Took the mast down, top sheaves but no exit point?

[Tammany]

Took thee mast down today, few issues that I've got to look into.

First their are 4 sheaves, 2 either side at the top of the mast although they were not in use as the sails were hoisted with blocks. However their are no exit points down the bottom which is odd?
Second the spars are a very loose fit into the mast sockets, it all looks original and in good condition just it's a bit sloppy.
Third their is no grip on the end of the spars for the cap shroud, it's basically a stainless u piece that goes over the end and the wire goes inside although once gain a very loose fit. Shouldn't their be something to hold the wire?

It all looks in good order though and the rigging is good too, looks fairly new.

It's an old kemp rig from the 1970's

 

[johnalison]

I don't know about the exit points, which sounds odd, I agree, but having the cap shrouds loose on the crosstrees was quite common on small boats in the '70s, which is why so many of them can be seen sailing around with the crosstrees drooping. It would be worth looking for some more modern fittings.

 

[Boathook]

The halyards on my boat are external on the mast with 2 sheaves on the front and 2 on the back of the mast. The mast is a Kemp from the mid 70's.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Took thee mast down today, few issues that I've got to look into.

First their are 4 sheaves, 2 either side at the top of the mast although they were not in use as the sails were hoisted with blocks. However their are no exit points down the bottom which is odd?
Second the spars are a very loose fit into the mast sockets, it all looks original and in good condition just it's a bit sloppy.
Third their is no grip on the end of the spars for the cap shroud, it's basically a stainless u piece that goes over the end and the wire goes inside although once gain a very loose fit. Shouldn't their be something to hold the wire?

It all looks in good order though and the rigging is good too, looks fairly new.

It's an old kemp rig from the 1970's

Sounds about right for the boat. The lines let to the masthead will be externally routed. I'll see if i can get enough zoom to take a pic of mine.

 

[Tammany]

I'll take a few pics tomorrow. The mast head is a welded on affair and the sheaves are hidden inside. Do you think these have been added by someone? Don't know why they are their with no exits though.

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

I'll take a few pics tomorrow. The mast head is a welded on affair and the sheaves are hidden inside. Do you think these have been added by someone? Don't know why they are their with no exits though.

The "exits" are at the top of the mast!
The main halyard goes over the aft sheave and 'exits' over the foreward sheave on that side and then down to the winch on the mast lower section.
Likewise, the genoa halyard goes over the front sheave, over the aft sheave and down the mast.
They are external halyards; although they are continuously exposed to the elements they are always visible and you have no worries about internal chafe. As a courtesy to your neighbours keep them away from the mast when moored or berthed. A bit of bungee serves this purpose easily.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I'll take a few pics tomorrow. The mast head is a welded on affair and the sheaves are hidden inside. Do you think these have been added by someone? Don't know why they are their with no exits though.

Because the lines go up the outside of the mast and down the outside too. My main halyard goes from the sail, up the back of the mast, over a sheave, over another sheave at the front of the mast, down the front of the mast and back to a coachroof mounted winch (probably went to a mast moun ted winch originally). The jib halyard works in a similar way, from the head of the sail, through a block at the front of the mast, over a block at the back of the mast and down the back to a cleat on the side of the mast. I do have two further blocks which are mounted completely externally, one on the front and one on the back of the mast. Front one is for the spi halyard and rear one for the topping lift.

 

[Tammany]

Because the lines go up the outside of the mast and down the outside too. My main halyard goes from the sail, up the back of the mast, over a sheave, over another sheave at the front of the mast, down the front of the mast and back to a coachroof mounted winch (probably went to a mast moun ted winch originally). The jib halyard works in a similar way, from the head of the sail, through a block at the front of the mast, over a block at the back of the mast and down the back to a cleat on the side of the mast. I do have two further blocks which are mounted completely externally, one on the front and one on the back of the mast. Front one is for the spi halyard and rear one for the topping lift.

Hanging sheaves?? Perhaps the internal sheaves are for the same purpose to direct it through the mast from a hanging sheave? That would make sense.

The hanging ones are really old tufnol ones that I will replace with modern barton ones, what size do you think would be ideal? Jimmy greens info says ropes should be 8mm braid on braid for both genoa & main.

 

[Tammany]

Barton size 3's are for rope upto 10mm 385kgs load size 4's are 12mm rope 630kgs loading.

It sounds like the size 4's are ideal??

