Turkey is getting expensive - be warned

[demonboy]

I don't like being the bearer of bad news but for those thinking of visiting Turkey I think you should be aware of dramatic price increases that have happened over the winter season.

I've just returned from an Easter Sunday event put on by Netsel Marina, which advertised an afternoon of free beer and food. After queueing up for my two beers the free stuff ran out and we were directed to the bar, which was charging 5ytl (£2) per glass. This is worse than the 4.50ytl for a bottle of beer in Marmaris Yacht Marina, the price of which went up from 3.50ytl the other week.

I thought Netsel might have taken this opportunity to gain some business, what with the 200-odd yotties from their rival marina present, so I approached the info desk they'd set up to get a quote for a haul out. EU680 for 10 days on the hard! Oh, and EU70 for a hose down. Now, I don't know how this compares to UK prices but when you've been budgeting on Turkish money, this comes as quite a shock.

The prices in Marmaris Yacht Marina restaurant are now averaging 25ytl (£10) per dish, with some meat dishes costing over 30ytl. Some of us went to the bar this morning to watch the Grand Prix, where a bacon sandwich cost 7ytl (almost £3). Bear in mind that you can get a 'workers' lunch (beans, meat, chips, yoghurt and bread) for 3ytl if you leave the confines of the tourist/yottie areas, and a bottle of Efes cost 1.75ytl in the market. Five Turkish lira for a beer? These are London prices!

Oh, the other day I was quoted EU8,5000 to have my boat re-rigged.

It seems to me that Turkey is now catching up with the rest of the Med in terms of various costs associated with sailing. This is inevitable, it's great for Turkey's economy and if you are used to western Med prices it's still less expensive on the whole, but be under no illusion that Turkey is a cheap sailing destination. In the three years I've been here I've seen prices rise by 100% in many areas.

I just wonder what the owner of Marmaris Yacht Marina thinks when he goes into his 150-person capacity restaurant and finds it empty. Most winter-liveaboards here can no longer afford these prices.

 

[chrisgee]

We were thinking of moving up to Marmaris Marina for the summer but may think again. Berthing in Fethiye for a 12.8 x4m is only around £1500.00 for 12 months and you can get a good meal for 10-15YTL. A large efes is 3.5 ytl ---altogether great value and only minutes from the Town.
The only drawback is the lack of a good lift out and store on the Marina.
Are we all going to suffer the age old uk problem of ever rising prices as long as they can get away with it -- although I must say that Turkey is still pretty good value for money generally.
If you really want to get ripped off then try Camper Nics @ Gocek. Crap facilites at ridiculous prices.

 

[silver-fox]

Bugger /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif....another part of the plan that is going to run over budget.

Hopefully there are still some good value places left.

 

[demonboy]

The prices for mooring in Marmaris Yacht Marina are still very competitive. Just watch out for all those hidden costs you tend to forget when budgeting (eating out, technical service etc).

 

[webcraft]

eek . . .

We were thinking of Greece next year for a season or two, but at those sort of prices it will probably be back to Spain and the Canaries for us.

I guess Greece is as bad or worse?

- W

 

[Tiercel]

Webcraft. We have just left Lakki on Leros in the Dodecanese where we were quoted €1600 for an annual contract inc liftout in 2007. The town has good, mostly inexpensive tavernas, and the yard is very competent. Unlike Spain Greece has loads of free anchorages and harbours and the locals are pretty friendly.

 

[Davy_S]

Nick, Greece is far cheaper! we out here have also heard of horror stories regarding Turkey and more so Croatia, a lot of charters are pulling out fast! trouble is quite a few respectable posters on here reccomend the places, so maybe they have sorted out their own deal, who knows. If you ever visit the Ionian, get in touch, if I can help I will. I do not do it as a buisness but I have helped one or two Brits out in looking after their yachts whilst they have returned to the Uk. I have also helped in sailing from Lefkas to Kefalonia for new charterers (nervous ones) I know you do not fit into this category, but any help to a Vega owner, just ask /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Norman_E]

Thanks for the heads up on prices. Really bad news about the price of beer. I am coming out on 31st March to launch the boat on the 10th April, so I expect I will see you then.

 

[Swagman]

Get real guys - you're scaring people away before they've even had time to check if prices are overall as bad as you infer.
Sure, all countries have inflation and Turkeys no diferent, but in ths instance we've one bar in one marina gone over the top - and combined with a suprised skipper on a quote - suddenly the sky is falling down.
P-lease. Use the web and email and you can more easily check real comparative prices worldwide andd I'm pretty sure you'll find Turkey is still very very competitive.
JOHN

 

[tamara]

Mr Storrar, from the coast road re rigged my boat for £450 for good quality 10mm 316 stainless and including transportation to turkey it still won't cost what you been quoted. stick it up the rip off merchants and use the internet. I get realy sick of these tking the piss people.

