UK flagged boats with "foreign" owners?

sailorgirl

sailorgirl

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For the second time in the last week or so I have been a bit confused when greeting the crew on a newly arrived boat bearing the red ensign to find that none of them actually speak much English beyond "hello"... Is it me or are there an increasing number of UK flagged boats with non-Brit owners?

I know some boats like the big Shipman in the marina at present may be on charter but I doubt our latest neighbour is as the boat doesn't appear equipped to the MCA Code.
 
More likely the boats are registered at a mates UK address to avoid local fees, taxes, examinations, certificates. Can't blame them.

Sadly the Duster is now just a Flag of Convenience.
 
Well I'm the opposite of these as I'm English (ok British) but I fly the Swedish flag as my boat is registered in Sweden where I now live and not in the UK... I do however have the Red Ensign flying from below the port side spreader, as captain I'm allowed to do so..
 
They're not Geordies are they? My Mrs was a Geordie and it was 3 years before we understood half of what we said to each other..
"Ah divva naw wha' yeer onaboot man, tak proper" was her usual comment...
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I'm British and we fly the US Ensign 'cos the boat is US documented, in SWMBO's name as she is the septic and a limey cannot register a US boat. I'm thinking of adding a 'GB' bumper sticker to the transom mind as well as our British YC (PYC) burgee STICKER
 
Anyone can register anything on the SSR. They are total suckers. Many foreign nationals use it as a flag of convenience. It is the root cause of our current problems with the Greeks. Visit Vouliagmeni Marina near Cape Sounion and you will see a harbour full of red ensigned superyachts with not a "limey" in sight. The Greek government is after them to pay proper taxes on their earnings but it is easier to stick a tax on everybody than offend the Athens Mafia.
 
Robin said:
I'm British and we fly the US Ensign 'cos the boat is US documented, in SWMBO's name as she is the septic and a limey cannot register a US boat. I'm thinking of adding a 'GB' bumper sticker to the transom mind as well as our British YC (PYC) burgee STICKER
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septic ?
 
wazza said:
Well I'm the opposite of these as I'm English (ok British) but I fly the Swedish flag as my boat is registered in Sweden where I now live and not in the UK... I do however have the Red Ensign flying from below the port side spreader, as captain I'm allowed to do so..
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Like you I'm English, But I fly a Norwegian Flag! and like you I can flag the 'red-duster' from the port spreader. But if I do I alway get asked if I've just crossed from Shetland, so I dont bother any more, only sometimes if I have UK guests onboard!
 
I've been sailing the Mediterranean for 33 years now and have never expected a red-ensigned yacht of any size to have English-speakers aboard - I learned early on not to hail them expecting a chat on UK issues. It seems fashionable to have British registration - plain to see in my marina where one Italian has a union flag as his ensign.

If on the Part III (SSR) register then up to quite recently there were no checks on the owner's UK residency. Then, when there was, anyone could be used to post the certificate on. Now there are increasingly more controls on even that but the system is not difficult to circumvent.

If Part I (as most of the larger ones are) then they are registered through agencies and with a UK shell-company ownership.

A red ensign is indeed a 'Flag of Convenience' and always has been, be it plain or defaced by CI, IoM, Gib. et al.
 
farquart said:
is this not to do with tax as most are registered in the isle of man or Jersey
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Rarely to do with tax as there are no tax advantages for a UK resident. May well be advantage for residents of other countries to register outside their own country. CI registration can be negative in the EU as some states will impose restrictions on the boat. In Greece for example they can treat the boat as non EU even if the owner is EU resident and require a cruising permit.
 
Steve C Cronin said:
Anyone can register anything on the SSR. They are total suckers. Many foreign nationals use it as a flag of convenience. It is the root cause of our current problems with the Greeks. Visit Vouliagmeni Marina near Cape Sounion and you will see a harbour full of red ensigned superyachts with not a "limey" in sight. The Greek government is after them to pay proper taxes on their earnings but it is easier to stick a tax on everybody than offend the Athens Mafia.
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I sort of expect super yachts to have red dusters or be from one of the Caribbean states, there are plenty of them here in Puerto Calero but our recent pontoon neighbours (several) have been AWBs, about 40 ft presumably enroute from Europe to the Caribbean. The latest I guess must be SSR not Pt I registered as no port only the boat name on the stern and they definitely don't understand English as tried to let them know last night that the fender they'd hung over their heating exhaust was about to pop. Took some minutes to get the message through before they rescued it by when it had an ominous bulge!
 
sailorgirl said:
The latest I guess must be SSR not Pt I registered as no port only the boat name on the stern and they definitely don't understand English
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As you point out, that if Pt I there should be a port of registry and if Pt III there should be the SSR number. One or the other is required by the mandatory registration instructions in addition to the name. Lack of either implies an intention to avoid identification.

However, if there is a SSR number the registered owner may not be aboard, the yacht could be chartered by others.
 
Barnac1e said:
As you point out, that if Pt I there should be a port of registry and if Pt III there should be the SSR number. One or the other is required by the mandatory registration instructions in addition to the name. Lack of either implies an intention to avoid identification.

However, if there is a SSR number the registered owner may not be aboard, the yacht could be chartered by others.
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Don't think so. A boat (officially) used for commercial purposes cannot be on the SSR. It must be on Pt 1 and coded, although enforcement by MCA outside UK may not be ad rigorous as one might think.
 
Tranona said:
Barnac1e said:
However, if there is a SSR number the registered owner may not be aboard, the yacht could be chartered by others.
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Don't think so. A boat (officially) used for commercial purposes cannot be on the SSR. It must be on Pt 1 and coded, although enforcement by MCA outside UK may not be ad rigorous as one might think.
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Yes, you are right, if official. Or perhaps "loaned" ??? But more likely falsely registered, as many are, which seems rather silly if the owner has no English.

It is why, before I bit the cost bullet and registered Part I (unable to do so on Part III because of my expatriate status) and searching for a cheap flag of convenience, I avoided the Belgian possibility. My Dutch was non-existant and my French too poor.
 
Barnac1e said:
If Part I (as most of the larger ones are) then they are registered through agencies and with a UK shell-company ownership.

A red ensign is indeed a 'Flag of Convenience' and always has been.
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An example here, Parsifal III, port of registry London. Photographed when it passed me in 2005 between the Croatian islands of Brac and Hvar, it was owned by Danish businessman Kim Vibe-Peterson.

At 54m length built in aluminium by Perini Navi, it was put on the market the next year at a cool €60 million. At such prices there is no problem to cover the cost of Part I registration and paying for establishing a UK ownership.

Parsifal.jpg
 
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wazza said:
Well I'm the opposite of these as I'm English (ok British) but I fly the Swedish flag as my boat is registered in Sweden where I now live and not in the UK... I do however have the Red Ensign flying from below the port side spreader, as captain I'm allowed to do so..
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I like the idea, is it really allowed, what about size? I'm English and our boat is registered in Germany.
 
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