Trying to buy a new Jeanneau 64 - nightmare

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tcm

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Well, only a nightmare insofar as I have failed to get past the "contact us" bit of the website. It decided that my email address was too long or silly, so it jammed up right there. So i must have then gotten on to a dealer site - same thing. Or maybe I failed to type in the wavy letters and numbers.

But .... I am a bit wary of getting in touch with a dealer of a sub-dealer cos then AHA! they have GOTCHA! You walk in to the most numpty daft useless sub-dealer and they extract your details - and then... you're theirs! Oh yes you are! They will wire through your details to ensure that THEY get all the commission, or at least half of it, and you're flipping stuck with Mr or Mrs Idiot Useless Non-technical Salesperson who hasn't ever seen the boat, doesn't know the options and so on. Jeez. Just cos of one's location at the time they started looking - if you walked into a dealer in Oslo, well, that's that. Actually i bet they would be fine in Oslo, but anyways, not the point.

i wd be buying a boat to set off to sea and sail about and NOT pay a load of silly local taxes or delivery charges thank you very much. They put it in the sea, I'll get on board and yerknow, sail off somewhere else. "Oh but where will you actually keep the boat hm ?" well, here and there is my answer. Sometimes I'll be in France, sometimes Spain, Gibraltar, Carib, Panama, SPacific, Australia, Seth Efrica and some other places too. Probably never Italy or anywhere cold. Generally between 44N and 35S which allows for western Med, carib, French poly and round again.

I am in the carib at the mo, but visiting Europe soon, most south of France i think, but also Paris and Amsterdam.

Also I don't much go a bundle on visiting things being built, so I'd just choose the sensible/popular options and def not want to go visit the factory too much, thanks. Just a bunch of emails each way, ands perhaps some pix from time to time. Oh alright, If I have really GOT to go and see things and say hm, yes, very leathery but you say it is not real leather but actually some manmade material which is better? how very interesting... and yes well he may very well be an excellent engineer but he's about to screw non-A4 fasteners on to my boat and i really don't want him to do that... and oh I see, your final fit-out team can't do that because you're sick of me having ideas half way thru the build yes fair enough, carry on... well then, ok, i wd visit somewhere, a bit, but not Dusseldorf which is rather boring. Paris, much less boring I suppose. But although on parle a fair peu de francais, easily enough to confirmez que l'accident avec l'autre voiture c'etait pas ma faut, well, it's not much going to work tout en francais, not really. Altho actually, the dealer being able to parlez franca is avec Jeanneau luii-meme, well, that would be assez bien.

So henyway, any Jeanneau dealer out there who might be able to help, please get in touch. Or perhaps others reading this - mebbe you know a very wise and capable jeanneau dealer? But note that i don't too much care about them being ace with the spanners - if something breaks i wd be invariably somewhere else, like that time I eventually got on the phone to Raymarine and having had enough of being passed around everyone else, I asked to speak Ray himself. I never got to speak to Ray, and they did eventually sort it out using someone in the Canaries, see? Which needed them to be hot on the phones and emails and sending spare or replacements.

Best is use my email address of course, which is not easy to remember. Write something witty, ok? Something a bit fun? Boats are supposed to be fun, and buying a boat oughta be fun as well, I think.

Actually i think there might be a long queue to buy a J64 so, humm, praps they are very very busy, dammit.

Oh and that email address is on the hotmail dot com server or whatever they call a bunch of email addresses.

Thanks!
 
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Your screwed.

Apparenlty there are several thousand possible combinations of fabrics, woods, leathers and interior and exterior layouts,

You'd better get a caravan, cause your gonna be camped at the factory for months.
 
How about Magnum's cnb 60? Been on the market for a while, no dealer to deal with and no waiting.

http://www.ancasta.com/boats-for-sale/cnb-bordeaux-60-28987/?filters=LT6Z@z6iYbRnfkGbzPXOCuCNCoYCgzea

Her owner would consider a Motor yacht in part exchange...

Boooo!!
 
Try Sea Ventures in Swanwick. They were very good at dealing with my enquiry when I was in the market earlier this year. Did not buy a Jeanneau in the end so can't comment on the full buying experience but know the boats.

Having to go through dealers is just something that comes with mass manufacturers and you have to learn to live with it if you want to buy a factory built product.
 
Try Sea Ventures in Swanwick. They were very good at dealing with my enquiry when I was in the market earlier this year. Did not buy a Jeanneau in the end so can't comment on the full buying experience but know the boats.

Having to go through dealers is just something that comes with mass manufacturers and you have to learn to live with it if you want to buy a factory built product.