 

[demonboy]

Yeah, I didn't want to scare people off Turkey! It's an amazing country and the sailing is one of the best in the world. I just think we're beginning to see a transition, which I did say was inevitable.

Regarding the quote...

[ QUOTE ]
but in ths instance we've one bar in one marina gone over the top - and combined with a suprised skipper on a quote - suddenly the sky is falling down.

[/ QUOTE ]

...please re-read my original thread. It is not one bar in one marina. That's my point. Also this thread was posted in the liveaboard forum and since Marmaris Yacht Marina has one of the biggest winter liveaboard communities in the world I feel that some people might find this information relevant and important.

 

[mikehibb]

I will be heading to Yalikavak (Bodrum) next weekend for a week out there and will report back.

However I am not daft and know that Marina restaurants will charge whatever they can get away with. I do not think that this reflects a general price increase in Turkey.
In Yalikavak Marina we are 5 minutes walk from the town centre where a good meal can be very cheap, especially if you prefer, like we do, to eat local style food.
Our friends have been staying at our place in Yalikavak this week and have reported back that they had a very good meal in Bodrum Marina YC restaurant at reasonable price, they also dined in Bodrum and reported that they were surpised at the good value.

They are also considering buying a place in Bodrum Peninsula area, the cost of living was one of the things that they liked, they (like us) do not buy the vitals at the nearest place, they take a five or ten minute walk and look for the local markets and shops.

As I said above, will report back when I return.

 

[jimbaerselman]

[ QUOTE ]
Nick, Greece is far cheaper!

[/ QUOTE ] I have never understood the view, expressed by many sailors who have settled into Turkey, that Turkey is cheap. Inland, and away from tourism, eating out and buying fresh vegetables is cheap. But in tourist areas . . .

Greek costs at the moment: €18 to €24 for a meal for two with drinks in the Peloponese. Go to an island active with tourists and you may pay 30% more. Climb the hill for a lower price and a better view. Or go gourmet (linen tablecloths, posh menu, decent decor) to add 30% - as much €30 for a couple in Kalamata.

As for marina prices, I'm told that 2008 is unlikely to see more than a 5% rise (if that) over 2007. Check out 2007 prices at Kos Marina Prices

A diesel mechanic's time? €8 to €12 an hour. For timber work you'll get better value for money in Turkey . . .

And these are averages . . .

 

[Squeaky]

I think Demonboy was trying to be helpful but I think he was too negative and might have created the wrong impression with his examples of the cost of living in Turkey. Basically he was correct in saying that costs are increasing but can anyone tell me anyplace in the world were prices are decreasing.

His comment about the 5 YTL beer is not the standard locally - the event (free) was held in the courtyard of the boutique area of Netsel Marina which has a commercial (non-marina) coffee/tea garden type cafe in the centre. It is the sort of place where one can sit for hours over a coffee or drink while the other half spends hours wandering through the shops - a bit classy for the average "yottie". The price in the harbour in town is still 3.5 YTL and has remained at this price for a considerable time - in fact some bars are even beginning to offer lower prices. Of course Marmaris is not really part of Turkey - I always tell anyone interested that Turkey begins on the other side of the surrounding mountains where one can pay 1.75 YTL for a coke instead of 3 YTL in Marmaris.

In addition his remarks seems to indicate that he was less then impressed with the management of Netsel for only offering two free beer - in fact the management invited all yachtsmen in the local area which resulted in a reported 4 buses full of "yotties" from Marmaris Yat Marina which I assume included "Demonboy". There was no limit on the amount of beer each could have but there was a limited amount in stock and one should not be surprised that it did not provide for a full afternoon "P... Up" considering the unexpected horde that arrived. He neglected to mention wine, bar-b-qued chicken wings and all trimming was also supplied free.

Demonboy did not mention the size of his yacht which one needs to make a reasonable comparison with the cost of hauling out ones yacht. The price he was offered would seem to indicate that his yacht in somewhere in realm of 13 + metres and would have included 10 days marina berthing charges because he does not have a marina berthing contract. I think it is normal for visitors to pay for berthing charges when visiting another marina even if only for a haul-out. Netsel offers a very competitive haul-out program for yachts berthed in the marina - something like half price.

Having spent 32 years living aboard in the Med, I can assure everyone that Netsel is the best, safest and most comfortable marina I have ever visited which is why I now make it my home - where else can one find a center town marina with full breakwater protection from all winds with free electricity, water and wi-fi connection included in the berthing costs. No nickle and diming one to death here.

Sorry if I have got carried away as I seemed to have got "off topic" so will end by saying that Turkey is still a relatively inexpensive to visit but one has to watch for the "rip off merchants" especially in isolated bays - be smart, check the prices and be prepared to dine on board.

