Trim ram headaches.

[BruceK]

I needed to replace both trim rams. Done. One was leaking through the hydraulic line connection. Replaced. That one I very gingerly connected the first hydraulic hose with fingers only. Felt bit "sticky" but turned in 3 or so turns before I realised it was cross threaded. Took it out to start again, not a spanner in sight let alone used, but the damage was done and no matter what I did I could not get it to thread correctly thereafter. Had a look at the first failed unit. Yep, it was cross threaded and had happily gone down 3/4 of the way down the thread before the angle brought it to a full stop hence not mating correctly with olive and leaking albeit the olive was snug and tight.

I promise on my mother's grave I have a 99.9% success rate on never cross threading bolts. That's numpty territory. I am also not built like a gorilla that I should be able to damage the threads cross threading finger tight. Yet that is what I have done twice. So onto my third ram, is there any sort of trick or knack peculiar to these rams and their hydraulic fitting DPG /DPE because there is always some tension on the hydraulic lines encouraging one to get it wrong? You know because if I cross thread the third one I will only have 2 spare new left (emergency spares bought in a fit of outrage, yes that six rams now but if unused will go towards my other drive) and will probably throw a match into the boat to put me out of my misery.
Numpty or trick to it?

 

[[2068]]

Unfortunately all the pic links are dead in the thread below, and I can't edit it to fix the links.
But I seem to remember supporting the ram to be in roughly the "right" place so things weren't at an angle, then being very gentle with the nut.

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthrea...-s-Guide-on-How-Not-to-Change-a-DP-E-Trim-Ram

 

[BruceK]

Yes tried getting the angles right, even removed the earthing wire clip to aid movement. I must be a numpty. Thing is I'm a bit scared of repeating the error third time round as I cant figure how to do anything different. The ali threads in the ram are fine and not very robust.

 

[kashurst]

Could you helicoil the damaged threads and re-use the rams?

 

[BruceK]

I've sent the damaged units off to a hydraulic firm to see what they can do. But they are confident it's an easy job. My problem is my boat has a set date for lift-in on Monday in as it's a group lift in. Any delays could see me on the hard until the next time the crane comes to service the hard and that would be a month delay and cause chaos not to mention losing my Easter cruise as I am mid way down the lot. Buying rams ensures next day delivery so work is not impeded for too long. But it's not going well tbh. This maintenance season has been nothing but grief with a capital G.

edit: my own fault really. I took on way too many jobs this year

 

[Mr Googler]

Sorry to hear that Bruce.

Get towed over here and I’ll lend a hand :encouragement:

I’m going for a run Wednesday so should have a boost report for your other thread.

 

[BruceK]

Without the port outdrive on she'll sink! Save on matches I suppose.

I’m going for a run Wednesday so should have a boost report for your other thread.

Keep pouring that salt fella.

 

[Mr Googler]

Without the port outdrive on she'll sink! Save on matches I suppose.



Keep pouring that salt fella.

Sorry Bruce....I could be crying into my milk soon enough :nonchalance:

 

[moresparks]

Hi - I purchased the complete Power Trim Installation Kit for my SP-A Sterndrive.
Apologies if you already have the instructions that came with the kit but it may be worth repeating a couple of lines from them:

Install the pipes and the hoses on the hydraulic cylinders, prior to installing the cylinders in the transom shield. Do not tighten the connections.
Install the hoses on the transom shield using the nuts and washers.
Attach the hoses from the hydraulic pump.
Raise and lower the cylinders and check that the hoses and pipes are installed properly. Press the hoses against the starboard cylinder and tighten simultaneously the hose and pipe connections. Also tighten the connections of the port cylinder.

Once again apologies if you know this already.

 

[BruceK]

Thanks. That oprion is not easily available to me without removing one of the trim rams. Sounds easy enough but dismantling an engine to do it is one helluva job.

 

[BruceK]

3rd time lucky. What a dog of a job though.

 

[simonfraser]

glad you got it done, how much did you spend on rams ......

 

[BruceK]

All up? With VAT they are just over 500 a pop. I bought loads. I know, numpty here. In my defence even a call through to Volvo Tech via the supplier elicited a confession that they too have stripped many times. Not the greatest of designs to be honest, though apart from maybe having hardened inserts rather than the soft aluminium, I cant see a way to do it differently.

 

[CLB]

All up? With VAT they are just over 500 a pop. I bought loads. I know, numpty here. In my defence even a call through to Volvo Tech via the supplier elicited a confession that they too have stripped many times. Not the greatest of designs to be honest, though apart from maybe having hardened inserts rather than the soft aluminium, I cant see a way to do it differently.

Lots of aluminium castings do come from the factory with stainless helicoil inserts for just this reason.

 

[Kawasaki]

There is a Man who used to live just around the corner up your road
He now lives on West Shore Llandudno
Terry is now kinda semi retired but has moved His workshop (which was in His basement ) just up from You
70% of His gear is now in His new pad
He is semi retired now but what He doesn't know about threads/ helicoils etc you couldn't write on the side of your boat!
He is a biker and a boater too
Ace Bod old school etc
I will PM you his mobile
Don't tell him I said
I think I owe Him a tenner!

 

[BruceK]

Ha! You sent me too him after one of your octogenarian scouser mates ripped me off with a trailer for my tender. All was going fine and we were chatting amicably until I told him you had referred me. Then he hung up and blacklisted my number.

 

[Kawasaki]

Ha! You sent me too him after one of your octogenarian scouser mates ripped me off with a trailer for my tender. All was going fine and we were chatting amicably until I told him you had referred me. Then he hung up and blacklisted my number.

Thats a cross threaded thread drift
I will notify the Moderators

 

[QBhoy]

Bloody nightmare. Happened to me once.
Defo not an insert version ?

 

[BruceK]

Bloody nightmare. Happened to me once.
Defo not an insert version ?

No. I sent the damaged units to a hydraulics firm to have all (even good) threads retapped with hard inserts. I got a reply back from them that one of the damaged rams also had blown seals. Now the ram in question that had blown seals hadn't even made it to the point of having oil in as the cross thread happened on the 3rd line being threaded. They will replace the seals at a fraction of the cost of the seals you can buy on ebay so it's a no brainer and not worth the hassle of returning to the reseller. But it's worth noting that these rams are not of a very good standard to begin with. The hydraulics firm was less than complimentary and aghast at how much we pay for them. I say aghast, actually he burst out laughing in merriment. C'est la vie. Now that I am sorted I can see the funny side but had I been still struggling with the infernal things I might have stamped my foot and had a long whinge to the local Volvo peeps.

"Afternoon

After receiving these cylinders we stripped them down so we could re-tap the ports as requested. Once stripped we have found that the piston seals have been damaged for what reasons we don’t know. These pictures are from the cylinder which had no oil in.

We have just stripped the other one which did have oil in and the seals are perfect so I would personally leave them but it’s up to you.

Thanks
Billy "

 

[Assassin]

Several potential issues here Bruce.

You have aluminium rams according to your earlier comment, with steel or aluminium rams you can get the port assembly complete for under £5 for most types and you cut the old port off and weld the complete port on, but for aluminium you would ideally need TIG, so this is one option, and yes you can bet the ones threaded for a hard insert which you have to install in the port after it is welded to the ram and ideally tapped out before screwing in the insert.

Many cheaper rams are manufactured down to a price to maintain profitability and they fail to tap threads out after welding to save on time, which costs money; and many cheaper ram manufacturers are being used by more upmarket brands. Thermal transfer is an issue with aluminium and can readily distort the threads as the ports are welded on.