of private yachts made as the result of intelligence received resulted in the discovery of contraband?

Just received the answer:

In 2008/9 officers from UKBA cutters boarded 1,981 vessels of all types including yachts. In 2007/8 officers from UKBA cutters boarded 1,472 vessels including yachts. Since the formation of the UK Border Agency in 2008, the cutters working with our partners at the border have seized almost 15 tonnes of narcotics from vessels of all types, including yachts. We cannot break down these figures any further, as we do not release information that is location and/or operation specific. To do so could assist those who seek to circumvent our border controls.

With regards to intelligence matters, I can confirm that the Home Office holds some information that you have requested. However, after careful consideration, I have decided not to communicate this information to you, pursuant to the exemption under Section 31 (1) (e) of the Freedom of Information Act. This allows us to exempt information if its disclosure would, or would likely to, prejudice maritime operations and/or activities undertaken by the cutter fleet of the UK Border Agency. This provides that information can be withheld where disclosure would compromise the security of our border controls.
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A 35% increase!!! How on earth how can they justify that??

I'll be following up with the questions they haven't answered
 
An interesting response to your questions. But nice to see that their actions are having an effect, with 15 tons of drugs seized, this has to be a good thing surely.
Being boarded and checked occassionally is a small inconvenience to suffer, but rather random checks so that they may eventually come across some illegal activity and stop some drugs from reaching the streets.
 
It's difficult to understand how they can justify not answering question 5. It's surely a question concerning operational matters rather than intelligence matters. It's also a question key to whether the increase in boardings is justified or not. Suspect that the "success" rate is very low indeed and they don't want to reveal the fact.
 
We cannot break down these figures any further, as we do not release information that is location and/or operation specific. To do so could assist those who seek to circumvent our border controls.
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Yeah, right. Keep away from the Solent seems to be the message I'm getting. The increase is almost certainly a consequence of "efficiency targets" designed to show how busy they are & what good "value" the tax payer gets for the money.

I wonder how many tonnes were collected in pervious years - ie the tonnes/ search (or more realistically searches per tonne). 2008 figures say 132 searches per tonne, now, if the contraband were evenly distributed (silly idea I know) then that would be 7.6 kilos/ search. If it was all recovered off small boats, that would be quite good. But some hauls are several tonnes aren't they?

So ask for average size of haul per year over the 3 years. The number of seizures alone would help - that can be offset against the number of searches.
 
Searush said:
Yeah, right. Keep away from the Solent seems to be the message I'm getting. The increase is almost certainly a consequence of "efficiency targets" designed to show how busy they are & what good "value" the tax payer gets for the money.

I wonder how many tonnes were collected in pervious years - ie the tonnes/ search (or more realistically searches per tonne). 2008 figures say 132 searches per tonne, now, if the contraband were evenly distributed (silly idea I know) then that would be 7.6 kilos/ search. If it was all recovered off small boats, that would be quite good. But some hauls are several tonnes aren't they?

So ask for average size of haul per year over the 3 years. The number of seizures alone would help - that can be offset against the number of searches.
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The one big recent haul was being watched & a senior plod who was within the gang was jailed for i think 22 yrs
 
Yes Minister

" have seized almost 15 tonnes of narcotics from vessels of all types, including yachts."

Ah so yachts are not a set on there own but are lumped in with an "anything that floats" category that includes container ships and coracles. So we can deduce that there is a distinct possibility that NO banned substances were actually siezed from yachts in the time period mentioned but possibly sometime in the past.

Its when they pull the "national security lever" you know they are on a looser, groping around for some way to justify their actions.
 
Should've asked the ethnic background of those yachties boarded.

Laugh me c#ck off if turns out 90% black :D
 
Tommyrot said:
I'd expect a lot more if I was based further south....

Clicky
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I think you are right, here is a quote off the UKBA web site

Cutters operate mainly around the coast, responding to intelligence or patrolling high-risk areas. They have also been deployed as far east as the Baltic and as far south as the Mediterranean, working with partner organisations and authorities to track down sea-borne smuggling threats
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Patrolling "High-risk" areas, I wonder where that might be? :D Suffice it to say I have never seen a cutter! here's another clue from the same web page;

Detecting and preventing illegal goods and immigrants crossing the Channel are the long-established duties for which the cutter fleet has been known for hundreds of years. Back when the boats were armed with cannons, they were always on the lookout for bootleggers returning from mainland Europe with barrels of wine and brandy.

These traditional missions are as important today as they were in past, and the Agency's current generation of cutters will continue to provide an outstanding service to accomplish them.
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Around 2000 boardings for all vessels? - must include commercial shipping.

Anyone want to guess how far under 0.01% of all vessel movements that is?
 
Marsupial said:
" have seized almost 15 tonnes of narcotics from vessels of all types, including yachts."

Its when they pull the "national security lever" you know they are on a looser, groping around for some way to justify their actions.
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I think we would not expect the authorities to openly discuss their strategies, a major part of which must be - "decourager les autres."

So, we can expect increasing publicity (see Border Force on TV) to signal wrong-doers that they face a rising chance of detection and punishment; equally that the officers involved are not the simpletons of folklore.

When you see the huge numbers of illegals (drugs and guns are other major concerns) apprehended by enforcement teams you understand why the effort is being stepped up - I wonder wny folks are so surprised that we are now caught up in it. What irks me is that only about 50% of illegals are removed from the UK: until this gets fixed there is a counter-drag showing illegals there is continuing purpose in trying!!!

