UFO 34 vrs She 36

[Phideaux]

I've been trying to find information on both of these whilst looking for a 32-36ft as a fast cruiser suitable for short or single-handed sailing, but apart from the specifications I'm not having much joy about what they're like to sail, or details of the little 'comforts' of life on board. Can anybody help?

 

[photodog]

She 36 is a hell of a bit of kit... Nicest looking boat ever IMHO.

Hard to find a good one... but I think you would have to do quite a bit of work to get it set up for short handing... When I looked at one a few years back I very quickly decided it would be a handfull....

Here is some bumph....

http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/ufo-34/ufo-34.htm

http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/she-36/she-36.htm

 

[doug748]

While you are about it have a look at this:
http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/boats/r16510/r16510.htm
Well, yes I know it has nothing to do with a UFO or She....but I have been dying to draw attention to it. Looks a cracker at the price.

 

[Tranona]

Can't understand why you can't find information Google is a good start.

UFOs have a reputation of being a bit of a handful particularly downwind as designed to IOR rules with big headsails and skinny stern. Many home completed so variable quality. Most hard raced - what they were designed for. So usually cheap, often syndicate owned. Recently reviewed along with other H&P designs in PBO.

She 36 also variable as early ones mainly straight racers but later more cruising orientated. Second hand review couple of years ago in YM.

Both were designed intitially for full crews, so not intrinsically good propositions for shorthanded sailing.

Talk to Boo2 who posts regularly here as he has been looking for exactly the same thing for some time, without success.

 

[jwilson]

I've been trying to find information on both of these whilst looking for a 32-36ft as a fast cruiser suitable for short or single-handed sailing, but apart from the specifications I'm not having much joy about what they're like to sail, or details of the little 'comforts' of life on board. Can anybody help?

Have done some mileage on both: UFO 34 an excellent boat, despite having seen the keel sticking up into the air a few times (read "Heavy Weather Sailing"). After that nasty episode off Iceland I sailed the same boat a little later through some ordinary strong winds and it handled it beautifully. Pinched stern IOR design so if you drive it really hard downwind it doesn't like it. In all normal weather though reducing sail fixes the problem and still you go pretty quickly. Very cheap fast sailing now, but many tired and/or amateur fitout.

She 36 simply the nicest handling boat I have ever sailed. Unfortunately other people have noticed this too, and thus prices are very high for a 30 year old cruiser-racer. Only saw about a F7 in one, but it gave us 10.5 knots offwind under fingertip control. Very similar design to a Swan of the same era, but without the Swan price tag or quality fitout.

 

[Bajansailor]

Another possible boat to consider could be an S & S 34 - just like the She 36 (also an S & S design) she sails like a witch, beautifully balanced, very stable, just heels a bit, gets into her groove and tromps along happily at a rate of knots.
(This said after enjoying sailing on one from the Windies to Newport, Rhode Island via Bermuda 15 years ago).
More about them here at http://www.ss34.org/ and there are a few for sale if you google them.

A chap here had a UFO 34 in the 80's, and mopped up everywhere on the Caribbean racing circuit. I was living in Poole in the early 90's, and wandering along the quay one evening, I saw a Bajan flag on the 5th boat out, so clambered quietly over the other 4 boats to say hello - they were most surprised to have a Bajan visitor in Poole! They had recently arrived from the Azores via Falmouth, and I dont think they did much in the way of mods to the boat before setting off from here, other than adding a wind vane on the back.

 

[gregmlucas]

Fastnet 79

Simon,

IIRC, wasn't it a SHE 36 that was involved in rescuing crew from another yacht during the Fastnet '79 and still went on to complete the course (or at least returned safely under her own sail/steam).

There is a SHE 36 ashore at Port Solent (called Shekane I think) that has been ashore for at least 5 years. Who knows it might be worth an enquiry at the marina office to see if she's for sale.

Lovely looking boats.

 

[Phideaux]

Can't understand why you can't find information Google is a good start.

I've found lots of technical information (yachtsnet being a good example) but not much on what they'd be like to sail single-handed. However, your comments lower down in your post were very helpful.

 

[Phideaux]

Simon,

IIRC, wasn't it a SHE 36 that was involved in rescuing crew from another yacht during the Fastnet '79 and still went on to complete the course (or at least returned safely under her own sail/steam).

There is a SHE 36 ashore at Port Solent (called Shekane I think) that has been ashore for at least 5 years. Who knows it might be worth an enquiry at the marina office to see if she's for sale.

Lovely looking boats.

Hi Greg,

Yup, a SHE 36 rescued a crew and finished the race.

I'll have to make a discrete ennquiry next time I'm at Port Solent (possibly for the Scuttlebutt Cherbourg trip).

Cheers,
Simon

 

[Boo2]

Can anybody help?

As Tranona pointed out, I've been searching for a similar boat for around a year now. I've found the best bet for researching info on old boats are these forums, either posting my questions directly or using google to search through the archived info.