Sorry but I would not recommend Sea Ventures having bought my Jeanneau from them. They deleted factory fit items that I ordered from the Jeanneau options list to get Bob the Builder to fit them badly at half the price. All these options proved troublesome and did not get corrected for years - yes years! I queried these deletions with Jeanneau when I visited the factory during the boat build and they said the dealers had that option to fit things like bow thrusters locally!

I had trouble getting quotes as other dealers refused to quote as I was out of their area. My understanding is that the distributors effectively run a cartel even though my understanding is that it's illegal.

I got quotes from France and was resigned to buying it in France. I finally phone a Jeanneau dealer in Ireland asking if they were part of the cartel and that I was just about to place the order with a Jeanneau dealer in France but thought I would give them a chance as language between Ireland and me would be less of a problem and accepted that I would still be buying in Euros. The Irish dealer said there was no cartel and took my details stating someone would get back to me.

Within 10 minute I got a unsolicited call from my local Sea Ventures telling me that they understood I wanted to buy a new boat!!! I replied yes but I had already received a quote from them and it was not competitive. They said they could re quote now they knew I was serious. To my regret (due to the following the ongoing problems) I bought from them.

Subsequently I met the owner of a new Jeanneau 45 who said after similar experience he ordered a his boat new from Sea Ventures as he recognised the way the market worked but ordered the bare boat and organised his own quality contractors to fit out the boat with all the extras. Wish I had received this advice before buying mine.

WRT Jeanneau I am still after many years happy with my original choice of boat and accept that most modern production boats are similar with minor advantages and minor disadvantages to their competitors.

I have bought three new boats and while many had problems with Portway that sold Dufours I had no problems with initial commissioning and fit out only when things went wrong and then they just wanted me to deal with the manufacturer (mostly Volvo) when a folding propellor failed on one and and engine at 13 months on another. I do not think say Audi would tell me to contact Bosch because the alternator failed!

Can't give you any solution except to get quote from French dealers that are prepared to compete or consider buying a bare boat and arranging for quality contractors to fit it out. This is the way I would go if I bought another new boat but the last experience has rather put me off ever buying a new boat again and would probably be patient and buy a lightly used relative new one that I would assume the first owner has already gone through the hassle.

Unfortunately the UK new boat industry is a cottage industry with many bankruptcy that prevent any quality company surviving - all IMHO of course. The only hope is forums like this and the Internet will assist buyers to obtain info and anyone offering a better service to attract orders.

I would add that the individuals I dealt with at Sea Ventures all seemed to be doing their best but exchange of info between the sales side and commissioning made many errors and I got the impression that the staff were limited in what they could do by cost constraints imposed from above.

As a person that has managed many large construction projects world wide I now consider the Cowboys I have dealt with in the building industry to be quality workmen after my experience of the last boat purchase!!

In case anyone believes my comments unreasonable - because I thought that my problems would end up being resolved in a court case I have kept copies of the correspondence and e mails etc listing all the problems so that I could provide a legal paper trail.
 
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Try Sea Ventures in Swanwick. They were very good at dealing with my enquiry when I was in the market earlier this year. Did not buy a Jeanneau in the end so can't comment on the full buying experience but know the boats.

Having to go through dealers is just something that comes with mass manufacturers and you have to learn to live with it if you want to buy a factory built product.

I can - no praise from me whatsoever....... echo what SF says above. One example - pitched up unannounced on a Thursday afternoon to check the snagging list prior to handover in a few days time (Seraph was all paid for and I had paperwork). Where's Seraph? - they were out using her as a demo boat with potential buyers.

Heard positive comments re the West Country and Welsh dealers
 
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Excellent info so far. I am out of range of the UK at the moment but the language etc would be an issue dealing with the Frenchies, I think?

Meanwhile a quick thrash at SV has got me nowhere :

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients failed.

sales@sea-ventures.co.uk
info@sea-ventures.co.uk

That is 'cos your address is wrong. No hyphen required. Correct address is tim@seaventures.co.uk. Tim Harley is current boss and responded quickly to all my enquiries.
 
Sorry but I would not recommend Sea Ventures having bought my Jeanneau from them. They deleted factory fit items that I ordered from the Jeanneau options list to get Bob the Builder to fit them badly at half the price. All these options proved troublesome and did not get corrected for years - yes years! I queried these deletions with Jeanneau when I visited the factory during the boat build and they said the dealers had that option to fit things like bow thrusters locally!

I had trouble getting quotes as other dealers refused to quote as I was out of their area. My understanding is that the distributors effectively run a cartel even though it's illegal.