I support all this 100%. I have been boarded a number of times by UK, French and Dutch authorities. Always an interesting experience, especially when, on one occasion off Le Havre I was balancing the yacht with a following breeze trying not to jybe involuntarily whilst answering questions!

Let them come aboard - I have nothing to fear? Do you?

PWG
 
PeterGibbs said:
I think we would not expect the authorities to openly discuss their strategies, a major part of which must be - "decourager les autres."

So, we can expect increasing publicity (see Border Force on TV) to signal wrong-doers that they face a rising chance of detection and punishment; equally that the officers involved are not the simpletons of folklore.

When you see the huge numbers of illegals (drugs and guns are other major concerns) apprehended by enforcement teams you understand why the effort is being stepped up - I wonder wny folks are so surprised that we are now caught up in it. What irks me is that only about 50% of illegals are removed from the UK: until this gets fixed there is a counter-drag showing illegals there is continuing purpose in trying!!!

I support all this 100%. I have been boarded a number of times by UK, French and Dutch authorities. Always an interesting experience, especially when, on one occasion off Le Havre I was balancing the yacht with a following breeze trying not to jybe involuntarily whilst answering questions!

Let them come aboard - I have nothing to fear? Do you?

PWG
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Yes I do have a lot of missgivings and things to "fear", having watched their antics first hand at boat handling I dont want them any near me, the repair bills would be prohibitive, but the fact is the whole exersize is "just for show" and a way to beat up sitting innocent targets.
 
Searush said:
Suffice it to say I have never seen a cutter! here's another clue from the same web page;
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Despite the normal peace and quiet of The Wash, I have seen this heading for the ships anchored ready to enter King's Lynn.

Vigilant_080704-618_b-1.jpg
 
Am I missing something?

Why the tone of indignation and upset that one of our government departments is (for once) actually doing what they should be?

I'm as anti surveillance state as anyone else, and disagree with the whole e-borders project, but personally I would have no problem if every vessel in UK territorial waters was boarded. Britain has a hugely porous coastline, and has been widely seen as a soft touch for years for smugglers of all sorts - drugs, people, etc.

How many of those here protesting about boardings would also get very upset if illegal immigration rose?
 
Marsupial said:
Yes I do have a lot of missgivings and things to "fear", having watched their antics first hand at boat handling I dont want them any near me, the repair bills would be prohibitive, but the fact is the whole exersize is "just for show" and a way to beat up sitting innocent targets.
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I can only speak from my experience of being boarded at 3am as we entered the Needles channel, the RIB handling was second to none and they caused no damage, far from a "just for show" it was clear to me that they were working on specific intelligence an as soon as it was clear that we were a school boat they were off, IMHO they were looking for someone / something specific.

Separately when I was still teaching we had customs come and observe / photograph a guy who had booked a Dayskipper course arrive at the school. He asked a lot of strange questions that week and it became very apparent what he had planned and why he was doing the course. So there are people out there using Yachts to smuggle drugs and people and I support UKBA in their work to stop them.
 
Just out of curiosity I have spent the last half hour or so looking thro the official UKBA web site news releases. Back to Feb2009, so over 12 months.

Result? Not one single seizure from a yacht mentioned. EVERY news item was about a ferry port or airport, or illegals picked up inland. Many were lorries or individual passengers.

Why does this not surprise me? Simply because the sort of people duped into carrying contraband will be people who do not have the resources to buy or run a boat. There will be the odd risk taker, who thinks he can get away with it - but the consequences if caught are devastating & life ruining. Most people who take the risk are already close to disaster & a spell in prison simply means they don't have to worry where the next meal is coming from.
 
islandsailor said:
(snip)Separately when I was still teaching we had customs come and observe / photograph a guy who had booked a Dayskipper course arrive at the school. He asked a lot of strange questions that week and it became very apparent what he had planned and why he was doing the course. So there are people out there using Yachts to smuggle drugs and people and I support UKBA in their work to stop them.
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I trust you re-inforced their intelligence by informing them? That's the way that the boating community SHOULD be used - as an intelligence source. Far more effective & efficient in my view.
 
Marsupial said:
Yes I do have a lot of missgivings and things to "fear", having watched their antics first hand at boat handling I dont want them any near me, the repair bills would be prohibitive, but the fact is the whole exersize is "just for show" and a way to beat up sitting innocent targets.
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Well, I for one believe that the state shouldn't be doing anything without due cause. So I want to know what justification they have for increasing the boarding by this huge number. And if they're just fishing trips, hoping to catch somebody on the offchance, then I believe we should know. And they should stop.

This is a bit OTT, but the sentiment is right, IMHO. We should all be keeping an eye on what the state gets up to in our name, and we should absolutely hold them to account.

"THEY CAME FIRST for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.
THEN THEY CAME for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
THEN THEY CAME for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
THEN THEY CAME for the Catholics,
and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant.
THEN THEY CAME for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up."
 
Searush said:
I trust you re-inforced their intelligence by informing them? That's the way that the boating community SHOULD be used - as an intelligence source. Far more effective & efficient in my view.
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They de-briefed the skipper at the end of the course they knew what this guy was up to. He was a career criminal, but I think it is a good example that criminals involved in drugs / people smuggling will / have started using yachts.

Your point about the UKBA press releases is interesting though maybe it isn't as big a issue as I thought.

I just found this online but it dates back to 2007 http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/news/444247/yachtsman-smuggler-facing-long-jail-term
 
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