The problem with the forum search facility is it can't cope with words shorter than 4 letters so ufo 34 and she 36 don't get very good results. I don't want to teach anyone to suck eggs but using google.com to search these forums is very easy just type eg ["she 36" site:ybw.com/forums] (without the brackets) to find past references to the exact phrase "she 36". Omitting the space thus : "she36" may find additional posts. Ditto obviously "ufo 34".

I wish you luck finding a She 36
(Unlike the UFO they are beyond my price bracket)

Boo2

 

[Phideaux]

As Tranona pointed out, I've been searching for a similar boat for around a year now. I've found the best bet for researching info on old boats are these forums, either posting my questions directly or using google to search through the archived info.

The problem with the forum search facility is it can't cope with words shorter than 4 letters so ufo 34 and she 36 don't get very good results. I don't want to teach anyone to suck eggs but using google.com to search these forums is very easy just type eg ["she 36" site:ybw.com/forums] (without the brackets) to find past references to the exact phrase "she 36". Omitting the space thus : "she36" may find additional posts. Ditto obviously "ufo 34".

I wish you luck finding a She 36
(Unlike the UFO they are beyond my price bracket)

Boo2

Your comment about the search facility would explain why I've had no results when searching these forums using she36 or ufo34. Have you looked at the S&S 34 as an alternative as someone else has suggested? The Swan 36 looks nice, except for the price

 

[Lodesman77]

Out of interest, I see the she 36 which is for sale at Red Ensign has been there quite a while - anyone know what's wrong with her?

Probably not ready to buy one just yet but it's so tempting...
,

 

[Tranona]

I've found lots of technical information (yachtsnet being a good example) but not much on what they'd be like to sail single-handed. However, your comments lower down in your post were very helpful.

'Twas slightly tongue in cheek because the UFO 34 in particular has plenty of information available because it has been a very popular boat.

However, even a cursory glance at the "technical" information will tell you that it is not a boat for short and singlehanded sailing. Sailplans show multiple headsails suggesting frequent sail changing, accomodation plans with berths for 6-8 crew needed to carry out such sail changes and forecabins given over to sail stowage, minimal anchoring arrangements and so on. Photos of them in their prime usually have the 6 starlings sitting on the weather rail as they beat (very effectively) to windward or "just about to broach" shots under spinnaker!

Bit of an exaggeration and of course they can be detuned (emasculated?) to be more manageable with small crews - but why bother when there is a massive choice of better boats for shorthanded cruising. I know they are "cheap" - typically 50-60% of the price of a comparable size cruising boat from the same era. There is obviously a reason for this, which might be connected to the fact that a new boat pitched at the same market such as a Maxi would cost 10 times a UFO. Doing work on them to keep them up to scratch is expensive as the important bits are priced in relation to the expensive boat.

And as others have pointed out, many were finished to a budget and have been subject to hard use, so the ones that come on the market are not usually the well cared for, continually updated ones as owners tend to hold onto them. What you generally see is those where the owners are giving into the unequal struggle and trying to move on before the next big bill arrives!

 

[dt4134]

Photos of them in their prime usually have the 6 starlings sitting on the weather rail as they beat (very effectively) to windward or "just about to broach" shots under spinnaker!

To be fair though, they could be set up more conservatively for cruising without really emasculating them. A No.2 in furling gear rather than a huge No.1 for example, with the engine being used to improve light airs performance. Keeping the spinnaker in the sail locker when things are a bit dodgy is acceptable behaviour for cruisers too.

It's some of the more modern cruiser-racers where you need a switched-on main trimmer to keep the boat going in a straight line that would be more awkward to set up for single-handed cruising.

I guess in the end the OP is going to have to look at a few examples to see how easily they could be modified for single-handed sailing.

 

[Phideaux]

'Twas slightly tongue in cheek because the UFO 34 in particular has plenty of information available because it has been a very popular boat.

However, even a cursory glance at the "technical" information will tell you that it is not a boat for short and singlehanded sailing. Sailplans show multiple headsails suggesting frequent sail changing, accomodation plans with berths for 6-8 crew needed to carry out such sail changes and forecabins given over to sail stowage, minimal anchoring arrangements and so on. Photos of them in their prime usually have the 6 starlings sitting on the weather rail as they beat (very effectively) to windward or "just about to broach" shots under spinnaker!

Bit of an exaggeration and of course they can be detuned (emasculated?) to be more manageable with small crews - but why bother when there is a massive choice of better boats for shorthanded cruising. I know they are "cheap" - typically 50-60% of the price of a comparable size cruising boat from the same era. There is obviously a reason for this, which might be connected to the fact that a new boat pitched at the same market such as a Maxi would cost 10 times a UFO. Doing work on them to keep them up to scratch is expensive as the important bits are priced in relation to the expensive boat.

And as others have pointed out, many were finished to a budget and have been subject to hard use, so the ones that come on the market are not usually the well cared for, continually updated ones as owners tend to hold onto them. What you generally see is those where the owners are giving into the unequal struggle and trying to move on before the next big bill arrives!