I got quotes from France and was resigned to buying it in France. I finally phone a Jeanneau dealer in Ireland asking if they were part of the cartel and that I was just about to place the order with a Jeanneau dealer in France but thought I would give them a chance as language between Ireland and me would be less of a problem and accepted that I would still be buying in Euros. The Irish dealer said there was no cartel and took my details stating someone would get back to me.

Within 10 minute I got a unsolicited call from my local Sea Ventures telling me that they understood I wanted to buy a new boat!!! I replied yes but I had already received a quote from them and it was not competitive. They said they could re quote now they knew I was serious. To my regret (due to the following the ongoing problems) I bought from them.

Subsequently I met the owner of a new Jeanneau 45 who said after similar experience he ordered a his boat new from Sea Ventures as he recognised the way the market worked but ordered the bare boat and organised his own quality contractors to fit out the boat with all the extras. Wish I had received this advice before buying mine.

WRT Jeanneau I am still after many years happy with my original choice of boat and accept that most modern production boats are similar with minor advantages and minor disadvantages to their competitors.

I have bought three new boats and while many had problems with Portway that sold Dufours I had no problems with initial commissioning and fit out only when things went wrong and then they just wanted me to deal with the manufacturer (mostly Volvo) when a folding propellor failed on one and and engine at 13 months on another. I do not think say Audi telling me to contact Bosch because the alternator failed!

Can't give you any solution except to get quote from French dealers that are prepared to compete or consider buying a bare boat and arranging for quality contractors to fit it out. This is the way I would go if I bought another new boat but the last experience has rather put me off ever buying a new boat again and would probably be patient and buy a lightly used relative new one that I would assume the first owner has already gone through the hassle.

Unfortunately the UK new boat industry is a cottage industry with many bankruptcy that prevent any quality company surviving - all IMHO of course. The only hope is forums like this and the Internet will assist buyers to obtain info and anyone offering a better service to attract orders.

I would add that the individuals I dealt with at Sea Ventures all seemed to be doing their best but exchange of info between the sales side and commissioning made many errors and I got the impression that the staff were limited in what they could do by cost constraints imposed from above.

As a person that has managed many large construction projects world wide I now consider the Cowboys I have dealt with in the building industry to be quality workmen after my experience of the last boat purchase!!

Thanks for this. I am kinda hoping that boats these days a bit more integrated, so much less room for slapping bits on later. Also i would say "no slapping the bits on later, okay?" Bigger dealers kinda seen it all I suppose and yerknow, just send us the money and then (much later) here's the boat with the pointy bit at one end and -look!- the flat bit at the other end almost exactly the right number of feet back! And the best thing is that it floats!
 
Thanks for this. I am kinda hoping that boats these days a bit more integrated, so much less room for slapping bits on later. Also i would say "no slapping the bits on later, okay?" Bigger dealers kinda seen it all I suppose and yerknow, just send us the money and then (much later) here's the boat with the pointy bit at one end and -look!- the flat bit at the other end almost exactly the right number of feet back! And the best thing is that it floats!

Yes. Much more factory fit options these days. Admittedly at the opposite end of the price range, but my new Bavaria has no dealer fit options and the only significant extras not factory fit are Coppercoat (which I am organising) and extra canvas work because the locally made items are better than the factory.
 
I ordered factory fit options but these were deleted by the dealer - not sure how you can get round that.

I was buying a boat for the charter market and as such I looked on it as a business for many buying new boats is buying a dream! That's the only reason that I think they get away with such poor service.

One advantage or organising the fitting of heating, bow thruster, raymarine instruments and radar yourself is that you are dealing directly with the authorised agents and have a legal contract with them rather than the boat distributor who will just act as a middleman and have no financial interest in sorting problems.
 
I ordered factory fit options but these were deleted by the dealer - not sure how you can get round that.

I was buying a boat for the charter market and as such I looked on it as a business for many buying new boats is buying a dream! That's the only reason that I think they get away with such poor service.

One advantage or organising the fitting of heating, bow thruster, raymarine instruments and radar yourself is that you are dealing directly with the authorised agents and have a legal contract with them rather than the boat distributor who will just act as a middleman and have no financial interest in sorting problems.

Easy. Just tick the boxes and have the spec detailed in the contract. That is what I have done. The extras that might be obvious dealer fit like instruments, windlass, bow thruster, heater are substantially cheaper as factory fit anyway. Can'y understand why anybody would not have factory fit unless they wanted something completely different.
 