 

[Tammany]

Because the lines go up the outside of the mast and down the outside too. My main halyard goes from the sail, up the back of the mast, over a sheave, over another sheave at the front of the mast, down the front of the mast and back to a coachroof mounted winch (probably went to a mast moun ted winch originally). The jib halyard works in a similar way, from the head of the sail, through a block at the front of the mast, over a block at the back of the mast and down the back to a cleat on the side of the mast. I do have two further blocks which are mounted completely externally, one on the front and one on the back of the mast. Front one is for the spi halyard and rear one for the topping lift.

Do you have line guides at all on the outside of the mast. The genoa had a single guide half way, not sure if I like this as you can't tie it off to prevent banging halyards.

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

The block that is 'hanging free' in front of the mast head is usually for the spinnaker.
What you are calling a 'guide' half-way up the mast is probably for attaching a block for the spi-pole topping lift.
Photos might be useful.

 

[PaulRainbow]

The block that is 'hanging free' in front of the mast head is usually for the spinnaker.
What you are calling a 'guide' half-way up the mast is probably for attaching a block for the spi-pole topping lift.
Photos might be useful.

You're most likely right i reckon, i have a block fixed to the front of the mast, halfway up, which is the spi uphaul.

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

If you release the end caps from the 'spars' (spreaders) you many find nuts on the ends of the stainless loop that need tightening to nip the shroud to hold the spreader in place. Spreaders should bisect the angle through which the wire turns, so will point upwards. (I know that isn't geometrically correct, but it works as an explanation).

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

Y...which is the spi uphaul.

Yes, that is the proper term. Thanks.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Hanging sheaves?? Perhaps the internal sheaves are for the same purpose to direct it through the mast from a hanging sheave? That would make sense.

That's not how mine are. The four internal sheaves are for the main and jib halyards. Re-read #6 and #7.

The two that i have completely external are for the topping lift and spi halyard. Basically just blocks bolted to the front and rear of the mast. Halfway up the front of the mast is a block for the spi topping lift. No guides on any of the lines. I pull some lines forwards with a strop around them and the babystay and other lines to one side with a stop around them and a cap shroud.

As per posts #6 and #7, my jib halyard goes through the top of the mast, over the two internal sheaves and down the back of the mast. The main halyard does the opposite, up the back and down the front.

I couldn't get a photo of any use as it's too high up the mast.

 

[Tammany]

That's not how mine are. The four internal sheaves are for the main and jib halyards. Re-read #6 and #7.

The two that i have completely external are for the topping lift and spi halyard. Basically just blocks bolted to the front and rear of the mast. Halfway up the front of the mast is a block for the spi topping lift. No guides on any of the lines. I pull some lines forwards with a strop around them and the babystay and other lines to one side with a stop around them and a cap shroud.

As per posts #6 and #7, my jib halyard goes through the top of the mast, over the two internal sheaves and down the back of the mast. The main halyard does the opposite, up the back and down the front.

I couldn't get a photo of any use as it's too high up the mast.

Yep, I've got it now, think I missed post #6. All makes sense, my own fault for pulling the ropes before dropping the mast. The thing holding the rope is small like a 'u' clamp only bigger with a plastic bush inside. The genoa halyard went through it on it's way down to the winch/cleat. Sounds unneccessary so I'll leave it off so I can tie off at night. The spinnaker pole attachments are 2 large rings, one at the bottom on a silder to attach the pole and one further up to pull it up out the way & control it.

 

[Tammany]

If you release the end caps from the 'spars' (spreaders) you many find nuts on the ends of the stainless loop that need tightening to nip the shroud to hold the spreader in place. Spreaders should bisect the angle through which the wire turns, so will point upwards. (I know that isn't geometrically correct, but it works as an explanation).

Didn't have caps, just tape. Been reading and it seems some people hold them tight with seizing wire rather than just leaving them loose.

 

[Tammany]

I don't have a spinnaker attachment on deck so the pole is used for winging but it came with a nylon cruising chute that replaces the genoa in light airs. Bit of a pain to change but it works well. Plus a couple of storm sail sized ones. I'm mostly solo so a spinnaker doesn't really appeal anyways.

 

[PaulRainbow]

The thing holding the rope is small like a 'u' clamp only bigger with a plastic bush inside. The genoa halyard went through it on it's way down to the winch/cleat. Sounds unneccessary so I'll leave it off so I can tie off at night.

Sounds like a bullseye of some sort ? I'd also take it off.

 

[VicS]

The thing holding the rope is small like a 'u' clamp only bigger with a plastic bush inside. The genoa halyard went through it on it's way down to the winch/cleat. Sounds unneccessary so I'll leave it off so I can tie off at night. .

I cant think of a reason for there to be bullseye fairlead for the genoa halyard falling to the winch ........ but if its near the top and on the front of the mast it could be a halyard diverter if you have a genoa furling spar