Oh, yea, I was recently quoted 7000 euros for teak (iroko) deck - instead of becoming angry, I simply laughed and walked off - this company will never receive any work from me - I think they thought I was an absentee owner of the type that traditionally accepts the first price quoted - if you were dealing with such people won't you quote high also.

Fair Winds

Squeaky

 

[gbylund]

Re: Turkey is not getting THAT expensive!

Turkey may be getting more expensive, but then so is the rest of the world. I've lived in Marmaris (Netsel Marina) for 8 years and another 8 years before that in Marmaris as well... it is still the least expensive place in the Med and Aegean seas... I have been round the Med and Aegean, Red Sea, and more looking for a better, healthier, more beautiful place to live aboard and cruise and I keep returning to this little place of Paradise -- Marmaris and Netsel.

My criteria for being here is: 1. mild climate, 2. no pollution of sea or air, 3. affordability for me pension, 4. beautiful bays and coves, 5. excellent medical, hospital and dental care, 6. close to an airport, 6. 4 hours to Europe. and more...

 

[jimbaerselman]

Re: Turkey is not getting THAT expensive!

[ QUOTE ]
Turkey may be getting more expensive, but then so is the rest of the world.

[/ QUOTE ] Or, looking at it another way, UK and USA currencies are becoming very cheap, and find the resulting costs in the rest of the world rather intimidating . . .

 

[Norman_E]

Aside from haul out costs I am not going to comment on other prices except to say that the fall in Sterling against the Euro has done more damage than actual price rises. Netsel has always struck me as expensive for haul out. When I bought my yacht it was in Netsel, and they asked over €700 for holding it in the slings for an hour over lunchtime, for the survey. I managed to get the price down to €380, though I thought even that expensive. Last year I had to have my yacht hauled out for a repair at Yacht Marine and propped for a week or so, then re-launched. I think I paid €250 or €300 for that service, which required much more work by the marina.
I do not know what happens elsewhere, but at Yacht Marine one of the staff even gets into the water at lift out to dive beneath the boat and make sure that the slings are correctly placed.

 

[Squeaky]

Good afternoon:

Re Norman_E

Noted there was no mention of the size of the yacht which would have helped in comparing prices.

I have also had my yacht lifted at Netsel for a few hours in order to change a sea cock and was charged half the cost of a normal lift and launch which seems to be their standard way of charging for this service.

I am surprised that Yat Marina would charge only half the price that you imply Netsel asked for a standard lift and launch.

Seems there are a lot of wasteful folk about because the hard standing at Netsel is chuck ablock with slipped yachts on both long and short term. Must be some reason behind this - wonder what it is?

I would suggest that requiring someone to get into the water before lifting would indicate a lack of skill or confidence on the part of the workers/management - I have not seen any place that required this practice having slipped yachts for over 32 years from one end to the other in the Med.

By the way, where did you get the material you required to work on your yacht - an 8 km dolmus ride into Marmaris and back???? Oh well, there's another day gone.

Cheers - have a good day.

Squeaky

 

[LadyJessie]

Hi DemonBoy! You need to get out of that 'black hole' of MYM; you are starting to sound grumpy.

Yes, you are right; Netsel Marina is very expensive. It has been that way for the last 15 years - no news. Many people, including myself, still think it is very nice though and worth the extra money. Personal choice really.

And yes; the Marmaris Yacht Marine Restaurant wants to go 'up-market' and pay for all that marble and fancy swimming pool. I can't blame them. They have kept their prices at about 'cost-price' for a long time to be nice to the winter live-aboards, but there comes a time when they have to 'run a business' as the manager says. If you don't agree with the prices; there are plenty of cheaper options in town. I just paid 8 ytl for an Efes at Istanbul airport so 3 ytl in Marmaris sounds great!

I still find Turkey to be one of the best and cheapest options in the Med for a live-aboard. Boat services are unbeatable in quality and price. Most marinas (not all!) are much cheaper than anywhere else in the world. Meal prices usually easily beats the Greek prices quoted by JimB above; EXCEPT if you want a lot of beer and wine. The present religious government introduced a 'sin tax' on alcohol last year. I can still remember when the price of wine almost doubled overnight on January 2007. Now Turkey has some of the highest prices on beer and wine in the Med. If this is important to you: you should stay away from Turkey.

However, there are easy ways to work around this; as most cruiser's are based in western Turkey, Greece is not far away. What you do is make regular 'wine and beer runs' to Rhodes, Symi and Kos to stock up. From Marmaris, this is an easy 23 nm run which is normally a comfortable broad reach. You moor in the Mandraki harbour which has a good supermarket close by and the best Gyro's in the world priced at 2 euros in the 'Italian Market'. Next morning you aim back downwind to Marmaris with the bilges full of wine. It is a great excursion, I can recommend it. Get's you out of the 'black hole'.

I will be back next week. If you do this trip before next weekend; will you please pick up a case of Rhodes red wine for me?