Buying a new boat is a process from the dark ages, based upon my experience in 2013. The list of "options" is never ending and can come close to doubling the headline grabbing base price. Oh, you want sails fitting to your sailing boat do you? And you'll need an electronics pack. How about a docking pack (consisting of shore lines and fenders)?

Pre-sale: I was courted like being with a new partner; hand-over: I was treated like royalty, aftersales: ah well, 2 out of 3 isn't so bad, is it?

If you'd like someone to go to the factory to view a Jeanneau 64 under construction, I'm happy to volunteer!
 
I can recommend the local Jeanneau dealer here in the Costa Blanca, based in Denia. They have been in business for over 30 years, family business, had good service, friend of mine has also purchased recently through them and been happy with service. The guy to speak to is Marcos Perez (he speaks good English), he has sailed on the Jeanneau 64, had technical presentations so should know something about them. I think they are talking to an existing client at the moment about a new 64, who currently has the 57. Nice boat, saw it at Cannes.
 
Easy. Just tick the boxes and have the spec detailed in the contract. That is what I have done. The extras that might be obvious dealer fit like instruments, windlass, bow thruster, heater are substantially cheaper as factory fit anyway. Can'y understand why anybody would not have factory fit unless they wanted something completely different.

Factory fit options work and are warranted by Jeanneau. I ordered the boat with a detailed specification (based on 2 previous new boats and my experience in the construction industry. Fortunately this gave them little wriggle room but compromises were necessary if an expensive court case was to be avoided.

It would take a book to go through all the problems but lets just take one Bow Thruster .

Factory fit it is water tested and cable installed length of boat to power bowthruster. After fit needed a battery in the bow. With slamming of modern boats they should be spiral wound batteries and cables need to be a certain size. This was correctly installed only after I insisted on the correct specification. Problem was it leaked. They asked me to leave it until winter lift out. As they were addressing a number of other items including wrong displays and wrong radar unit I agreed. Bob the builder had another go . It still leaked.

This time I insisted next repair was done by Osmatec at Hamble Point a firm I respect. Osmatic repaied it but said it had been lacking many sheets of fibreglass and they could not access immediately beneath the tube without removing it all and starting again. I reluctantly agreed that they would do an additional repair of sealing in the tube by installing two mini bulheads so any leak would be contained in the sealed box. Hence 2yrs after initial delivery the leak was fixed but only by me holding money back and insisting Osmatic fixed it.

I also discovered that Osmatic had bid for similar work but were a few hundred pound dearer. Now as far as I am concerned an extra £200 on a £240k purchase to ensure quality work is preferable.

Unfortunately similar problems with the heater and all the instruments always left me with a compromise that was less than satisfactory. Plywood patches in the heads inner GRP as the only way they could get the heating pipes through post build - do you get the picture! The heater finally worked properly 4yrs later when we got an official agent to service it and effectively recommission it. It was only working at 50% efficiency.

I would add that my boat benefitted by a lot of extra charters when another boat on the fleet an Arcona 46 had to be taken out of charter after it nearly sunk due to a fault on the retractable bow thruster. I do not know any further details or whether this could/should/was fitted as a factory option but if I had a retractable bow thruster I would like it fitted as part of the original build.

People criticise modern production boats but the QA/QC that I inspected and questioned at the Jeanneau Factory was impressive and I suspect other modern production boats are equally good in their QA/QC. Its the Bob the Builder employed to do aftermarket installations that has questionable QA/QC and while dealers/distributors are trying to shave the last few hundred profit out of every boat the buyers like you and I have no chance.

Tranona I sincerely hope you have a better experience than mine and hope your dream does not turn into a nightmare.
 
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I can recommend the local Jeanneau dealer here in the Costa Blanca, based in Denia. They have been in business for over 30 years, family business, had good service, friend of mine has also purchased recently through them and been happy with service. The guy to speak to is Marcos Perez (he speaks good English), he has sailed on the Jeanneau 64, had technical presentations so should know something about them. I think they are talking to an existing client at the moment about a new 64, who currently has the 57. Nice boat, saw it at Cannes.

MarinaSport are pretty good (knew them when they were based in Javea).
Problem is buy from them and (say) move the boat to another country and then try and get any warranty issues fixed - damn nigh impossible as the local agents won't want to know.(Marina Sport didn't help me in any way). Mine had the well known/common strum box issue (delamination within the keel) and no-one, even Jeanneau HQ in France , wanted to know/reimburse me for the repairs - within the warranty period. Jeanneau HQ are very good at stonewalling you to the point that all you want to do is get on with your life.
 
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