Actually I'm quite happy with the idea of gutting the interior and rebuilding to my somewhat specific needs. Similarly, whilst a roller-reefing headsail is nice and convenient for cruising, I'm not adverse to hanking on changes. What I can't do is make 100kg (me) the equivalent of 450kg starlings if this is what's necessary for her to sail well under F5-8. There's no chance of me carrying a spinnaker.

I'd love to hear your suggestions for a 32-36' at 50% of the price that I can sail down to Port Stanley (with stops at Cape Verde and Ascension)?

 

[Boo2]

Out of interest, I see the she 36 which is for sale at Red Ensign has been there quite a while - anyone know what's wrong with her?

Teak decks, old and outdated deck machinery, small accommodation cf a modern 36 footer, another 6-8k will buy you an 8 year younger boat with a sugar scoop stern, etc.

On the plus side, there's that 2008 Yanmar plus some newish electronics. Probably fetch 25k if there's no problems elsewhere...

Too big for me though.

Boo2

 

[Boo2]

However, even a cursory glance at the "technical" information will tell you that it is not a boat for short and singlehanded sailing.

And even a cursory conversation with someone who's actually owned one will tell you it is exactly that : phrases like "very easy to sail", "she'll look after you", "can stand up to any blow while making progress to windward", "tough as anything", etc etc will pepper the conversation. As you would know Tranona, if you'd ever spoken to someone who'd owned one.

Sailplans show multiple headsails suggesting frequent sail changing,

Suggesting that the person who drew them up had never seen a roller furler, more like But of course, most UFO34s out there now have RF genoas just like any other boat that's used for cruising.

accomodation plans with berths for 6-8 crew needed to carry out such sail changes and forecabins given over to sail stowage, minimal anchoring arrangements and so on.

I'm interested to know of a 32 foot + boat where the accommodation plans don't show 6 berths ? And kindly provide us with a photo of a UFO 34, taken in the last 10 years, where the forecabin is not laid out as 2 single berths, Tranona. If you have one to hand.

Anchoring arrangements are a bit more patchy, it's true, but most were built with chain lockers forward in the usual way, and you can see many cruising boats with deck chocks for anchors instead of lockers, if it comes to that.

Photos of them in their prime usually have the 6 starlings sitting on the weather rail as they beat (very effectively) to windward or "just about to broach" shots under spinnaker!

And a photo of a Bavaria 42 beating to windward in a club race, would show what, exactly, Tranona ?

Bit of an exaggeration

Complete disinformation, more like.

What you generally see is those where the owners are giving into the unequal struggle and trying to move on before the next big bill arrives!

Same could be said of any boat, particularly one with teak decks. I personally would be careful of buying a UFO which had not had engine and winch replacements in the last 10 years unless I got the price down to a point where I could factor that in to the equation. But the same would apply to any boat made in the same period.

Boo2

 

[Boo2]

It's some of the more modern cruiser-racers where you need a switched-on main trimmer to keep the boat going in a straight line that would be more awkward to set up for single-handed cruising.

The only boat I've ever sailed in is a First 36.7 and I can totally concur that helming one of those in gusty winds with the boat trying to round up at any excuse as her lardy *rse pounds and rolls with every rise and fall of the seas is a total pain after a very short while. I find the idea of a heavier boat with 50% ballast ration (on a 6 foot keel) and a narrower beam totally irresistable compared to that. And for single handing I think a tiller is a better idea as well, another plus for the UFO 34...

 

[Boo2]

What I can't do is make 100kg (me) the equivalent of 450kg starlings if this is what's necessary for her to sail well under F5-8.

Don't pay too much attention to Tranona. His heart's in the right place but he went out on a limb about UFO 34s in another thread and can't bring himself to admit he's wrong despite many owners posting here to correct him. Googling his moniker + "ufo 34" on these forums will show you what I mean.

And, as for 450kg of starlings, the relevant pages at yachtsnet have some interesting quotes, this following from the She 36 page for instance :

"Although some IOR racers handled badly due to attempts to distort hull shapes to "cheat the rule" and obtain a favourable rating, the best of them (She 36's, UFO34's and a few others) were really good all-round fast cruiser/racers, with enough weight and ballast to continue to sail in heavy weather without (as in most modern racers) lots of crew sitting on the rail."

And something similar from their review of the UFO 34 :

"Whilst many IOR yachts of the period had a reputation for poor handling, the UFO34 was both fast and virtually vice-free, and the class became successful both as racers and as fast cruisers, many boats being used exclusively as cruising yachts."

Make up your own mind, of course, but I hth,

Boo2

 

[Ubergeekian]

Teak decks, old and outdated deck machinery, small accommodation cf a modern 36 footer, another 6-8k will buy you an 8 year younger boat with a sugar scoop stern, etc.

What's so great about a sugar scoop stern? Very trendy, I know, but isn't it just a way of losing the stern locker?